Ron Francis

[The Marquis]

Laughing so hard at how wrong of a thread my post was in.

 

[gstommylee]

Laughing so hard at how wrong of a thread my post was in.

rookie mistake wonder how many draft picks can we get at the trade deadline hmm.

 

[RainyCityHockey]

Laughing so hard at how wrong of a thread my post was in.

Lucky for you none of the mods saw this...

 

[GrungeHockey]

I expected more creative moves at the deadline. So far Francis is failing imo. I'm going to wait to see what they do in free agency before a final grade though. So much cap room there is the potential for a major overhaul after the season.

 

[Gniwder]

I expected more creative moves at the deadline. So far Francis is failing imo. I'm going to wait to see what they do in free agency before a final grade though. So much cap room there is the potential for a major overhaul after the season.

Prepare to be disappointed, $8M cap space is enough for one high end player or 2 mediocre ones. That won't move the needle much.

Cup teams are built through the draft and trades, not so much through free agency.

 

[bleedgreen]

Guys...

Been a hockey fan since the 1980's. I don't just follow teams, but the business of hockey, especially when it comes to ownership and management.

So what I say I don't say lightly, but the clock is ticking on Francis already. I personally hated the hire from day one and I don't think the Kraken are going to get close to a Cup as long as he's running things.

Now of course you're going to hear, "Chill out bro - The Kraken haven't even played a game yet!" But consider that Francis was GM of the Carolina Hurricanes for 5 years and they didn't make the playoffs once. During that time he only drafted 1 true impact/core player in Aho (had plenty of draft misses), and hired Bill Peters who was later accused of racism during his time under Francis.

To me the Hakstol hire was just a continuation of Francis' work with the Hurricanes. Hakstol is a nice guy, but consider in his 3.5 years as head coach of the Flyers he never finished higher than 3rd in their division and never won't a playoff series. That move along with tonight's draft sure feel like more talent was left on the table.

For those of you who don't know Francis/hockey or just want to give him a chance, of course please do. I'm just a big picture guy and I've seen enough already - And it looks like more of the same from a guy who didn't come close to winning the last time he was doing the same job. Remember that bad GMs are usually bad on day one and every day they are kept is time wasted and mistakes that will take longer to clean up by the next GM.

This is sad to me as while I'm not from Seattle I am a Seahawks fan and a fan of the city overall, so I want the Kraken to be great and ultimately win a Cup. Sadly I am sure that won't happen with Francis as captain of the ship.

This is one of the silliest posts I’ve seen yet. Francis drafted great for the Canes, and was tasked with dismantling a crap team to start over again. He was only there for four seasons, not five and completely laid the groundwork for the Canes. He signed Slavin and Pesce to great contrasts, traded for TT, signed Williams...

Racism by Peters under Francis? Nice try. He kicked a player on the bench and was talked to about it, no problems ever again. Peters incident with racism was with another team.

I can’t even tell if this is a serious post. Kraken fans, you at the very least have a GM that’s great at building the foundation of a team, which is what you need. Can he turn the corner after he accumulates enough assets? We don’t know that yet, he was never given a chance in Carolina. I’m rooting for you guys and despite the tough season find the team actually fun to watch. Goaltending let you down at times it seemed.

Of all the ridiculous things said here the drafting might be the worst. Every single first and second round pick Francis selected made it. That’s an impressive feat. The last draft after he left was actually his draft too, as none of the scouting staff left and they just went with the work they had already done. Jack Drury is from that draft so the first and second round streak will be intact.

 

[The Marquis]

Prepare to be disappointed, $8M cap space is enough for one high end player or 2 mediocre ones. That won't move the needle much.

Cup teams are built through the draft and trades, not so much through free agency.

