Stars Prospects

[Starsdude]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson). This also neglects Lindgren, Neal and a host of effort guys. I admit they lack top end guys but so do most teams while Jokinin and Erikkson Polak Lindgren and Neal could all play in atop6 at some point potentially. WHat is the criteria to reward depth at HF ? Just curious because teams like Van, Cal , NJ Tor and Ott seem to have less players who have achance at NHL success.

I am curious how non stars fans feel about their prospect list

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[Stealth JD]

every team has a pool of 3rd pairing d-men and 3rd and 4th line energy/aggitators. It's the top-end talent which separates the classes: top-, middle- and bottom- thirds...

Many of the teams between 21 and 30 are interchangable as far as their ranking is concerned....likewise 11 through 20 are difficult to differentiate. But the number of elite and upper echelon prospects is what earns a club their lofty rankings...

 

[Slats432]

When was the last time the Stars had an impact player show up in their line up that they drafted/developed?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/teams/dr000233.html

Not pretty, and says alot.

Now look over the farm team over the last few years and see how many players that look to make a future impact? How many did make an impact?

How many prospects in the last 5 years on the Stars would you have traded Phaneuf or Jeff Carter or Toivonen or Seabrook for?

So in closing...No top end prospects. No depth. No prospects in all positions ready to make the jump.

They churn out some Euros because they probably have a kick *** Euro scout...(Especially Finland)...so maybe they should make him in charge of all scouting because outside of Finland the Stars can't seem to find anything.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson). This also neglects Lindgren, Neal and a host of effort guys. I admit they lack top end guys but so do most teams while Jokinin and Erikkson Polak Lindgren and Neal could all play in atop6 at some point potentially. WHat is the criteria to reward depth at HF ? Just curious because teams like Van, Cal , NJ Tor and Ott seem to have less players who have achance at NHL success.

I am curious how non stars fans feel about their prospect list

That's all you have to show for three years of prospect development? That's the question most non-Stars fans are probably asking themselves. There hasn't been much in the cupboard, and frankly I don't see a whole lot on the horizon. There's some nice players, but they better develop into frontliners before the Stars as an organization gets more respect.

 

[BuppY]

A lot of depth but not 1st pairing or 1st line talent.

 

[leafaholix*]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson). This also neglects Lindgren, Neal and a host of effort guys. I admit they lack top end guys but so do most teams while Jokinin and Erikkson Polak Lindgren and Neal could all play in atop6 at some point potentially. WHat is the criteria to reward depth at HF ? Just curious because teams like Van, Cal , NJ Tor and Ott seem to have less players who have achance at NHL success.

I am curious how non stars fans feel about their prospect list

Toronto has less players who have a chance at NHL success?

Alexander Steen
Kyle Wellwood
Matt Stajan
Mikael Tellqvist (backup)
Ian White (should be the #5 this season)
Carlo Colaiacovo (should be a top 4 this season)
Staffan Kronwall (depth)

not counting players that had a stint in the nhl last season:

Jay Harrison
Andy Wozniewski
Jeremy Williams
Brendan Bell
Ben Ondrus
Aleksander Suglobov

As well as very good performances by these players in their respective levels:

Justin Pogge (MVP of the CHL)
Dmitri Vorobiev (top defenseman for his team in Russian Elite League)
Phil Oreskovic (top defensive defenseman in OHL)
Anton Stralman (very good young Swede defenseman, played with senior national team at 19)
Chad Rau (great rookie season in NCAA)
Robbie Earl (extremely talented offensive player from NCAA)

Then you have the departed prospects:

Max Kondratiev
Jarkko Immonen

 

[Dr Quincy]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson).

I don't know if that is bottom 5 material or not, and I like Jussi Jokinen, but really that isn't all that great for a 3 year period.

I'd say a lot of teams have produced 3 or more regular Fs and 1 regular D in 3 years. Also I think a lot of teams can boast a deep pool of 4/5 defense prospects. I'm also willing to bet that of the 5 guys you mention as 4/5 dmen, only 2 of them will ever play consistent NHL minutes. Dallas has been a winning team, so they've picked low. I don't think they should be embarrassed about their prospect development, but other than Jokinen I don't see a lot to crow about either.

 

[Baisleyens]

I actually think that Vishnevsky is a good pick up for them

 

[Dr GLU]

They churn out some Euros because they probably have a kick *** Euro scout...(Especially Finland)...so maybe they should make him in charge of all scouting because outside of Finland the Stars can't seem to find anything.

