Olympics: State of USA Hockey after another disappointing Olympics (Merged)

[Model62]

Oy, now that was disappointing.

 

[magic school bus]

Too many scrub passengers on the team like Dustin Brown, David Backes, Ryan Kesler, Shattenkirk, Zach Parise etc.

God Zach Parise was useless. Patrick Kane was also an embarassment.

At least Kane was trying

 

[Sergei Shirokov]

As I said, roster navel gazing is useless. Bobby Ryan wouldn't have made a lick of difference. The US was dominated by Canada and too devastated to put up a fight against Finland. Roster selection would not have changed anything. They beat Russia, but then the best team in the world ended their tournament.

Ya well, as fans, like any sports fans, they have the right to feel unhappy, with the talent they have (they are still one of the big 4) they should be able to put together a better performence.

 

[Tawnos]

What was disappointing about the 2010 Olympics? The 2002 Olympics? I don't get the "another" comment. When the field is as even as this, getting the chance to medal is the opposite of disappointing, to me. They didn't, and such is life, but I'm not disappointed with this year either. Russia, Czechs and Slovaks? Yeah... disappointment. Not with making it to the semis.

 

[McDonald19]

As I said, roster navel gazing is useless. Bobby Ryan wouldn't have made a lick of difference. The US was dominated by Canada and too devastated to put up a fight against Finland. Roster selection would not have changed anything. They beat Russia, but then the best team in the world ended their tournament.

Bobby Ryan is the type of player who can create offense on his own in 5 on 5 situations. He might have made a difference.

 

[K2MyEverest]

OMG, stop with the gloating Canadians... I feel ashamed being Canadians of some of the posts I see in this thread. If you really think USA have no depth or can't even acknowledge all the Young USA players developping right now, go away. You don't know **** about hockey then...

Sorry americans posters, I hope you don't believe we "Canadians" are not all self oriented ****** like I've seen in this thread...

 

[Chief]

Losing to Canada 1-0 was nothing to be ashamed about. The better team won a close game. I can accept that. But getting blown out by Finland is an embarrassment.

Eddie Olczyk was on with Mike Francessa on WFAN in NY the day prior to the game with Canada. Eddie has been a player and coach in international competitions and he said that the US wanted to beat Canada in the worst way because they still feel like they don't get proper respect from the Canadians. After Friday's loss, I expected team USA to start slow in the Bronze Medal game because the loss the day before was emotionally draining...but Finland was in the same boat. In a lot of ways there's a similar relationship between Finland and Sweden as between the US and Canada.

The fact that the US failed to show up at all today is an embarrassment. I don't know how else to put it.

 

[FlyerFire]

well I havent seen too many posts where Finland is rubbing it in

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

Bobby Ryan is the type of player who can create offense on his own in 5 on 5 situations. He might have made a difference.

Bobby Ryan went cold after the Olympic announcement (which now they're saying he actually has been playing with a sprained groin for a month plus). However, before the selection, he was a beast. He was one of Ottawa's best players and clutch when we needed him.

It was baffling to Senator fans that he didn't make it, we all thought it was a forgone conclusion. As some of said, looks like the GMs made their picks in the summer and paid no attention to how guys like him and Okposo were doing during the season.

 

[HockeyGuy1975]

Based on my experience as a USA hockey coach at the youth level, I have no doubt that the US will keep getting better and better and will eventually overtake Canada. In the last few years USA Hockey has invested a ton of money in seeking out the best data/information/science on how to develop young players. The progressive thinking that lead to these investments and implementation models has been a welcome change and will bear fruit in the long run.

The problem at the senior/NHL level is that guys like Burke (and Blysma as a coach) are too conservative to adapt to what USA hockey is doing at the youth level. They don't like change and prefer to stick to 90's winning formulas, like grinders upfront and "steady" dmen in the back.

A perfect example of the Burke/Blysma thinking is in the Burnside ESPN article. Lombardi presented a case study for including Yandle and he was laughed at by Burke. Sure, the ribbing was in good fun, but it also is indicative of the kind conservative mind Burke has.

Did Lombardi's report get Yandle on the team? No, Burke and the others won the argument without ever putting much value on Lombardi's thinking. Blysma's conservative mentality brought us Orpik instead of JJ or Yandle. Burke's conservative mentality brought us "heart and soul" players like Brown instead of Ryan.

I place 100% of the poor showing on Blysma/Burke/Poile (perhaps Shero).

One last note... I read Burnside's last article on ESPN where he says anyone who thinks that team selection cost the US a medal is a fool. Burnside is simply trying to defend the guys who gave him access for months and then he pissed off with his reporting on "intense."

 

[ScottyBowman]

Not worried at all about USA hockey. It will get better and better. Just look at the NHL draft picks. The problem is that Team USA hired an idiot as the coach. Blysma is a complete disaster. He fell into the Stanley cup in 2009 because Datysuk, Lidstrom, Zetterberg, Franzen, etc... were all injured.

 

[illpucks]

In hindsight, Burke's comments on Ryan

"He can't spell intense" http://www.thestar.com/sports/sochi...ans_exclusion_from_us_team_sparks_debate.html

When it mattered, none of the US forwards could spell intense except Oshie. So was not selecting Ryan a mistake in hindsight? And how does Burke look singling out a player like Ryan, when the group of players he selected could not perform under pressure?

