Confirmed with Link: Siemens signs QO [1yr, 2-way $874k]

[NOTENOUGHJTCGOALS]

Stefan Elliott wasn't a throw-in to a bigger deal, and he was traded.

What's sad is Gormley got quite a few NHL games. I'm hoping the team is good enough next season that these types are buried in the AHL.

 

[AslanRH]

All due respect to Duncan, but he's not capable of playing like Boychuk. He doesn't have the same tools in his toolbox. If he turns into anything at the NHL level it will be like Barrett Jackman.

I'll take a guy who started his career in his early 20s and has logged over 900 NHL games.

 

[xbestboybandever]

I'll take a guy who started his career in his early 20s and has logged over 900 NHL games.

Heaven forbid we have a pure defensive defenseman.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Heaven forbid we have a pure defensive defenseman.

But that's 90s hockey

 

[xbestboybandever]

But that's 90s hockey

Defense wins championships.

 

[AslanRH]

But that's 90s hockey

Lumbering immobile defensive defensemen who rely mostly on physical play is 90s hockey (arguably 00s to early10s as well).

There will always be a spot for guys like Gudbranson, Gudas, younger Hejda, and even Tyutins) in the league as long as they can keep pace with the game.

 

[Sea Eagles]

But that's 90s hockey

A good defensive D has a lot of tools in his kit too TV. He can possess a great outlet pass. He can maintain puck control. He can cycle the puck behind his own goalie. He can communicate with the more offensive guys (and cover them). He can be physical. He can be strong along the boards. He CAN chip in offensively from time to time. He can be gritty and stick up for hos players. He can intimidate guys like (spits) Franzen who tear us up, right up the middle...

So on and so forth.

We need one of these guys big time.

DS would have a long way to go to get to that point though.

 

[Pokecheque]

Dude's not the archetype of a Dead Puck Era-defenseman. He's still got decent wheels and from what I understand his puck skills are limited but they're not Brad Stuart level (someone correct me if I'm wrong), who may have actually been even worse with the puck than Ryan effin' O'Byrne, and that's saying something. Stuart looked like a Mini-Mite out there seemingly batting the puck away the minute it landed on his stick. And don't get me started on his "outlet passes." Ridiculous.

If he makes it to the big show as a depth guy I'll be happy. But I don't think that'll happen. That's not to say the type of d-man he is doesn't fit with today's NHL. Of course they do. They just have a limited shelf life. Mike Komisarek earned quite a few $$$ in the NHL, but he sputtered out pretty quickly in Toronto. So long as you're not giving players like that too much money for too much term I don't see the problem. My issue with DS is not his physical tools, which seem perfectly suited to the NHL. Merely his talent level and durability. It's fair to say both are questionable at this point.

BTW, isn't Geertsen supposed to be a stay-at-home guy for the most part?

 

[tigervixxxen]

Yes Siemens is a good skater. But the hands are bad, real bad. He can make an outlet pass if it's easy. I constantly wrestle with he should have been given a shot on the third pair at the point they were trying a multitude of garbage on that third pair with the fact he didn't really force them to. I don't think the development and injuries helped him but the new regime or whatever you want to call it didn't favor him either. At this point I don't think there's much untapped as far as ceiling goes but another org could probably take the pieces and make them a touch more useful.

Geertsen is a stay at home guy too but he has a bit more skill with the puck. Better passer, better shot at least.

 

[dahrougem2]

Dude's not the archetype of a Dead Puck Era-defenseman. He's still got decent wheels and from what I understand his puck skills are limited but they're not Brad Stuart level (someone correct me if I'm wrong), who may have actually been even worse with the puck than Ryan effin' O'Byrne, and that's saying something. Stuart looked like a Mini-Mite out there seemingly batting the puck away the minute it landed on his stick. And don't get me started on his "outlet passes." Ridiculous.

If he makes it to the big show as a depth guy I'll be happy. But I don't think that'll happen. That's not to say the type of d-man he is doesn't fit with today's NHL. Of course they do. They just have a limited shelf life. Mike Komisarek earned quite a few $$$ in the NHL, but he sputtered out pretty quickly in Toronto. So long as you're not giving players like that too much money for too much term I don't see the problem. My issue with DS is not his physical tools, which seem perfectly suited to the NHL. Merely his talent level and durability. It's fair to say both are questionable at this point.

BTW, isn't Geertsen supposed to be a stay-at-home guy for the most part?

Brad Stuart's puck skills are still better than Siemens' puck skills.

 

[henchman21]

Do give an example of how good Siemens' puck skills really are... Guenin looks like a good puck handler and passer in comparison. Yes, they are that bad.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

I often wonder if it was our development system that failed him or if he just didn't want to work hard enough to get around his injury luck. Dunc has all the tools to be an NHLer and defensive defenders take a lot longer to develop, but he hasn't shown that rock-steady defensive game we all had hoped.

Ironically, he and Elliott were a dynamic duo and neither made it.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I truly believe Dunk was drafted so high because of Elliott. Stef was the offense of that Blades team. Siemens benefitted from a lot of secondary assists on that team and when you put up points and have a big, mean stay at home game to go with it you're going to get drooled over.

