Since 2011-2012, who has been the best Defenseman in the NHL

[Flair Hay]

Regular season

Karlsson
Weber
Playoffs

Keith
Doughty

 

[Duke749]

In that time frame, probably Karlsson. You go back two years and likely Keith.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

There's no denying Karlsson's offensive ability. He's been elite and often above the rest of his peers.

This issue that I have with calling him the best for the last 5+ seasons now is when you're protecting a lead or matching up with an opposing top line.

Let's say you're up by a goal with a minute and a half left, does Karlsson even make the Top 25 list of defencemen that you'd choose to protect that lead in 11-12? What about 12-13? And so on.

I know Ottawa fans like to say that he's so much better defensively this season, but gun to my head that I have to matchup against Crosby or Kane for a series, there's probably at least 10 guys today that I'd choose from a defensive standpoint to take that assignment before Karlsson enters the conversation.

And despite how good he is offensively, I really struggle calling that type of player the best defencemen in the game for 5+ years.

 

[TZM]

Wouldn't take any defenseman over Suter. There isn't a better player to build your defense around.

 

[swiftwin]

There's no denying Karlsson's offensive ability. He's been elite and often above the rest of his peers.

This issue that I have with calling him the best for the last 5+ seasons now is when you're protecting a lead or matching up with an opposing top line.

Let's say you're up by a goal with a minute and a half left, does Karlsson even make the Top 25 list of defencemen that you'd choose to protect that lead in 11-12? What about 12-13? And so on.

I know Ottawa fans like to say that he's so much better defensively this season, but gun to my head that I have to matchup against Crosby or Kane for a series, there's probably at least 10 guys today that I'd choose from a defensive standpoint to take that assignment before Karlsson enters the conversation.

And despite how good he is offensively, I really struggle calling that type of player the best defencemen in the game for 5+ years.

Disagree. Because the NHL is putting so much emphasis on speed lately, Karlsson's speed neutralizes top players very well.

In games against the true top top forwards, Karlsson was very heavily line matched. He had a much lower TOI than usual in order to have him on the bench and ready to jump on the second one of those players jumped on.

Against Ottawa this season:
Ovechkin = 3GP: 0G 0A 0P -1
Crosby = 2GP: 1G 0A 1P 0

Last time the Sens were in the playoffs, in Game 4 against the Habs, down 0-3 in the series, and up 1-0 late in the game, Karlsson played all but ~10 seconds on the last entire 4 minutes of the game. I think the Habs only mustered one shot, and the Sens won 1-0.

The whole "You don't want Karlsson on protecting a lead late in a game in the playoffs" thing is nothing but pure myth. He's always on the ice in those situations, and he's phenomenal at it.

 

[BigT2002]

Duncan Keith, I really don't see how it could be anyone else.

 

[Russian Factor]

Letang was the best in 12/13 imo. He was also top 3 in 14/15 and 15/16(sadly injuries took away what looked like a norris in 14/15.). My personal top 5 has been

1a) Karlsson
1b) Letang
3) Keith
4) Doughty
5) Subban

Since 11/12.

Good list. I think Letang isn't quite 1b but I would definitely put him top 5. Hedman lurks somewhere just outside the 5

 

[Leafsrock95]

Suter

 

[silkyjohnson50]

Disagree. Because the NHL is putting so much emphasis on speed lately, Karlsson's speed neutralizes top players very well.

In games against the true top top forwards, Karlsson was very heavily line matched. He had a much lower TOI than usual in order to have him on the bench and ready to jump on the second one of those players jumped on.

Against Ottawa this season:
Ovechkin = 3GP: 0G 0A 0P -1
Crosby = 2GP: 1G 0A 1P 0

Last time the Sens were in the playoffs, in Game 4 against the Habs, down 0-3 in the series, and up 1-0 late in the game, Karlsson played all but ~10 seconds on the last entire 4 minutes of the game. I think the Habs only mustered one shot, and the Sens won 1-0.

The whole "You don't want Karlsson on protecting a lead late in a game in the playoffs" thing is nothing but pure myth. He's always on the ice in those situations, and he's phenomenal at it.

Your example is a 5 game sample using this season. The OP specifies since 11-12.

You're also using Karlsson's usage on the Sens. I didn't question whether or not he gets used in that situation by the Sens. I question how many guys around the league I'd choose before him to protect those situations.

Because I certainly wouldn't choose him first. Not this season and most certainly not going back to 11-12.

How did Sweden use him during the 2014 Olympics?

 

[HarrisonFord]

Keith
Doughty
Karlsson

In that order

 

[JFG]

Karlsson

Keith




Doughty

My top 3.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Karlsson



Doughty
Keith
Suter
Burns

 

[ManofSteel55]

There's no denying Karlsson's offensive ability. He's been elite and often above the rest of his peers.

This issue that I have with calling him the best for the last 5+ seasons now is when you're protecting a lead or matching up with an opposing top line.

Let's say you're up by a goal with a minute and a half left, does Karlsson even make the Top 25 list of defencemen that you'd choose to protect that lead in 11-12? What about 12-13? And so on.

I know Ottawa fans like to say that he's so much better defensively this season, but gun to my head that I have to matchup against Crosby or Kane for a series, there's probably at least 10 guys today that I'd choose from a defensive standpoint to take that assignment before Karlsson enters the conversation.

And despite how good he is offensively, I really struggle calling that type of player the best defencemen in the game for 5+ years.

And what about when they need a goal? Over the past 5 years has there been a defenseman that you would want out there more if your team was down by one late? It isn't close really.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

And what about when they need a goal? Over the past 5 years has there been a defenseman that you would want out there more if your team was down by one late? It isn't close really.

Did you literally ignore my opening sentence of that post?

Offense is one aspect of a defencemen's game and I happen to weigh the defensive abilities as well.

 

[swiftwin]

Did you literally ignore my opening sentence of that post?

Offense is one aspect of a defencemen's game and I happen to weigh the defensive abilities as well.

Except you didn't weigh that in your post.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

Except you didn't weigh that in your post.

Except that I did. You choose to read it as such because the post likely went against your own ideas.

I acknowledged his offensive game. I then gave my reasons of why I'm uncomfortable placing Karlsson #1 on this list. Being the best offensive defensive, regardless of the gap, doesn't automatically place you #1 on a list. Certainly not on my list. Why is Paul Coffey a back end/borderline Top 10 defencemen of all time when his offensive numbers and peak are the only ones that come close to Bobby Orr? Why is Phil Housley an afterthought? The answers to those questions: because offense is one aspect of a defencemen's game.

 

[1967th Heaven]

A lot of interesting posts here.

I started the thread because I genuinely don't know what to think and wanted to see a bunch of perspectives.

On one hand, you've got Doughty and Keith who have been money in the playoffs, dynamite defensively and still put up decent offensive numbers, as many have said.

On the other hand you've got EK who has been far and away the best offensive Dman for the past 5 years, hasn't had playoff success but also hasn't had near the team support Doughty and Keith have had.

It's an interesting debate for sure