He's already the Stars' director of European scouting, which means he'd be responsible for the Swedish contingent the Stars have too.

 

[Seph]

They churn out some Euros because they probably have a kick *** Euro scout...(Especially Finland)...so maybe they should make him in charge of all scouting because outside of Finland the Stars can't seem to find anything.

You just described exactly what the Islanders did:

Of the first three players drafted each year by the Islanders for the past five years, 10 of them have been European, and 22 of the total 46 players, as well.

Less than a week ago, we made our Chief European scout Assistant GM and Director of Ameteur Scouting:
http://newyorkislanders.com/pressbox/archive.asp?id=982

I'm just shocked we didn't give the job to PA announcer.

 

[Lars]

I think Dallas has a good bunch of underratted prospects... But not enough depth to really bring them out from the bottom.

Perttu Lindgren, My Favorite Stars prospect, Becuase im still amazed at the amount of people who still dont know anyhting about this guy. Scoring 37 points in a rookie year, in a finnish league that greatly favours Veterans over unproven talent is very impressive.

Loui Eriksson is another good finnish prospects, who should develop into a fine top 6 player in the future.

And then theres a whole bunch of underrratted guys in Polaek, Fistric, Fransson


I dont know much about Niskanen, or Vishnevski however


OVerall they are definately an underratted group of propsects, but nothing that should be higher than top 20...

 

[Abyss]

I think Dallas has a good bunch of underratted prospects... But not enough depth to really bring them out from the bottom.

Perttu Lindgren, My Favorite Stars prospect, Becuase im still amazed at the amount of people who still dont know anyhting about this guy. Scoring 37 points in a rookie year, in a finnish league that greatly favours Veterans over unproven talent is very impressive.

Loui Eriksson is another good finnish prospects, who should develop into a fine top 6 player in the future.

And then theres a whole bunch of underrratted guys in Polaek, Fistric, Fransson


I dont know much about Niskanen, or Vishnevski however


OVerall they are definately an underratted group of propsects, but nothing that should be higher than top 20...

they may be underated, but the point is none of them can be considered top end prospects right now

 

[Chaos]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson). This also neglects Lindgren, Neal and a host of effort guys. I admit they lack top end guys but so do most teams while Jokinin and Erikkson Polak Lindgren and Neal could all play in atop6 at some point potentially. WHat is the criteria to reward depth at HF ? Just curious because teams like Van, Cal , NJ Tor and Ott seem to have less players who have achance at NHL success.

I am curious how non stars fans feel about their prospect list

As a Stars fan, thats not all that impressive as a list. Because the Stars have had a pretty good regular season record every season for a while now, they have been picking late all the time. That combined with their refusal to pick high talent guys who dropped due to 'character' issues(like Schremp, Wolski, and O'Sullivan to name a few) is why they don't get talked about. You aren't likely to get top end NHLers picking late(yes, there are exceptions). The fact that recently, many of their top prospects have been mid to late round picks(Kapanen, Jokinen, Miettinen, Lindgren, and to a lesser extent Daley and Eriksson) is another reason. Late round picks generally don't get hyped all that much, unless they are picked by one of the "popular" teams on these boards. As an example(not trying to pick on Red Wing fans, because it wasn't just them), remember the insane hype Grigorenko got after the 02-03 season? Now imagine the hype a guy like Lindgren would be getting right now if he were drafted by Detroit(or any of the 'popular' HF teams).

 

[Chaos]

they may be underated, but the point is none of them can be considered top end prospects right now

IMO Lindgren should. He's just 3 months older than the 4th overall pick in the most recent draft, yet outscored him by 10 points(yes, I know its different leagues).

 

[Lars]

they may be underated, but the point is none of them can be considered top end prospects right now

I didn't know sub 20 was top end talent?

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

they may be underated, but the point is none of them can be considered top end prospects right now

Detroit is ranked 14th by Hockeysfuture in organization ratings ... and IMO, they don't really have any top-end prospects.
Grigorenko is 23 and may never play in North America. Hudler has a lot of question marks.
Filppula and Howard are our best prospects, along with Kind (who's still young and needs to develop his talent).
But I don't see how Detroit is 14th and Dallas is 29th.