It’s much more than that. First, because everything is prorated, the number in actuality is much higher. Take the original 7.3 we had before the TDL. You don’t count Rask or Sprong as those contracts both expire this year and weren’t on the books prior to today. So you take that 7.3 and add the hole that all the guys who just moved had. 6.9+2+1.5+.9+.875+.75 = just under 13m. Take away the difference in McCann’s new contract -2.1m and add the 7.3 I mentioned above and you’ve got around 18m to play with. Probably 4 of that gets eaten by signing RFA’s, but that leaves 14. We can also trade our players with higher cap hits in the off-season.

 

[The Marquis]

I went and did very rudimentary math.

Per cap friendly, once all of our current RFA’s and UFA’s are up at the end of this season, re-signed or not, and already including the McCann extension, the Kraken will have a payroll of 58,716,666 over 14 players, all of them being our highest paid. That leaves $23,783,334 of space to sign 9 players.

Now, we have had around 6-8 players signed this year at the minimum on the main roster on average, so let’s go with averages here for the amount at 800k and aim low with 5 players at that amount. That takes 4m out and leaves 4 contracts to work on. Let’s say one of them is Donato and we give him a raise of say… double his current pay. There’s another 1.5 gone. That leaves $18,200,000 to spend on the remaining 3 players.

All that said, let’s just say we add somebody at another low end contract. That’s around 17.5 million to find 2 players. That’s just thinking in Free Agency. I believe that’s enough for serious difference makers.

With the picks we got this week, we can make serious trade moves only a handful of teams can make while through them, shedding other contracts and freeing up cap space for better players to come in at a lower margin of change.

The Kraken are in a good spot, and not many teams are going to be able to match up. On the negative side of things, it frees up enough money to f*** up pretty bad with bad contracts.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

I went and did very rudimentary math.

Per cap friendly, once all of our current RFA’s and UFA’s are up at the end of this season, re-signed or not, and already including the McCann extension, the Kraken will have a payroll of 58,716,666 over 14 players, all of them being our highest paid. That leaves $23,783,334 of space to sign 9 players.

Now, we have had around 6-8 players signed this year at the minimum on the main roster on average, so let’s go with averages here for the amount at 800k and aim low with 5 players at that amount. That takes 4m out and leaves 4 contracts to work on. Let’s say one of them is Donato and we give him a raise of say… double his current pay. There’s another 1.5 gone. That leaves $18,200,000 to spend on the remaining 3 players.

All that said, let’s just say we add somebody at another low end contract. That’s around 17.5 million to find 2 players. That’s just thinking in Free Agency. I believe that’s enough for serious difference makers.

With the picks we got this week, we can make serious trade moves only a handful of teams can make while through them, shedding other contracts and freeing up cap space for better players to come in at a lower margin of change.

The Kraken are in a good spot, and not many teams are going to be able to match up. On the negative side of things, it frees up enough money to f*** up pretty bad with bad contracts.

The thing that concerns me is that I just don't see any impactful players in FA who we SHOULD sign. The ones who can help are going to be too expensive and want too much term. The age also needs to fit. Plus no guarantee they want to come to an expansion team which could win the lottery.

We should try to target teams with cap problems to make it work. What we didn't have last season was extra picks. This off-season we have an abundance of those and can afford to be aggressive in that area. Use that cap space to give picks for signed players on fair contracts that other teams have to dump because of cap issues. Or take bad contract + good prospect back. In the 2nd scenario need to make sure that the quality of prospect matches the number of years and AAV of the bad contract.

 

[The Marquis]

The thing that concerns me is that I just don't see any impactful players in FA who we SHOULD sign. The ones who can help are going to be too expensive and want too much term. The age also needs to fit. Plus no guarantee they want to come to an expansion team which could win the lottery.

We should try to target teams with cap problems to make it work. What we didn't have last season was extra picks. This off-season we have an abundance of those and can afford to be aggressive in that area. Use that cap space to give picks for signed players on fair contracts that other teams have to dump because of cap issues. Or take bad contract + good prospect back. In the 2nd scenario need to make sure that the quality of prospect matches the number of years and AAV of the bad contract.

