SKA (KHL) earned $124M in 2018-2019 season

Discussion in 'Fugu's Business of Hockey Forum' started by Kshahdoo, Aug 1, 2019.

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  1. Nino33

    Nino33 Registered User

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    Questions for anyone who knows/wants to answer...

    Is there any similar sports league where the team income is only 10% of the league income?

    Do the Elite Football/Soccer Leagues or the NBA, NFL or MLB have their teams generate only 10% of league income?

    If there are any such Leagues, do they have the majority of that money come from the government too?
     
  2. Rigafan

    Rigafan Registered User

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    I'd think its abit unfair to include Donbass in the 'failed' section. I agree with what you said but Donbass had no choice. The war in Ukraine destroyed their arena so what chance did they have. The guy who owns them is basically keeping any sort of Ukrainian hockey alive so I'm sure he'd love not to have the war destroy their arena and be back in the league. I believe they are just 'suspended' for now?

    Well CSKA could run on losses of -$200m and they'd still be funded. Their current owner is Rosneft who are reasonably rich with revenues of $103bn!
     
  3. Barclay Donaldson

    Barclay Donaldson Registered User

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    I highly doubt that they are still suspended, if so then they are more than four seasons into the suspension. The team was given a one year reset period, or something similarly named, by Medvedev in 2014. It's unlikely it is still active.

    Somewhat unfair to include them, but I did that because the team didn't return to the KHL. They released a statement condemning the group that ransacked the building, I believe it was the Donetsk People's Republic, and stated that the arena would be fully functional in three months. Obviously, none of this has happened and they have now played four easons in the Ukrainian league and no sign of returning to Donbass or the KHL. Three months of heavy repairs is something that Kolesnikov could have easily done over the past five years. I believe that supports my assertion that non-heavily influenced Russian countries not caring about the KHL, especially since attendance was around the 3,000 level before. If there was that much interest, they would have returned by now.
     
  4. Zine

    Zine Registered User

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    Due to recent hostilities, Donetsk just doesn't have the infrastructure to support a KHL team like they once did. They don't even have an airport, it was destroyed. No businessperson, sponsor, or entity (governmental or otherwise) is gonna throw big money at hockey players while the Donbass continues to be a low-level war zone with some people still struggling to access basic services. Furthermore, good luck getting any KHL-level player to play there at the current moment.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
  5. Barclay Donaldson

    Barclay Donaldson Registered User

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    I’m not arguing that the war in Eastern Ukraine isn’t a major factor, it is one of the biggest. Even Shakhtar went to Kharkiv. However, their attendance and financial intake was low to begin with despite the team having moderate success. With all of the weak teams that had done better than them and have folded since, I highly doubt Donbas would still be in the league. There’s other arenas in Ukraine they could play in, if the appetite was there for another Ukrainian KHL team, then they certainly would be playing.
     
  6. Prntscrn

    Prntscrn Registered User

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    From a Swedish standpoint I could see a Nordic League at best since we actually do have a history and something in common. But even that would be a strech I think. But a European/Russian league is completely out of the question
     
  7. Zine

    Zine Registered User

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    Attendance was low because their stadium’s capacity was around 4,000; but HC Donbass was investing heavily in the future with plans to build a new facility (12,800 capacity) by 2015.

    Right now the KHL cannot exist in Ukraine, but that has nothing innately to do with the league. Currently there’s no chance for hockey in Donetsk and, with the current political climate, a KHL team stationed elsewhere in Ukraine would be akin to a political powder keg going off; a open invitation for violence from nationalists. Yea, not happening. Furthermore Russia enacted counter-sanctions on Kolesnikov.

    Moreover, a significant dissimilarity exists between Donbass and other 'failed' foreign KHL ventures in that there is no alternative domestic league Donbass supporters would prefer to play in. Hockey is virtually dead in Ukraine. Donbass quickly outgrew the insignificant Ukrainian league and moved on to the VHL before joining the KHL.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2019
  8. Theokritos

    Theokritos Moderator

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    Huh? München has a capacity of 6,100. Salzburg 3,400.
     
  9. Barclay Donaldson

    Barclay Donaldson Registered User

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    Architecture firm 3XN is building the 11,500 seat SAP Garden in the Olympiapark that will host both Bayern basketball and EHC Red Bull München in 2021 after a few long delays. Was under the impression the same was happening in Salzburg but that project was canceled, fair point on that part.
     
  10. vorky

    vorky @vorkywh24

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    Regarding the venues & attendance.

    For 2018-2019, the NL was the best-attended league in Europe followed by the KHL & the DEL in that order.

    Let us look at the capacity
    NL - 2 clubs with venues over 10k + 2 upcoming venues (Zurich, Geneve)
    DEL - 4 clubs with venues over 10k + one venue upcoming in Munchen
    KHL - 9 clubs with venues over 10k + 6 upcoming venues for 12k (SKA´s for 22-24k)

    So, the KHL has the best infrastructure (venues) in Europe. And that trend will be more significant in the future.
     
  11. Barclay Donaldson

    Barclay Donaldson Registered User

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    NL has 12 teams. DEL has 14 teams. KHL has 25. Saying they have the best infrastructure in Europe is extremely deceptive considering they have double the number of teams than the NL. Not only should it be the expectation that they have more venues over 10k, but they also much more financial backing in the form of those pesky government-owned corporations, something which none of the other European leagues have. They ought to have bigger arenas and more of them.
     
    Anisimovs AK likes this.
  12. vorky

    vorky @vorkywh24

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    Venues over 10k in %

    NL - 16,6%
    DEL - 28,5%
    KHL - 36%

    Math is very simple here. And you need to know that the KHL clubs will get more and more venues, so the infrastructure will be much better than now. I highly doubt the DEL/NL will get as many new 10k venues as the KHL.
     
  13. Barclay Donaldson

    Barclay Donaldson Registered User

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    You missed the point, Vorky. NL easily topped the KHL in attendance this past year. Something I clearly remember you denying just a few months ago. I can bring up the thread if you want. So despite having more stadiums with higher capacities, the KHL still didn't have as high of an attendance as the NL. What does that say about the future trend for KHL attendance? It will be bigger stadiums that remain filled with empty seats, as many of them are now.

    After this next wave of arenas, it will be:

    NL - 33%
    DEL - 36%
    KHL - 62%

    As I pointed out, it should be the expectation that they have bigger stadiums and more of them. In terms of quality of play, it's the 2nd highest league in the world. If they played in rec rinks, it would be even more shambolic than their European expansion plans . They also have massive government-owned companies subsidizing most of their operations and helping them get brand new state of the art stadiums. No other European leagues or teams have that, the only ones that even have one huge, single backer would be Red Bull. But at the end of the day, KHL teams still need to pay their players. Something which no less than one dozen teams have had well-publicized issues with over the last 5 years. They should be concentrating on that rather than building more huge arenas that they more than likely won't be able to fill.
     
  14. vorky

    vorky @vorkywh24

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    So, you have a problem with the fact that the KHL clubs getting more and more new venues. Like it was a wrong thing! Would be great if the remaining European leagues to get such wonderful venues as soon as possible. And as many as the KHL... if not more!

    The KHL´s attendance is rising, and it will be much better with new venues. I do not know why you think the opposite. There is no reason to think so. The KHL is the European league who has made the biggest step in the attendance for the last decade. The SHL & Liiga are leagues who have lost the most fans in stadiums.

    I do remember that discussion with you, you claimed the DEL is better attended than the KHL this past season. Statistics have shown your statement is false.
     

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