Lindgren is probably the best prospect from either organization

 

[Abyss]

Detroit is ranked 14th by Hockeysfuture in organization ratings ... and IMO, they don't really have any top-end prospects.
Grigorenko is 23 and may never play in North America. Hudler has a lot of question marks.
Filppula and Howard are our best prospects, along with Kind (who's still young and needs to develop his talent).
But I don't see how Detroit is 14th and Dallas is 29th.

Lindgren is probably the best prospect from either organization

I'm a huge fan of Lindgren, as he obviously had quite an incredible season. As for Detroit, I think the main reason they may have been so high is Kronwall? And Howard? Not sure though.

Lindgren appears to have the skills, I'd just rather wait and see what he can do in the AHL/NHL first.

Besides Lindgren, I'm quite interested to see how James Neal can progress and what his potential could become..

 

[Karamazov]

Detroit is ranked 14th by Hockeysfuture in organization ratings ... and IMO, they don't really have any top-end prospects.
Grigorenko is 23 and may never play in North America. Hudler has a lot of question marks.
Filppula and Howard are our best prospects, along with Kind (who's still young and needs to develop his talent).
But I don't see how Detroit is 14th and Dallas is 29th.

Lindgren is probably the best prospect from either organization

I can't come close to agreeing with you there. Kronwall can still be considered a prospect, and I don't need to explain his blue chip. Hudler was one of the best players (arguably the best forward) in the AHL. Filppula seems can't miss with his complete game and good offensive abilities. Meanwhile Grigorenko is developing again in the second best league in the world(can't forget his MVP in the WJCs - he was a monster and his hype was warranted). Howard is coming along, and Kindl is turning heads in the OHL. If I wanted to go further down the list and with more detail I'd have a book on my hands. Let's agree to disagree. Anyhow I think the Stars are underrated but not on Detroit's level...

 

[Phenomenon]

Maybe a little OT, but Lindgren played yesterday in an exhbition game in Finland as Ilves's no 1 center. Ilves won JYP 3-2 and Perttu scored two goals (including GWG). Representative of Ilves said that Stars has agreed with them that Perttu is allowed to play with Ilves in every possible exhibition game before the training camp.

 

[ReLyT]

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/teams/dr000233.html

Wow thats pretty bad...

 

[Leafs 67 and Waiting]

I'm a huge fan of Lindgren, as he obviously had quite an incredible season. As for Detroit, I think the main reason they may have been so high is Kronwall? And Howard? Not sure though.

Lindgren appears to have the skills, I'd just rather wait and see what he can do in the AHL/NHL first.

Besides Lindgren, I'm quite interested to see how James Neal can progress and what his potential could become..

Neal is very interesting. I think he is one of those guys that not to many people talk about. He is 6'4 and weighed in at 201lbs at the Team Canada World Jr Camp and was very impressive in every game. He hit Steve Downie so hard that he did not play in the final game of the camp. He has good hands as well scored a goal in game two. And one two shootouts in the camp scrimages. Neal is going to be a good one me thinks

 

[oil slick]

I have been around these boards for 3 years and in that time Dallas has consistently lurked in the bottom 5 in prospects according to HF. Also in that time, They have developed a rookie who has put up 55 points(Jokinin), a vital third liner who put up 30 points, was the Finnish MVP (Miettinen), a fourth line agaitator(ott), a top 4 D-man in terms of regular season minutes (Daley). This year , I suspect they will add a back-up goalie(Smith or Ellis), a by season end a scoring winger (Erikkson/Polak). They have a deep pool of defenseman with 4/5 who could be NHL players within 3 years (Niskanen, Scalzo, Khomitski, Grossman, Fransson). This also neglects Lindgren, Neal and a host of effort guys. I admit they lack top end guys but so do most teams while Jokinin and Erikkson Polak Lindgren and Neal could all play in atop6 at some point potentially. WHat is the criteria to reward depth at HF ? Just curious because teams like Van, Cal , NJ Tor and Ott seem to have less players who have achance at NHL success.

I am curious how non stars fans feel about their prospect list

It's not that Jokinen, Miettinen, Ott, and Daley are terrible, but the truth is most teams have brought in at least this quality of players over the last three years. I don't think Edmonton has done anything really spectacular over the past 3 years, but I personally would take Hemsky, Stoll, Torres, and Greene over Jokinen, Miettinen, Ott, and Daley...

 

[Robertsson 4-ever]

Loui Eriksson is another good finnish prospects, who should develop into a fine top 6 player in the future.

True, but Eriksson is from Sweden