I’m starting to think Gaudreau might be the kind of player who may be worth banking on long term. His hockey IQ is off the charts and he’s really good. I just hope Calgary doesn’t get to him first.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

I’m starting to think Gaudreau might be the kind of player who may be worth banking on long term. His hockey IQ is off the charts and he’s really good. I just hope Calgary doesn’t get to him first.

I prefer Forsberg over Gaudreau. He is younger, likely to be cheaper. Also, one concern I have with Gaudreau is that once his speed goes, his game could decline really fast. He will be 29 before next season starts and want 7 years (I expect on his deal). The first 3-4 years should actually be solid but after that, its going to be playing with fire.

 

[GrungeHockey]

Prepare to be disappointed, $8M cap space is enough for one high end player or 2 mediocre ones. That won't move the needle much.

Cup teams are built through the draft and trades, not so much through free agency.

Built yes, but almost every cup team makes a big move to take them over the top (like Tampa did last year adding Savard).

The cup is going to Colorado, Florida or Tampa this year with Minnesota Boston and Pittsburgh as long shots that might - stress MIGHT - surprise, and they all added.
The only other possible imo is Vegas if they are in fact cheating and all their injured players miraculously get healthy come playoff time in Kutcherov fashion. Rangers took a leap by adding, but not sure they can ride a goalie all the way. Doubt it.

 

[Irie]

I went and did very rudimentary math.

Per cap friendly, once all of our current RFA’s and UFA’s are up at the end of this season, re-signed or not, and already including the McCann extension, the Kraken will have a payroll of 58,716,666 over 14 players, all of them being our highest paid. That leaves $23,783,334 of space to sign 9 players.

Now, we have had around 6-8 players signed this year at the minimum on the main roster on average, so let’s go with averages here for the amount at 800k and aim low with 5 players at that amount. That takes 4m out and leaves 4 contracts to work on. Let’s say one of them is Donato and we give him a raise of say… double his current pay. There’s another 1.5 gone. That leaves $18,200,000 to spend on the remaining 3 players.

All that said, let’s just say we add somebody at another low end contract. That’s around 17.5 million to find 2 players. That’s just thinking in Free Agency. I believe that’s enough for serious difference makers.

With the picks we got this week, we can make serious trade moves only a handful of teams can make while through them, shedding other contracts and freeing up cap space for better players to come in at a lower margin of change.

The Kraken are in a good spot, and not many teams are going to be able to match up. On the negative side of things, it frees up enough money to f*** up pretty bad with bad contracts.

The thing that concerns me is that I just don't see any impactful players in FA who we SHOULD sign. The ones who can help are going to be too expensive and want too much term. The age also needs to fit. Plus no guarantee they want to come to an expansion team which could win the lottery.

We should try to target teams with cap problems to make it work. What we didn't have last season was extra picks. This off-season we have an abundance of those and can afford to be aggressive in that area. Use that cap space to give picks for signed players on fair contracts that other teams have to dump because of cap issues. Or take bad contract + good prospect back. In the 2nd scenario need to make sure that the quality of prospect matches the number of years and AAV of the bad contract.

I still think you stay the coarse for one more miserable year. Sign a few lesser pieces this offseason, get a better system and clean up the PK and defensive coverage, and sell heavy again next TDL.

Draft well and the first wave of ELCs should be almost ready. the following year.

The team would have a ton of cap, and you would have a much stronger foundation in the desert and the start of the ELC pipeline flow. Stay cap flexible, and you'd have the ability to throw a state-income-tax-free top contract offer at a guy like MacKinnon or Matthews.

They shouldn't be fighting to sign top UFAs this early and then trading assets to help them try to make the post season as an eight seed unless they want to be a perrenial bubble team.

 

[Gniwder]

Built yes, but almost every cup team makes a big move to take them over the top (like Tampa did last year adding Savard).

