Salary Cap: Salary Cap Thread: Luke Schenn Edition

[Extra Texture]

Exposing McCann is stupid. He will be a stud in Seattle.

Seriously, McCann being exposed would annoy the hell out of me. I know its based on projections, but if he repeats his performance this year, we're talking about a 25 goal, 50 point guy who is 25/26. Yeah, we might lose him in a year over his contract demands, but at least then we'd get something back for the player. And I think someone said a few pages back, he might be struggling in the postseason, but you still need guys to fill the net in the first 82 games.

Zucker has term and has underperformed. Matheson and Petts have serious term. Tanev has term that is a little scary for a physical rabblerouser like him. Carter is winding his career down. Jarry is, well, we know the issues there. Point is ALL of those choices force Seattle to make a tough decision. Does Francis take on 2-5 years of salary commitments for a player that may or may not pan out, does he select someone that might just pack it in, or does he just go with a fringe player (a Riikola, ZAR, or Laff) to pad out his depth.

McCann gives him none of those issues. Francis would pick him 9/10 out of ten, IMO. No long term contract, production numbers increasing (especially with PP time) and still mid-20s and developing. That would be a slam dunk choice. I just hope he doesnt turn into another William Karlsson or something with the fresh start.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Exposing McCann is stupid. He will be a stud in Seattle.

Just like trading Kahun was stupid because he'd be a stud in Buffalo, right?

 

[PensandCaps]

Well then I'll assume that stat's complete garbage, because Jarry was not good.


Better to be spending $3.5 million for a 4th liner with that kinda stats than what we're paying our top-6 for similar production, I suppose.

If it were so easy to have a year 60% of your starts being quality, then Fleury would've done it atleast once here.

Point is the grass isn't always greener, Jarry has a career 61% Quality Start percentage, that's a very hard number to reach without consistency. You can do way worse. Jarry atleast keeps you in every game for the most part.

 

[Trade]

McCann has good trade value, there is no way we are just letting a young 25 year old with 20-25 goal potential just get taken. Hextall has to have some kind of deal in place or something.

Truly hope this is the case, losing him for nothing is absolutely idiotic.m, especially l when we have players I’d LOVE to lose for nothing

 

[vodeni]

If it were so easy to have a year 60% of your starts being quality, then Fleury would've done it atleast once here.

Point is the grass isn't always greener, Jarry has a career 61% Quality Start percentage, that's a very hard number to reach without consistency. You can do way worse. Jarry atleast keeps you in every game for the most part.

I wish I could believe you. what exactly for the most part means...like in non-play off games...or ...

 

[PensandCaps]

Just like trading Kahun was stupid because he'd be a stud in Buffalo, right?

okay, but McCann has produced at a 40 point pace here. And again, he's more valuable than Tanev, McCann being inconsistent isn't the issue here, its valuing a 4th liner with a bad contract over him.

Comparing Kahun to McCann is nuts. Kahun didn't have a fair bit of track record here, nor could he play center and score goals.

 

[PensandCaps]

I wish I could believe you. what exactly for the most part means...like in non-play off games...or ...

Yes. Proof is in the stats. He gave us consistently average starts.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

If it were so easy to have a year 60% of your starts being quality, then Fleury would've done it atleast once here.

Point is the grass isn't always greener, Jarry has a career 61% Quality Start percentage, that's a very hard number to reach without consistency. You can do way worse. Jarry atleast keeps you in every game for the most part.

I'm just saying a stat or analytic that puts a goalie 2nd in "quality starts" when he's got right around 30th for GAA and sv% among starting or 1A goalies is probably a bullshit stat/analytic.

He's not Niemi, but he's a bad option that we need to move away from if we are serious about chasing one last Cup for this era.

 

[Gurglesons]

Just like trading Kahun was stupid because he'd be a stud in Buffalo, right?

Seems like a really odd comparison.

McCann has been a 30+ pt player for 4 years.

 

[Empoleon8771]

okay, but McCann has produced at a 40 point pace here. And again, he's more valuable than Tanev, McCann being inconsistent isn't the issue here, its valuing a 4th liner with a bad contract over him.

Comparing Kahun to McCann is nuts. Kahun didn't have a fair bit of track record here, nor could he play center and score goals.

I'm not arguing about Tanev vs McCann here, so I don't know why you're even bringing it up.

Why is comparing McCann to Kahun "nuts"? Kahun had 2 seasons of pacing for basically 40 points, all at ES, when the Penguins traded him.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Seems like a really odd comparison.

McCann has been a 30+ pt player for 4 years.

And Kahun was a 30+ point player for 2 years when they traded him.

Look, all I'm saying is that this place certainly has a bad track record of overvaluing depth players who produce. I don't know that McCann falls in this category, but there have now been 3 different teams who have given up on him, or at least viewed him as way less than fans did.

 

[PensandCaps]

I'm not arguing about Tanev vs McCann here, so I don't know why you're even bringing it up.

Why is comparing McCann to Kahun "nuts"? Kahun had 2 seasons of pacing for basically 40 points, all at ES, when the Penguins traded him.

Because Kahun wasn't a goal scorer, nor could he play centre.

The kahun trade is only similar in that it was a stupid trade.

 

[Darren McCord]

Just like trading Kahun was stupid because he'd be a stud in Buffalo, right?

Thats a pretty bad comparison. McCann is younger, more versatile and is coming off a fantastic regular season. Kahun actually did ok in Buffalo with 4pts in 6 games. Then he went to the Blackhole that is Edmonton and still was almost at a 20 goal pace.

Either way McCann has proven much more than Kahun and is currently on an upswing in value while Kahun was on a down swing.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Because Kahun wasn't a goal scorer, nor could he play centre.

