Prospect Info: The Prospect Thread (Part XXXIV)

[Billy Kvcmu]

It's good time to be optimistic
It's good time to be a Canucks fan
The best part is that our prospect pool is very underrated thanks to the reputation of JB.
When are young players are ready to compete, we will caught every team by surprise.

 

[Paulinvancouver]

No matter what happens this season and next, the prospect pool looks sharp, the young kids on the team are growing, the team will get younger (Sedins? Maybe Edler? FA vets that were brought in to flip for assets at the deadline are skewing our age up) and we’re plyaing a style of play that’s incredibly fun to watch right now.

When JB started, he had the sedins who were recently signed and an untradeable block, and Ryan Kesler, wit his f***ing one team ultimatum and his agent screaming in Benning ear every day, that leaves our highest scoring tradeble asset from the 13-14 year as Chris Higgins. Plus he had an owner who resisted a rebuild tooth and nail and had fired the previous gm for suggesting the same, and he had a weak ass Trevor linden who couldn’t get management to buy in to the rebuild and keep the f*** out of the hockey side of the business, so he had to build for the future while remaining competitive at the same time, two completely incompatible goals.

Yes he has made mistakes. But he has been busy. Trader Jim has been working his ass off for this team. When you make a lot of moves, you will make a lot of mistakes, its the law of averages. None have really had any impact to us save perhaps the Eriksson deal.

It’s easy to play armchair NHL GM and point out his mistakes, but I think he’s done a damn fine job and I’ll say the same thing at the end of the season regardless of the final result.

I think this year you will see him trade one of bae and granny, and also try to move one of Stecher and Hutton. I think you will see him sell some fas at the deadline and acquire additional picks through the draft.

I think he will draft quite well if he’s still on this team and if by chance he is not, I think he will be selected for either the first, or second next gm Job that becomes available.

 

[WTG]

No matter what happens this season and next, the prospect pool looks sharp, the young kids on the team are growing, the team will get younger (Sedins? Maybe Edler? FA vets that were brought in to flip for assets at the deadline are skewing our age up) and we’re plyaing a style of play that’s incredibly fun to watch right now.

When JB started, he had the sedins who were recently signed and an untraceable block, and Ryan Kesler, wit his ****ing one team ultimatum and his agent screaming in Benning ear every day, that leaves our highest scoring traceable asset from the 13-14 year as Chris Higgins. Plus he had an owner who resisted a rebuild tooth and nail and had fired the previous gm for suggesting the same, and he had a weak ass Trevor linden who couldn’t get management to buy in to the rebuild and keep the **** out of the hockey side of the business, so he had to build for the future while remaining competitive at the same time, two completely incompatible goals.

Yes he has made mistakes. But he has been busy. Trader Jim has been working his ass off for this team. When you make a lot of moves, you will make a lot of mistakes, its the law of averages. None have really had any impact to us save perhaps the Eriksson deal.

It’s easy to play armchair NHL GM and point out his mistakes, but I think he’s done a damn fine job and I’ll say the same thing at the end of the season regardless of the final result.

I think this year you will see him trade one of bae and granny, and also try to move one of Stecher and Hutton. I think you will see him sell some fas at the deadline and acquire additional picks through the draft.

I think he will draft quite well if he’s still on this team and if by chance he is not, I think he will be selected for either the first, or second next gm Job that becomes available.

Benning drafted Virtanen over Nylander/Ehlers, Juolevi over Tkachuk (and even worse, Juolevi over bean, yuck )

Benning traded basically a promising 1st rounder in his draft + 3, plus a high 2nd for a bottom pairing defenseman

He's made huge blunders. Those blunders is what makes him a bad GM.

 

[Paulinvancouver]

Buffalo drafted Sam Reinhart. Calgary drafted Sam Bennet. Both could have had those two guys as well. It happens. Take a look through our history of first round draft picks. Even top 10 draft picks. We’re not better than 50%. Look. The jury has to be still out on all his picks. At the present, his other two top picks look like home runs.

That promising first rounder? That was a year and a half ago. It’s been a year and a half since he’s done a “huge blunder”.

