Series discussion: #2 Panthers vs. #3 Lightning - First battle goes to TBL 4-2

[zeroG]

lmao. These f***ing clowns love Yandle so much.

Somebody please convince TNT to offer Yandle a contract so he can retire and stop acting like a f***ing traffic cone.



First goal, lol

I think it gets worse every time I watch it.

ok, he whiffed on the puck and the man, that's true. that's his mistake. and, he had to try to step on coleman because he was flat-footed and coleman had half the ice to get up to speed. ideally, that gap would've been smaller and he would've had a bit more speed so he wasn't forced to make that desperate play, which coleman easily avoided with a nice chip off the wall.

that said, defense is about layers. one of the reasons he *could* step up on coleman is that he knew he had huby coming back with speed. that dynamic - back-pressure allowing the D to step up on a rush - is a fundamental part of transition D.

now, huby falls unexpectedly and yandle whiffs. that's ok, we still have montour to protect the middle. had montour done what stralman did later in the period and take the pass away while not allowing coleman to come to the middle, the result would've been a chance from a poor angle OR, more likely, coleman hanging onto the puck and waiting for the trailer.

as fun as it is to beat up on yandle, his mistake was only one part of that bad goal. and we haven't even talked about the unfortunate scrum off the faceoff where OT was eliminated, allowing an easy out to coleman with room to skate.

 

[Jean Luc Discard]

So who comes back for next season? It would be awesome to keep all the forwards as the offense is fantastic. But the blue line has to be fixed.

Ideally they'd need to replace 10% of the roster every year so that the group doesn't become stale.

The defense needs defensemen who can work in front of the net i.e. clear screens, tie up sticks, punish opposing players in front of the net, etc. They've got enough 2way dmen but Tampa's PP especially showed that they don't have the skills to clear space for the goalie regardless who's in the net. Maybe it's Gildon, maybe it's some cheapo FA like Oleksiak...

 

[Jean Luc Discard]

had montour done what stralman did later in the period and take the pass away while not allowing coleman to come to the middle

Can't remember what exactly Stralman did but Montour should've just focused on Colton since Coleman didn't have any angle to shoot so presumably it would've been an easy save for Knight. Every dman on this roster does the exact same thing: going for the puck carrier in an odd-man rush regardless of the situation which leaves for options open for the opposing team when they commit to area defense instead of covering the closest player.

 

[Gentle Man]

i don't agree re: chances. the first wasn't great but it wasn't as bad as the shot total suggested. in fact, i think the shot totals were inflated by local scorekeeper. even if they weren't, i don't think the shot quality was the same. there were a handful in tight but the angles were sharp and no pass options were available.

maybe it didn't affect the defenders but we just executed better overall. doesn't matter what the reason was, we protected the middle of the ice better, in my opinion anyway. as i said earlier, holding the bolts to 1 goal is not a 1-person job.

Game 3. We allowed 8 high danger chances and allowed 5 goals.

4. 9 was allowed and they scored 6

Game 5, we allowed 13 high danger chances and allowed 1.

And no, that's not a local stat keeper.

3 of those were all related to Yandle.

1st goal.

The one where he missed on a hip check and fell on the boards.

When Maroon stripped him of the puck and threw it to Colton right in front.

 

[zeroG]

Game 3. We allowed 8 high danger chances and allowed 5 goals.

4. 9 was allowed and they scored 6

Game 5, we allowed 13 high danger chances and allowed 1.

And no, that's not a local stat keeper.

3 of those were all related to Yandle.

1st goal.

The one where he missed on a hip check and fell on the boards.

When Maroon stripped him of the puck and threw it to Colton right in front.

i don't care to discuss yandle (here, at least - discussed 1st goal elsewhere).

i could be wrong but my sense while watching the game was that, after we settled down, we did a pretty good job of controlling the middle of the ice. i felt some confirmation when weekes said the same thing after the game and underscored the point by mentioning that he talked to several ex-players at the game who felt that was the case.

i like the idea of quantifying high-danger chances and certainly, they can be considered objective from the standpoint of where the shot takes place. that said, everything else about a shot from a high-danger area is subjective. how much time does the shooter have? how much space? backhand or forehand? does he have an option to make a play? what happened just before the shot? etc., etc.

so, you can stick with your stats but i am not persuaded.

 

[Gentle Man]

i don't care to discuss yandle (here, at least - discussed 1st goal elsewhere).

i could be wrong but my sense while watching the game was that, after we settled down, we did a pretty good job of controlling the middle of the ice. i felt some confirmation when weekes said the same thing after the game and underscored the point by mentioning that he talked to several ex-players at the game who felt that was the case.

i like the idea of quantifying high-danger chances and certainly, they can be considered objective from the standpoint of where the shot takes place. that said, everything else about a shot from a high-danger area is subjective. how much time does the shooter have? how much space? backhand or forehand? does he have an option to make a play? what happened just before the shot? etc., etc.

so, you can stick with your stats but i am not persuaded.

You dont have to.

But natural stat trick is unbiased and is a credible source used by many people.

I think people looked at the game as a whole which is fine, but a lot of the good chances Tampa got came in the first. He made 21 saves and 14 the rest of the way.

 

[zeroG]

Can't remember what exactly Stralman did but Montour should've just focused on Colton since Coleman didn't have any angle to shoot so presumably it would've been an easy save for Knight. Every dman on this roster does the exact same thing: going for the puck carrier in an odd-man rush regardless of the situation which leaves for options open for the opposing team when they commit to area defense instead of covering the closest player.

well, each situation is a little different. i think it's pretty clear (in hindsight at least) that in this case, montour made a really bad decision.

think back to the decision gudas made to go right after kucherov, though. there's a point when he's backing up where you can see his right arm flail a bit as, it appears to me, he makes the decision not to stop but to keep going and ram kucherov. in that case, it was the right decision - he correctly determined that he had the speed and the angle to prevent a quick pass then slam kucherov and break up the play. and the alternative in this case was to pull up and give one of the best players in the world time and space to make a play.

 

[zeroG]

You dont have to.

But natural stat trick is unbiased and is a credible source used by many people.

I think people looked at the game as a whole which is fine, but a lot of the good chances Tampa got came in the first. He made 21 saves and 14 the rest of the way.

the fact that it's unbiased and many use it doesn't address any of my concerns, though.

people are glomming onto all sorts of new statistics. we don't quite have enough experience with any of them yet to say for certain how well they actually reflect the reality on the ice. of course, that doesn't stop folks from using them to make a point.