The Panther
Registered User
Classic Todd Gill here, in February 1987 (this one play kind of sums up the 80s' Leafs):
The 1992-93 Toronto Maple Leafs
- Thread starter whcanuck
- Start date
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
"Giveaway" Gill was truly terrible. When Burns arrived, Gill suddenly became much tougher and he stopped trying to do too much and greatly simplified his game. However, as I stated before, as soon as he started finding some success, it all unravelled again because he started trying to play beyond his limitations. But for a short window right after Burns arrived - and he was paired with a solid defensive partner - he was a useful two-way defender for the Leafs.
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2007
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a question for the leafs fans—
i watched those leafs teams in the playoffs like anyone else but i didn’t follow them game in, game out or study them closely. were ellett and gill really good two way defenders in those two years, or did they each just look good with a macoun and lefebvre next to him?
i ask because i remember them both being horrendous defensively prior and after 93/94. like booed out of the gardens bad.
i kind of always assumed it was like bieksa: when he was paired with willie mitchell and dan hamhuis he looked great. don cherry was touting him for the olympic team. on his own, he was beyond awful defensively—a similar player to todd gill, actually, though i think a slightly richer man’s gill.
i watched those leafs teams in the playoffs like anyone else but i didn’t follow them game in, game out or study them closely. were ellett and gill really good two way defenders in those two years, or did they each just look good with a macoun and lefebvre next to him?
i ask because i remember them both being horrendous defensively prior and after 93/94. like booed out of the gardens bad.
i kind of always assumed it was like bieksa: when he was paired with willie mitchell and dan hamhuis he looked great. don cherry was touting him for the olympic team. on his own, he was beyond awful defensively—a similar player to todd gill, actually, though i think a slightly richer man’s gill.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Ellett was a much better player than Gill. He was better pretty much across the board except when it came to toughness. Ellett was considerably better defensively than Gill was, but that's more so and indictment of Gill's defensive work rather than praise for Ellett's.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
No doubt it would have been called too, if Kerry Fraser had seen it.
The funniest thing about this "missed call" is Leaf fans act like no other team has had calls go against them in important games. Somehow it's a conspiracy. It's silly. He didn't see it and didn't make the call. Tough break without a doubt, but it no way "cost them the series." The whole fantasy world where the Leafs automatically win if Gretzky gets the penalty is hilarious. The fact that this happened in Game Six is also kind of funny. Even if you want to pretend that it "cost the game" they still went out and lost Game 7 on home ice.
Pretending that because it was Gretzky it wasn't called, or because the league wanted LA in the Final it wasn't called or because Bettman didn't wan't two Canadian teams in the Final it wasn't called or any other of the silly conspiracy theories I've seen pitched about the missed call is ridiculous, IMO.
A lot of what you just said is ridiculous. It no way cost them the series? Umm, it’s game 6 in OT with a chance to move on. This isn’t game 1. Gretzky high sticks Gilmour and is not kicked out and then he scores the winner. That doesn’t happen if the correct call is made. We don’t know who would have won if they had given Gretzky the penalty.
As to whether Fraser saw it or not, I don’t know. That was just my guess, but there’s logic to it. I mean Gretzky has the puck, so you’d have to think Fraser is looking. Where else would he be looking? We will never know for sure what happened, so everyone has their own opinion on what happened. My opinion is that he saw it and decided not to call it. Could I be wrong? Sure, no doubt, but that’s what I believe happened.
Bad calls go against lots of teams, but how many teams have a call like that go against them with a trip to the finals on the line? Doesn’t happen all the time. As a Leafs fan at that time, I felt the team got screwed, and like it or not, a lot of Leafs fans still believe they got screwed.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Wayne Gretzky doesn't score the winner if the correct call is made, but the Maple Leafs don't magically win the game if the call is made either. The game goes on if the call is made and the winner is still a flip of the coin. This call in no way cost the Leafs the game or the series as the myth now claims.
You seem to have answered your own question, but don't want to follow your own logic.
Gretzky took the shot, seems pretty natural Fraser's eyes would go with the puck, that was then blocked by Macoun. Gilmour drifts in on the follow through and gets clipped.
In real time, even the play by play team doesn't see the high stick. They mistakenly think that Gilmour was hit by the shot. "The shot, that's blocked, and it hurt Gilmour. He stopped the shot, it hurt him, and he fell..."
You believe that Kerry Fraser saw it, but for some reason only you understand choose not to call it, and then he huddled with the all the other officials on the ice to determine what had happened and they all conspired together to not give the Maple Leafs a power play?
Really? That's what you believe?
Except "a trip to the Finals (sic)" wasn't on the line. Regardless of this call, the Maple Leafs still had a chance to win Game Six and still had a chance to win Game Seven and they failed at both of those things.
If this call is made, they don't suddenly go to the Final. This is a false equivalency that Leaf fans have been pitching for years, and it's a joke.
Personally I would of rather seen the capital of the universe vs MTL.
Either way though in `93 the good guys ended up winning
.
Either way though in `93 the good guys ended up winning
.
billybudd
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- Feb 1, 2012
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Point/goal totals in 93 are somewhat misleading. Impressive as those numbers look on paper, Gilmour and Andreychuk were 8th and 9th, respectively, in points and goals. Production came very easy to top-liners that year.
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2007
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am i remembering correctly that gill played bigger minutes and in more situations?
BraveCanadian
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- Jun 30, 2010
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The Leafs defensive strength was how well the 6 man unit played as a whole under Burns. Just like the rest of the team, they were greater than the sum of their parts.
I think Ellett and Gill and Mironov played more PP and Rouse, Macoun and Lefebvre played more PK but I don't remember any one of them standing out by a large amount from the others in importance. I think even by that time Lefebvre was being matched up, but it was a group effort.
That was a team that accepted their roles and got down to work.