Look at a team and ask... is it better or worse off for having a gm... ours is better. Despite the slow start.

Can you name 20 GMs who are measurably better than Benning?

Can you name 15?

I could probably name 10. But after that, it’s a large tier that I would think he belongs to.

 

[WTG]

Buffalo drafted Sam Reinhart. Calgary drafted Sam Bennet. Both could have had those two guys as well. It happens. Take a look through our history of first round draft picks. Even top 10 draft picks. We’re not better than 50%. Look. The jury has to be still out on all his picks. At the present, his other two top picks look like home runs.

That promising first rounder? That was a year and a half ago. It’s been a year and a half since he’s done a “huge blunder”.

Look at a team and ask... is it better or worse off for having a gm... ours is better. Despite the slow start.

Can you name 20 GMs who are measurably better than Benning?

Can you name 15?

I could probably name 10. But after that, it’s a large tier that I would think he belongs to.

Bob Murray - constructed the core of young defenseman in Anaheim, plus rakel, and managed to get Kesler for basically nothing.
Brad Treliving/Brendan Burke - Drafted Tkachuk and also managed to trade for a top pairing defenseman who is only 22 at the time. Fleeced the Bruins
Ron Francis - Constructed a great core of young players in Carolina
Stan Bowman - Pretty obvious
Jarmo Kekalainen - Yeah pretty obvious, look at the young talent he managed to get in the draft
Jim Nill - Average GM still would rank him ahead of Benning
Ken Holland - how many years in the playoffs?
Dale Tallon - Although his stock has gone down, he still got that chicago core
Chuck Fletcher - average GM
Marc Bergevin - pretty bad GM but I'd rank him above Benning
David Poile - One of the best
Ray Shero - Look at all the young stars in the New Jersey team, probably an average GM though
Glen Sather - Actually managed to get great players in later rounds like Bunevich, plus some of their young players are actually legit
Pierre Dorion - I don't think he's a good GM below average on this list for sure, but better then Benning
Ron Hextall - same as Dorion
Jim Rutherford - average GM blessed with a great core
Doug Wilson - not a good gm but above average
Doug Armstrong - below average but better then Benning
Steve Yzerman - good GM
Lou Lamoriello - below average but better then Benning
Brian MacLellan - same as Lou

Yotes GM is still too young to evaluate, same with Buffalo and LA. The only GMs I consider on par with Benning are Cheveldayoff and Sweeney and Snow.

 

[ChilliBilly]

Virtanen is now looking like an NHLer. And more physical than N and E, more skilled than Richie rich. Slower to develop, but may have been the BPA.

I still object to Juolevi, but only because, they probably could have savaged another GM and traded this pick. There were at least 5 if not 10 players available and they could have traded down, and probably scored a great return.

I get it; they were not high on Tkachuk. So it goes. But to go off the board and not get paid for it? Insane. Juolevi may turn out great, but they could have traded down an got him probably 4 - 5 picks later. Or got someone else as good. I was pissed at this pick.

However DimJim gets full credit for his later picks ... we seem to have a number of diamonds in the rough coming up.

 

[xtra]

Virtanen is now looking like an NHLer. And more physical than N and E, more skilled than Richie rich. Slower to develop, but may have been the BPA.

He's not a better hockey player than N and E,

I mean if physical is what you think makes a good player then you must think that Dorsett is a better NHL player than N AND E

 

[Shareefruck]

I'm sorry, what? How is that disingenuous. Lindros was the #1 overall pick and was absolutely the best player in the trade when it was made. He was traded for an absolute HAUL of players, prospects and picks.

That is the definition of a quality for quantity trade.

It's disingenuous because the whole reason that makes it clear and agreeable that the trade worked out and had a positive outcome had nothing to do with the quantity, and instead had to do with the misevaluation/unexpected outcome of the quality of the two largest individual pieces in the deal.

Even if you isolated those two pieces, Colorado would have won that trade, so obviously it's not a very relevant example.