The cup is going to Colorado, Florida or Tampa this year with Minnesota Boston and Pittsburgh as long shots that might - stress MIGHT - surprise, and they all added.
The only other possible imo is Vegas if they are in fact cheating and all their injured players miraculously get healthy come playoff time in Kutcherov fashion. Rangers took a leap by adding, but not sure they can ride a goalie all the way. Doubt it.

Yeah well, this is the Kraken forum. This team is at least 5 years from that point if not more.

 

[Mike Jones]

Plus no guarantee they want to come to an expansion team which could win the lottery.

This is a key statement. Seattle will probably miss the playoffs again next season so few of the A-listers would probably want to sign.

The A-listers will probably be more interested after the 22-23 season. If year 3 is the one where the Kraken start fighting for a playoff spot Seattle may be a more attractive destination. Higher end free agents may also be motivated by the chance to play with Beniers and whoever is drafted in the first round of '22 and '23.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

This is a key statement. Seattle will probably miss the playoffs again next season so few of the A-listers would probably want to sign.

The A-listers will probably be more interested after the 22-23 season. If year 3 is the one where the Kraken start fighting for a playoff spot Seattle may be a more attractive destination. Higher end free agents may also be motivated by the chance to play with Beniers and whoever is drafted in the first round of '22 and '23.

The question is what do we do between now and year 3 to get there. The team is not going to get there solely on the basis of our drafted players. If we are lucky Beniers adjusts quickly to the NHL and is productive by the end of next season. But I do not expect our top pick from this season is going to start producing right away in their D + 1 year in the NHL.

You build via the draft but we cannot solely depend on it. More than FA signings I am hoping we use some of our draft capital to land ready to plugin prospect or roster players. You always have some FA's willing to sign here but most high-end FA's generally do not want to go to expansion or re-building teams.

 

[Irie]

The question is what do we do between now and year 3 to get there. The team is not going to get there solely on the basis of our drafted players. If we are lucky Beniers adjusts quickly to the NHL and is productive by the end of next season. But I do not expect our top pick from this season is going to start producing right away in their D + 1 year in the NHL.

You build via the draft but we cannot solely depend on it. More than FA signings I am hoping we use some of our draft capital to land ready to plugin prospect or roster players. You always have some FA's willing to sign here but most high-end FA's generally do not want to go to expansion or re-building teams.

It's a whole lot easier to build around a couple of cornerstones than it is to try to build a team from scratch.

Look at Pittsburgh and their cup runs. They went to the finals, lost, went again, won, and then had to retool. But they have been contenders for going on 15 years and won 3 cups just re-tooling around two star centers and one allstar defenseman.

People forget that they were really bad for a long time to build that core. They drafted Fifth overall, First overall, Second overall, First overall, and Second overall in a 5 year span. (always makes me laugh on the main boards when Penguins fans make fun of tanking teams....)

Now there is no way Seattle will be that bad for that long (or get that lucky), but we can look at the Chicago or LA models, where they got a few pieces, won, retooled a bit and won again.

Beneirs could possibly be a high end #2 center. They get some luck and end up with a top line center or D in this draft, and maybe another quality piece next year, or sign a younger UFA center or D to add to the core, and the build becomes much easier.

Once you have a few marquee pieces, with the state tax situation, Seattle could easily be a desirable destination for quality UFAs .

It likely won't happen if they go out and overpay for a couple of aging top UFA wingers and then their window shifts and they start trading away prospects and draft capitol to win now. This team is not ready. Wait for the farm to be filled so there are productive ELCs in the mix, that way you can beat the cap and produce a winner.

 

[GrungeHockey]

Yeah well, this is the Kraken forum. This team is at least 5 years from that point if not more.

Umm, more, a lot more.

 

[Gniwder]

Umm, more, a lot more.

Not gonna disagree with you. I was being generous, lol, people here like optimism.

I am hoping for more watchable hockey in that time span considering the high draft picks this team will have.