 

[Bjorn Le]

Burke's comments were taken out of context. He didn't go to the media with those comments and you don't know what he said about other players.

 

[Sonic Disturbance]

Firstly, it was reported that Burke was one of the few who actually put Ryan on his final roster. Secondly, what is Ryan going to offer that other forwards can't? He's got a good shot, great hands but is very slow and is known to look lethargic. He had an awful 2012-2013 and is having a pretty mediocre season this year as well, having only 7 points in 17 games following his omission. Also, Oshie wasn't the only forward that showed up - he wasn't even that good against Canada. Up front, Kesler and Callahan were pretty good. Also, I don't think the USA underachieved, they actually played very well overall in the tournament, they just got beat by a better team with a roster that is more stacked.

Weber - Keith
Doughty - Vlasic
Pietrangelo - Bouwmeester

Price

Not many teams are going to score on that defense.

 

[Sonic Disturbance]

If anything, maybe taking so many inexperienced young defenseman + Orpik was the wrong move and they should've taken a steady shutdown veteran guy who could skate like Erik Johnson instead or a speedy guy who could spark an offense like Yandle.

 

[aloonda*]

the character and effort level in the last two games was disgusting

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Bobby Ryan is exactly the type of player USA needed against Canada. Tight game with very minimal room to maneuver.

 

[HockeyGuy1975]

Most people placing the blame on Burke/Poile are not focusing solely on Ryan. It's irrelevant whether Burke had Ryan on his final roster or his comments were taken out of context. People are mad because of the good ole boy culture and "truculent" nonsense he brings with him and the power is sways with it. Blysma is the same. They are perfect together. Would love to see Burke hire Blysma after the Pens fire Blysma after another poor playoff showing.

I hope Gaudreau holds out and signs with another team because Burke will ruin the kid. Maybe trade him to Toronto for that American star prospect Biggs.

 

[Samuel Culper III]

If anything, maybe taking so many inexperienced young defenseman + Orpik was the wrong move and they should've taken a steady shutdown veteran guy who could skate like Erik Johnson instead or a speedy guy who could spark an offense like Yandle.

This, among other things, I think is true. Erik Johnson and Keith Yandle should have been there, over Orpik and Fowler, IMO. But personnel wasn't the key issue. The team got by on individual talent against easier competition but when they ran up against tougher teams, they seemed unable to come together with any kind of gel. It also seemed like there was absolutely no real leadership, from the players or from Bylsma. I think Bylsma actually did a very poor job. He didn't have to do much coaching in the early games and then he didn't seem to do much coaching in the elimination games. I think guys like Backes going out and laying hits or Callahan going out and blocking shots sends a good message, but that kind of non-verbal leadership doesn't cut the mustard for me. I don't know what was going on in the room, obviously, but it didn't seem like anyone stepped up and took accountability/gave his teammates some.

 

[redgrant]

I dont get why this is a disappointing Olympics for the US? If they were on the otherside of the bracket I honestly believe it would be a Canada US final again. Is being a top 2 team in the world not something to be proud of?

 

[Nash]

I don't like Orpik on the team, but pointing blame at him in today's loss is stupid. It was Suter and McDonagh on the ice for the first two goals against and they made bad reads on both goals. Suter was on for a third PP goal against as well. The star players did not show up. Blaming the depth guys is ridiculous.

 

[ECanuck]

How things change so fast. US looked great until the 1-0 loss to Canada.

They didn't show up for the Bronze medal game which is disappointing.

Otherwise, the sky is not falling.

 

[Caje]

Burke's comments were taken out of context. He didn't go to the media with those comments and you don't know what he said about other players.

They were absolutely not taken out of context. He said it with a journalist in the same room who had all-access and could print whatever he wanted. It was a ridiculous, boneheaded comment and he rightfully apologized for it.

It was a joke that Blake Wheeler got selected over Bobby Ryan. I'd much rather have Ryan as an extra forward over Wheeler, especially when the US needed to score some goals. I doubt it would've changed what happened, but that was a stupid decision.

 

[Mehar]

How things change so fast. US looked great until the 1-0 loss to Canada.

They didn't show up for the Bronze medal game which is disappointing.

Otherwise, the sky is not falling.

Agree. I honestly believe the Americans did not care about the Bronze Medal Game, just like Canada sleepwalked in the Bronze Medal Game in 1998. Sky is not falling. If the US met Sweden or Finns in the Semis instead of Canada, they would have beaten them and faced Canada in the final. This same US team crushed Finland in the Semis in 2010. They looked disinterested and passive. It happens. US was the second best team in the tournament, after Canada beats Sweden tomorrow. It happens. The US will be back in the future.

 

[HockeyGuy1975]

Once and for all… US posters upset with Burke, etc, are not basing it because we didn't win the gold. It is how we played, how the selections were made (based on what we know), and who was selected. The USA has a great pool of players. Of course we won games and played well at times. The same guys could have won games without any coach behind the bench and playing it beer league style.