 

[elitepete]

No matter what happens this season and next, the prospect pool looks sharp, the young kids on the team are growing, the team will get younger (Sedins? Maybe Edler? FA vets that were brought in to flip for assets at the deadline are skewing our age up) and we’re plyaing a style of play that’s incredibly fun to watch right now.

When JB started, he had the sedins who were recently signed and an untradeable block, and Ryan Kesler, wit his ****ing one team ultimatum and his agent screaming in Benning ear every day, that leaves our highest scoring tradeble asset from the 13-14 year as Chris Higgins. Plus he had an owner who resisted a rebuild tooth and nail and had fired the previous gm for suggesting the same, and he had a weak ass Trevor linden who couldn’t get management to buy in to the rebuild and keep the **** out of the hockey side of the business, so he had to build for the future while remaining competitive at the same time, two completely incompatible goals.

Yes he has made mistakes. But he has been busy. Trader Jim has been working his ass off for this team. When you make a lot of moves, you will make a lot of mistakes, its the law of averages. None have really had any impact to us save perhaps the Eriksson deal.

It’s easy to play armchair NHL GM and point out his mistakes, but I think he’s done a damn fine job and I’ll say the same thing at the end of the season regardless of the final result.

I think this year you will see him trade one of bae and granny, and also try to move one of Stecher and Hutton. I think you will see him sell some fas at the deadline and acquire additional picks through the draft.

I think he will draft quite well if he’s still on this team and if by chance he is not, I think he will be selected for either the first, or second next gm Job that becomes available.

benning sucks

 

[Southern_Canuck]

Fri Oct 27

Europe

Timra 1 Troja/Ljungby 0 (OT)
Dahlen 1 goal (4th) (scored OT winner)

NCAA

Michigan 4 Penn State 5 (OT)
Lockwood 1 goal (2nd), +1

Northeastern 3 UMass Lowell 1
Gaudette 3 goals (3rd, 4th, 5th), even

OHL

Windsor 7 Sudbury 2
DiPietro 24 saves on 26 shots
Candella 1 assist, even

Owen Sound 5 Kitchener 2
Gadjovich did not play

Peterborough 1 Oshawa 4
Brassard 1 assist, +2

WHL

Calgary 4 Lethbridge 5
Stukel 1 assist, +1

Tri-City 3 Kelowna 4 (OT)
Lind 0 points, even

S_C

 

[Master Radishes]

Hypothetical question directed at no one in particular and without any specific agenda:

Would you rather have a GM that 'whiffed' on first round picks (not necessarily busts but never reaching full potential/ending up having been the BPA) but found 'diamonds in the rough', or consistently picked the BPA in the first round but rarely converted later picks into NHL players?

 

[groov2]

Hypothetical question directed at no one in particular and without any specific agenda:

Would you rather have a GM that 'whiffed' on first round picks (not necessarily busts but never reaching full potential/ending up having been the BPA) but found 'diamonds in the rough', or consistently picked the BPA in the first round but rarely converted later picks into NHL players?

I suppose whatever gave me the most amount of good NHL players.

 

[Canucker]

Hypothetical question directed at no one in particular and without any specific agenda:

Would you rather have a GM that 'whiffed' on first round picks (not necessarily busts but never reaching full potential/ending up having been the BPA) but found 'diamonds in the rough', or consistently picked the BPA in the first round but rarely converted later picks into NHL players?

I would take either of those options over Benning.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Please. Can we keep the Benning discussion, both pro and con, out of the Prospects Thread. There's other places for that. I like to come here to read about how our prospects are doing.
Thanks

 

[nuckfan insk]

Actually, where the Canucks drafted in the first round doesn't have much to do with their prospect pool and that's what it makes it so intriguing...Gaudette (5th round); DiPietro (5th round) Lockwood (third round); Tryamkin (3rd round) Demko, Lind and Gadjovich (second round); Dahlen and Goldobin (trades)...even kids like Chatfield and Brisebois were the equivalent of late round picks.......so drafting in the top-10 really hasn't had a lot to do with the building of the prospect pool.