The kahun trade is only similar in that it was a stupid trade.

Yes, Kahun could play center. You nitpicking because "HE'S NOT LITERALLY THE SAME AS MCCANN!!!!" is stupid.

 

[PensandCaps]

And Kahun was a 30+ point player for 2 years when they traded him.

Look, all I'm saying is that this place certainly has a bad track record of overvaluing depth players who produce. I don't know that McCann falls in this category, but there have now been 3 different teams who have given up on him, or at least viewed him as way less than fans did.

Suprise suprise, GMs are stupid. are we really gonna hold it against McCann because Benning is super f***ing dumb and traded him for Terrible Gudbranson?

 

[vodeni]

Yes. Proof is in the stats. He gave us consistently average starts.

I am not arguing either or...the burden of proof will be on Jarry to show that he could be consistent ...his last season went from abysmal....to very good, to south of abysmal...yeah it averaged a bit but thats not how I would want my goalie...also last season, went from excellent to below average and outright sucking...Do you want the guy that will find its consistency in the last two years of Geno and Sid's greatness....may I remind you that we could easily played Tampa in finals if it wasn't for him and only him....

 

[PensandCaps]

Yes, Kahun could play center. You nitpicking because "HE'S NOT LITERALLY THE SAME AS MCCANN!!!!" is stupid.

Kahun has never played Centre in the NHL.

McCann has actually been used at Centre in the NHL a ton. Kahun "can" play centre, just like Simon "could"

 

[SEALBound]

Speaking of which, I think I would take Kahun back. RFA for Edmonton, he can't be that expensive. Maybe Pettersson+Riikola for Kahun+Kassian+4th?

 

[PensandCaps]

I am not arguing either or...the burden of proof will be on Jarry to show that he could be consistent ...his last season went from abysmal....to very good, to south of abysmal...yeah it averaged a bit but thats not how I would want my goalie...also last season, went from excellent to below average and outright sucking...Do you want the guy that will find its consistency in the last two years of Geno and Sid's greatness....may I remind you that we could easily played Tampa in finals if it wasn't for him and only him....

I agree 100%. But goalies are like rollercoasters. Jarry could end up having a hot 7 games and carry us in a series, that's just how goalies work.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The point I'm making with the Kahun comparison is that this place has a track record of overrating young guys who end up being dogshit after they leave Pittsburgh. Kahun, Sprong, Simon and Wilson are just 4 examples off the top of my head. I don't know that McCann falls in that category, but this is the 3rd team that has seemingly given up on him by his age 25 season.

Even if McCann isn't as bad as the other examples, him being given up on again is alarming, and it really aligns with some of the vibes I've gotten from Sullivan regarding how he views McCann as a player.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I am not arguing either or...the burden of proof will be on Jarry to show that he could be consistent ...his last season went from abysmal....to very good, to south of abysmal...yeah it averaged a bit but thats not how I would want my goalie...also last season, went from excellent to below average and outright sucking...Do you want the guy that will find its consistency in the last two years of Geno and Sid's greatness....may I remind you that we could easily played Tampa in finals if it wasn't for him and only him....

Only him. And Sid. And Jake. And Rust. And McCann. And Sully. And our 2nd and 3rd pairing on defense.

Jarry sucked, but the "Jarry was the only issue" stuff is extremely shortsighted and wrong.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Suprise suprise, GMs are stupid. are we really gonna hold it against McCann because Benning is super f***ing dumb and traded him for Terrible Gudbranson?

The arrogance you'd have to have to say you're right and GMs are stupid is downright laughable.

Yes, GMs make mistakes. But you (and me and everyone else on here) are a nobody fan posting on a hockey board. The fact that teams keep giving up on him as a player should make you stop and think "am I missing something that actual NHL executives see?", not double down on it and call them stupid.

 

[Darren McCord]

McCann was 21rst in PP/60 and 29th in g/60 in the league last year. He is coming off a fantastic year and entering his prime. To think he would just fall off when he is on an upward trajectory is just dumb. I am not saying he is gona blow up into a perennial 60-70 pt player.

But he could easily become a consistent 50 pt player.

 

[PensandCaps]

The point I'm making with the Kahun comparison is that this place has a track record of overrating young guys who end up being dogshit after they leave Pittsburgh. Kahun, Sprong, Simon and Wilson are just 4 examples off the top of my head. I don't know that McCann falls in that category, but this is the 3rd team that has seemingly given up on him by his age 25 season.

Even if McCann isn't as bad as the other examples, him being given up on again is alarming, and it really aligns with some of the vibes I've gotten from Sullivan regarding how he views McCann as a player.

Okay, I'm not even a fan of McCann. If we're overating McCann, what the hell is Tanev?? Super overrated by you.

The main point is, no matter how you want to spin this, is that McCann should not be exposed over Tanev, end of discussion, everything else you bring up is meaningless.

 

[Gurglesons]

The point I'm making with the Kahun comparison is that this place has a track record of overrating young guys who end up being dogshit after they leave Pittsburgh. Kahun, Sprong, Simon and Wilson are just 4 examples off the top of my head. I don't know that McCann falls in that category, but this is the 3rd team that has seemingly given up on him by his age 25 season.

Even if McCann isn't as bad as the other examples, him being given up on again is alarming, and it really aligns with some of the vibes I've gotten from Sullivan regarding how he views McCann as a player.

Sullivan has also burned through players that have been really effective as soon as they leave.

McCann was in Vancouver and Florida. You’re really going to trust their evaluation of players? When was the last time either of those teams developed an in house talent that wasn’t NHL ready? Weegar is the only one that comes to mind.