Prospect Info: St. Louis Blues Top-20 Prospects: Where Should Logan Brown Go?

[Blueston]

And that's my point. If we are swayed by irrational exuberance based on reports of games we didn't see, then we collectively aren't exactly the best equipped to be evaluating these prospects.

Well, yes. Is that a surprise?

Thankfully our rankings aren’t what club is using to make roster decisions.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Well, yes. Is that a surprise?

Thankfully our rankings aren’t what club is using to make roster decisions.

Zackly! Saul Funman!

 

[Reality Czech]

So what's going to happen with Brown? I haven't been able to watch the preseason games, but sounds like he's been underwhelming in his short time here. The Blues aren't the kind of team to just hand a guy a roster spot, so what are the chances he makes the team? I suppose Kostin's injury would increase his chances, but I can't see a role for him on the big club unless he can find another gear or commit to more of a 2-way game.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I honestly see Neighbors as having a better shot of making the opening night roster instead of Brown. Unless they are sending down Clifford and MacMac, I don't see Brown making the team even as an extra forward.

 

[Celtic Note]

For the sake of transparency here is where I am at and where I would see Brown at that point in time:

The Blues 2020 - 2021 Top-20 Prospect List:
1) Scott Perunovich
2) Joel Hofer
3) Simon Robertsson
4) Zachary Bolduc
5) Jake Neighbours
6) Colten Ellis
7) Klim Kostin
8) Logan Brown
9) Nikita Alexandrov
10) Vadim Zherenko

 

[stl76]

Brown has been a washout, so far. It will take a lot of work and a big change of attitude for him to become a solid NHLer. I think we are doing Robertsson and Alexandrov a great disservice by not giving enough weight to their innate hockey skills and the related upside potential, and thinking that a player who is big, but has the bad habit of playing small and staying out of the play, and not skating very well, and not having very good hockey instincts, will have an easier path to being an NHL regular. Furthermore, one of Hofer or Ellis will likely make more impact on The NHL than Brown (we just don't know yet which one it will be because goalies mature much later than forwards). I give reasonably high-level perceived upside more weight than closeness to NHL-level play. Based on Brown's play in this season's pre-season games, I'd say it is possible that he NEVER gets much closer to being NHL-ready. He's got to have a complete attitude overhaul, and needs to really want badly to cooperate with his coaches, and work the hardest he's ever had to in his life. Some players are dedicated, and do what they need to. Many others don't. On the other hand, Robertsson shows a lot of promise, and doesn't seem to have roadblocks out of the normal pattern of improving with experience. Alexandrov looks like he's a little less likely than Robertsson to make it. But, I'm fairly confident both will be regular NHL players. Brown seems to have quite a bit of bust potential. IF everything goes right, with his size and improved skating, and a willingness to enter the physical game, play the 200 foot game, and do what's required of a forward in The Blues' system, he could become a valuable NHL player. But, based on how he has behaved in the past, I think his bust potential is significantly higher than his boom potential. I'd put him no higher than 8th or 9th.

With all due respect Robb, I'm a little confused by this post. It seems like you are at least in part evaluating Brown's performance and attitude based on preseason games, but you said the hawks thread that you haven't been able to see any preseason games. Apologies if I am misunderstanding what you're trying to say, not trying to make any accusations here, just confused at how hard we are being on Brown. I don't think it's fair to be questioning his attitude and work ethic yet.

Brown has been part of the organization for like 8 days and has played in 2 preseason games so far (1 against Columbus and 1 against Chicago). FWIW I only got to see Brown in one of the games against Chicago and thought he absolutely looked like a legit NHLer. Generated several grade A scoring chances and almost scored on a turnover he helped generate. Hell, he even made Kyle Clifford look like an offensive threat lol. Brown has a ways to go the make the final roster, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if he earns a spot.

I don't think Brown needs to be an overly physical or fast skating player to be an effective NHLer. If he can be harder on his stick and learn to use his size to defend the puck/maintain possession better then I think he can be a really useful player for us - two things that are very coachable and learnable. He undoubtedly has the talent. It's up to Brown if he can put it all together.

So what's going to happen with Brown? I haven't been able to watch the preseason games, but sounds like he's been underwhelming in his short time here. The Blues aren't the kind of team to just hand a guy a roster spot, so what are the chances he makes the team? I suppose Kostin's injury would increase his chances, but I can't see a role for him on the big club unless he can find another gear or commit to more of a 2-way game.

I think the concerns on his attitude and effort are being greatly overblown. Frankly, his skating/stride just looks awkward, which may be contributing to how his game is perceived. I haven't seen enough of his defensive game to have a truly informed opinion on it, but it is clear that Brown is a very gifted passer and dangerous with the puck on his stick in the o-zone.

 

[Robb_K]

With all due respect Robb, I'm a little confused by this post. It seems like you are at least in part evaluating Brown's performance and attitude based on preseason games, but you said the hawks thread that you haven't been able to see any preseason games. Apologies if I am misunderstanding what you're trying to say, not trying to make any accusations here, just confused at how hard we are being on Brown. I don't think it's fair to be questioning his attitude and work ethic yet.

Brown has been part of the organization for like 8 days and has played in 2 preseason games so far (1 against Columbus and 1 against Chicago). FWIW I only got to see Brown in one of the games against Chicago and thought he absolutely looked like a legit NHLer. Generated several grade A scoring chances and almost scored on a turnover he helped generate. Hell, he even made Kyle Clifford look like an offensive threat lol. Brown has a ways to go the make the final roster, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if he earns a spot.

I don't think Brown needs to be an overly physical or fast skating player to be an effective NHLer. If he can be harder on his stick and learn to use his size to defend the puck/maintain possession better then I think he can be a really useful player for us - two things that are very coachable and learnable. He undoubtedly has the talent. It's up to Brown if he can put it all together.