BriseBois was drafted 66th which isn’t a late round pick, DiPietro was 64th, in the 3rd round not 5th. Imagine though, just how many more picks could have been hit on and how much better the pool would be had we not traded so many picks away. Add Gustav Forsling to the list of good picks, even though Jimbo dumped him.

 

[Mudshark50]

Please. Can we keep the Benning discussion, both pro and con, out of the Prospects Thread. There's other places for that. I like to come here to read about how our prospects are doing.
Thanks

I agree.

I would take either of those options over Benning.

These types of posts (attempts at sardonic, critical management responses) are like baseball highlights on TV. There are no new great baseball highlights. You've seen them all, triple plays, off the noggin home runs, paint the corner....ugh, it's killed watching baseball for me. I actually hate baseball now and refer to it as 'paint drying' to my buds.

Not directed at you personally, Canucker, but the forum becomes unreadable with the same old, not so clever or funny anymore remarks about management. We have a dedicated thread for this chatter.

If it's an actual critique of a someones play on the ice, I find it worthy of reading. (pros and cons)

Sorry for the rant. I'll keep it to myself now and filter that stuff out when I come looking for Canuck updates on a Canuck forum.

 

[tradervik]

Nice to see Gaudette get a hat trick. I note all three goals came on the power play.

 

[drax0s]

It's disingenuous because the whole reason that makes it clear and agreeable that the trade worked out and had a positive outcome had nothing to do with the quantity, and instead had to do with the misevaluation/unexpected outcome of the quality of the two largest individual pieces in the deal.

Even if you isolated those two pieces, Colorado would have won that trade, so obviously it's not a very relevant example.

As often is the case, you're missing the point. Occasionally quality arises out of the quantity of unknown values. You're arguing from hindsight.

Anyways, this is if topic, so if you want to continue, pm me... Or not.

 

[MS]

Hypothetical question directed at no one in particular and without any specific agenda:

Would you rather have a GM that 'whiffed' on first round picks (not necessarily busts but never reaching full potential/ending up having been the BPA) but found 'diamonds in the rough', or consistently picked the BPA in the first round but rarely converted later picks into NHL players?

This question isn't grounded in reality because a) non-#1 picks are primarily the work of the scouting staff and b) a GM that can scout high picks but now lower picks isn't a thing.

 

[Gaunce4gm]

Back on topic...

Elias has another PP assist for Vaxjo in the SHL so far today

 

[Artorius Horus T]

TPS, Canucks prospects:

Petrus Palmu 6 goals 6 assists 12 points in 19 games (leads all rookies in goals,points)
Markus Nurmi 2 goals 4 assists 6 points in 18 games
Olli Juolevi 3 goals 2 assists 5 points in 7 games

All 3 of them are rookies,duh

 

[xtra]

Simple answer here. You take the GM that can draft the high first round picks because if Winnipeg tomorrow needed to get depth players to fill out their roster they can trade their stars for the third line players that most of these late round gems will become.

Now a question in return: would you do either of these trades:

Ehlers for granlund, sutter and dorsett

Or

Ehlers for gaudette brassard and Lockwood?

I know for sure I would

 

[Melvin]

Virtanen is now looking like an NHLer. And more physical than N and E, more skilled than Richie rich. Slower to develop, but may have been the BPA. \

*looks at calendar*

*still October*

 

[Scott Stevens]

I agree.



These types of posts (attempts at sardonic, critical management responses) are like baseball highlights on TV. There are no new great baseball highlights. You've seen them all, triple plays, off the noggin home runs, paint the corner....ugh, it's killed watching baseball for me. I actually hate baseball now and refer to it as 'paint drying' to my buds.

Not directed at you personally, Canucker, but the forum becomes unreadable with the same old, not so clever or funny anymore remarks about management. We have a dedicated thread for this chatter.

If it's an actual critique of a someones play on the ice, I find it worthy of reading. (pros and cons)

Sorry for the rant. I'll keep it to myself now and filter that stuff out when I come looking for Canuck updates on a Canuck forum.

I think your take on baseball is even with the off topic posts in here. Both garbage.

 

[vanarchy]

Can't find half the threads on prospects from last year. Was wondering how Glass is doing in comparison to our boy