 

[dylanmacarthur]

This is one of the silliest posts I’ve seen yet. Francis drafted great for the Canes, and was tasked with dismantling a crap team to start over again. He was only there for four seasons, not five and completely laid the groundwork for the Canes. He signed Slavin and Pesce to great contrasts, traded for TT, signed Williams...

Racism by Peters under Francis? Nice try. He kicked a player on the bench and was talked to about it, no problems ever again. Peters incident with racism was with another team.

I can’t even tell if this is a serious post. Kraken fans, you at the very least have a GM that’s great at building the foundation of a team, which is what you need. Can he turn the corner after he accumulates enough assets? We don’t know that yet, he was never given a chance in Carolina. I’m rooting for you guys and despite the tough season find the team actually fun to watch. Goaltending let you down at times it seemed.

Of all the ridiculous things said here the drafting might be the worst. Every single first and second round pick Francis selected made it. That’s an impressive feat. The last draft after he left was actually his draft too, as none of the scouting staff left and they just went with the work they had already done. Jack Drury is from that draft so the first and second round streak will be intact.

First round draft picks have a 90%+ chance of making it and 2nd round have a 70%+ chance. That's not especially impressive......

 

[dylanmacarthur]

I still think you stay the coarse for one more miserable year. Sign a few lesser pieces this offseason, get a better system and clean up the PK and defensive coverage, and sell heavy again next TDL.

Draft well and the first wave of ELCs should be almost ready. the following year.

The team would have a ton of cap, and you would have a much stronger foundation in the desert and the start of the ELC pipeline flow. Stay cap flexible, and you'd have the ability to throw a state-income-tax-free top contract offer at a guy like MacKinnon or Matthews.

They shouldn't be fighting to sign top UFAs this early and then trading assets to help them try to make the post season as an eight seed unless they want to be a perrenial bubble team.

Mackinnon and Mathews will never even take a phone call from the Kraken.

 

[Mike Jones]

The question is what do we do between now and year 3 to get there. The team is not going to get there solely on the basis of our drafted players. If we are lucky Beniers adjusts quickly to the NHL and is productive by the end of next season. But I do not expect our top pick from this season is going to start producing right away in their D + 1 year in the NHL.

You build via the draft but we cannot solely depend on it. More than FA signings I am hoping we use some of our draft capital to land ready to plugin prospect or roster players. You always have some FA's willing to sign here but most high-end FA's generally do not want to go to expansion or re-building teams.

One thing Seattle can do in year 2 is go after 2-3 RFAs who aren't qualified by their teams. I think that happened to Florida's Duclair. Teams with cap issues don't want to pay their pending RFAs and Seattle has the cap space to sign them.

 

[The Marquis]

One thing Seattle can do in year 2 is go after 2-3 RFAs who aren't qualified by their teams. I think that happened to Florida's Duclair. Teams with cap issues don't want to pay their pending RFAs and Seattle has the cap space to sign them.

The only problem is the free agent pool this year looks bleak save for 3 names, and competition will be stiff.

 

[Mike Jones]

The only problem is the free agent pool this year looks bleak save for 3 names, and competition will be stiff.

The UFA pool definitely but we still don't know which RFAs are going to be qualified and which ones are going to be let go. Teams with cap issues may not be able to pay their young free agents and Seattle can use their available cap space to their advantage and gamble on a couple of guys. Anthony Duclair, for example, was a restricted free agent who wasn't qualified by Ottawa. Florida jumped in and signed him and look at the season he's having there.

 

[GrungeHockey]

Not gonna disagree with you. I was being generous, lol, people here like optimism.

I am hoping for more watchable hockey in that time span considering the high draft picks this team will have.

Beniers will likely see some ice time next season. He will likely have ups and downs. I expect he will have a big impact in 3 years. If we get Wright, he might be a little faster so they might both impact us around the same time. That's your upwards trajectory point where you can start thinking playoffs. I doubt it's any faster than that.