I think the concerns on his attitude and effort are being greatly overblown. Frankly, his skating/stride just looks awkward, which may be contributing to how his game is perceived. I haven't seen enough of his defensive game to have a truly informed opinion on it, but it is clear that Brown is a very gifted passer and dangerous with the puck on his stick in the o-zone.

I haven't seen any of the pre-season games. I was just basing my comments on what the other posters ,who did watch the games, said about him, and what the Sens fans wrote about him. No one on those posts countered the points those posters made. In looking at my post again, I see that I was stating that as if it was fact. I rather should have couched it in the form: "Based on everything I've read about him recently, I'd guess that he'll need to commit to playing a more physical game, going to the hard places, and playing the 200 ft game, as well as working more on his skating(especially acceleration). IF he does a good job of improving his game in those areas, he WILL be in The NHL before Robertsson and Alexandrov. But, personally, I value the potential most likely long-term value of prospects at their position, more than prospects being closer to getting into The NHL at the latter's likely peak of development. So, I'd still bet on Robertsson and Alexandrov being more valuable to The Blues long term based on their current development trajectories, than the gamble that Brown might or might not make those improvements in his game."

I hope your faith in Brown making those improvement in his game is born out fairly soon, so he can help The Blues this season.

 

[stl76]

I haven't seen any of the pre-season games. I was just basing my comments on what the other posters ,who did watch the games, said about him, and what the Sens fans wrote about him. No one on those posts countered the points those posters made. In looking at my post again, I see that I was stating that as if it was fact. I rather should have couched it in the form: "Based on everything I've read about him recently, I'd guess that he'll need to commit to playing a more physical game, going to the hard places, and playing the 200 ft game, as well as working more on his skating(especially acceleration). IF he does a good job of improving his game in those areas, he WILL be in The NHL before Robertsson and Alexandrov. But, personally, I value the potential most likely long-term value of prospects at their position, more than prospects being closer to getting into The NHL at the latter's likely peak of development. So, I'd still bet on Robertsson and Alexandrov being more valuable to The Blues long term based on their current development trajectories, than the gamble that Brown might or might not make those improvements in his game."

I hope your faith in Brown making those improvement in his game is born out fairly soon, so he can help The Blues this season.

Fair enough, appreciate the clarification. I think it was the following that I maybe misread as being a firsthand report or a more specific critique from watching him play:

"Based on Brown's play in this season's pre-season games, I'd say it is possible that he NEVER gets much closer to being NHL-ready. He's got to have a complete attitude overhaul, and needs to really want badly to cooperate with his coaches, and work the hardest he's ever had to in his life."

I thought it was a pretty stinging indictment, especially the part about needing a complete attitude overhaul. But re-reading it now, I can see how you might have meant it in a more general way. Alas, this type of misunderstanding will happen on the internet. Thanks again for taking the time to explain it. Sorry if my post came off accusatory, I was just genuinely surprised reading your original post.

As far as the comparison to Robertsson and Alexandrov, I admit to being biased towards valuing prospects that are closer to NHL ready. I see it as less risky. I can't really comment on Robertsson because I have only seen highlights and read reports about him...haven't gathered enough data to truly have an informed opinion on his potential. I will say from watching Alexandrov this preseason and some of the Traverse City tournament, I think he has a long way to go to ever be as talented as Brown is right now. His game is probably better suited to a checking/energy line than Brown, but I see Brown as having a higher ceiling. It's not just Brown's size that has taken him this far, he is an extremely gifted passer and I don't think he has a lot of changes to make to be a valuable NHLer.

 

[Robb_K]

Fair enough, appreciate the clarification. I think it was the following that I maybe misread as being a firsthand report or a more specific critique from watching him play:

"Based on Brown's play in this season's pre-season games, I'd say it is possible that he NEVER gets much closer to being NHL-ready. He's got to have a complete attitude overhaul, and needs to really want badly to cooperate with his coaches, and work the hardest he's ever had to in his life."

I thought it was a pretty stinging indictment, especially the part about needing a complete attitude overhaul. But re-reading it now, I can see how you might have meant it in a more general way. Alas, this type of misunderstanding will happen on the internet. Thanks again for taking the time to explain it. Sorry if my post came off accusatory, I was just genuinely surprised reading your original post.

As far as the comparison to Robertsson and Alexandrov, I admit to being biased towards valuing prospects that are closer to NHL ready. I see it as less risky. I can't really comment on Robertsson because I have only seen highlights and read reports about him...haven't gathered enough data to truly have an informed opinion on his potential. I will say from watching Alexandrov this preseason and some of the Traverse City tournament, I think he has a long way to go to ever be as talented as Brown is right now. His game is probably better suited to a checking/energy line than Brown, but I see Brown as having a higher ceiling. It's not just Brown's size that has taken him this far, he is an extremely gifted passer and I don't think he has a lot of changes to make to be a valuable NHLer.

And, in realising that my faith in Alexandrov's potential was based on what was written about him when he was drafted, and that his offensive game hasn't improved much, at all since then. I should retract my inclusion of him ahead of Brown. However, Robertsson's strength are mainly on the offensive side, - a blistering hard and accurate (and also deceptive ) shot, the muscle and physical game to make his own operating room in the higher scoring areas, and great offensive sense. And he plays hard and physically on defence, as well. His skating is fine. I'd still place him above Brown. But, I'm glad to hear that Brown is such a good passer.

 

[DatDude44]

I'd put brown 10th his upside isn't higher than robertsson, , alexandrov, Hofer, ellis or Kessels.... but if he plays consistently he could be around a torop nhl impact if he were to make it as a role player

 

[bradrich99]

waivers