Now I'm not claiming to have had watched a lot of WHL hockey that year, but when a defenseman scores 31 goals you have to think his partner is going to be the beneficiary of a lot of easy D to D passes.

 

[S E P H]

I truly believe Dunk was drafted so high because of Elliott. Stef was the offense of that Blades team. Siemens benefitted from a lot of secondary assists on that team and when you put up points and have a big, mean stay at home game to go with it you're going to get drooled over.

Now I'm not claiming to have had watched a lot of WHL hockey that year, but when a defenseman scores 31 goals you have to think his partner is going to be the beneficiary of a lot of easy D to D passes.

I don't think so, I don't think any organization thought of him as a two-way defender even with his points during his draft year. They could have watched the games and see that Elliott was the one leading the way when it comes to puck rushing ability. If they did, then Avs scouting staff is a bunch of Pejorative Slurs, which I don't think is the case. Which includes Pracey, what his overall problem was, he was too hell bent in drafting his type of player disregarding talent issues and focusing on high character kids.

But Elliott and his lack of development is a reason why I don't really buy the Bean hype. They are similar players with similar strengths and not a whole lot of difference in the IQ department either.

 

[tigervixxxen]

I don't know, this staff liked Logan Stanley. I get the point, obviously the scouts have seen these kids play and they should fully comprehend their skillset. But I do think things get overlooked or minimized. I've read a lot of the threads back concerning Siemens' selection and it wasn't that folks were convinced the offensive upside was there, it was more they were just so tantalized by his package of size, skating ability, physicality and toughness that it wasn't really a primary concern. Plus 5 years ago there wasn't the focus on puck movement like there is now.

 

[Bender]

I don't know, this staff liked Logan Stanley. I get the point, obviously the scouts have seen these kids play and they should fully comprehend their skillset. But I do think things get overlooked or minimized. I've read a lot of the threads back concerning Siemens' selection and it wasn't that folks were convinced the offensive upside was there, it was more they were just so tantalized by his package of size, skating ability, physicality and toughness that it wasn't really a primary concern. Plus 5 years ago there wasn't the focus on puck movement like there is now.

Absolutely true. For me the thing with Siemens is he seemed a little bit slow with his decision making. Not half a step but more like a quarter-step. That didn't seem to bode well for the next level(s)...and why I had him ranked much lower than most. (25th)

Then again, I did have Oleksiak 11th and he hasn't fared much better.

 

[S E P H]

I don't know, this staff liked Logan Stanley. I get the point, obviously the scouts have seen these kids play and they should fully comprehend their skillset. But I do think things get overlooked or minimized. I've read a lot of the threads back concerning Siemens' selection and it wasn't that folks were convinced the offensive upside was there, it was more they were just so tantalized by his package of size, skating ability, physicality and toughness that it wasn't really a primary concern. Plus 5 years ago there wasn't the focus on puck movement like there is now.

Avs aren't the only staff to like Stanley as Avs were not the only staff to like Siemens (which Flyers really considered him). I absolutely agree that weaknesses and concerns do get minimized or overlooked to benefit the player at hand. Overall though, I think Duncan was drafted as a "plan" to help the cupboard in every position, we took Landeskog, a forward at 2nd overall and decided to take the best defenseman available at 11th at the time. Every team does it, I don't personally like it, I never wanted Siemens at 11th, but we aren't the only one.

Chicago is notorious for doing this..

1st / 2nd / 2nd / 2nd
2008: Beach (F) / Lalonde (D)
2009: Olsen (D) / Pirri (F)
2010: Hayes (F) / Rensfeldt (F) / Holl (D) / Simpson (G) / Johns (D)
2011: McNeill (F) / Danault (F) / Clendening (D)
2012: Teravainen (F) / Fournier (D)
2013: Hartman (F) / Dahlstrom (D)
2014: First draft since 2007 they didn't take a defenseman until the 5th round.
2015: Knott (F) / Gilbert (D)
2016: DeBrincat (F) / Krys (D)

Yes Siemens puck skills are bad, but as AgentBlack said previously, what's there to hurt if we just keep re-signing him? Puck skills are not like hockey intelligence as something that cannot be taught. Of course he will never have Drouin type of hands or can make a superb pass under pressure as Zadorov can, but he has had injuries to his wrists and hands and could be one of the reasons why he's behind the curve concerning this.

 

[henchman21]

NHL teams LOVE big, mean defensemen who can skate... if they have even a slight bit of offensive upside, they will go higher than most think. When they are one of those younger is the draft on top of that, it is like getting an 11 in blackjack. Those players are seriously catnip for scouts. I get why they made the pick, and honestly, it is the pick I probably would have made as well. Even when you look back at that draft though... it pretty much sucked on the defensive side of the puck. Klefbom is the big miss (though I wouldn't mind having Murphy or Beaulieu), but in every draft, every pick outside the very top end can always be questioned. The Avs just missed on their projection.

 

[Pokecheque]

Brad Stuart's puck skills are still better than Siemens' puck skills.

Well if that's the case then I'm even more convinced he'll never make it.