Speculation: Rights to unsigned (KHL) Players (drafted)

[davinhimself]

Hey All,

Question about rights for drafted players who sign contracts / extensions in the KHL (and other leagues).
Specifically, as an Islander fan, I'm curious about Ilya Sorokin. Since he signed a KHL extension, I've heard conflicting opinions about whether the team would still hold his rights after his contract expires should he decide to come to North America.

Does anyone have any good sources/info for how drafted players rights are handled coming over from the KHL / other leagues?

Just want to better understand this dynamic and how/why players like Hayes/Schultz were able to get to UFA due to not signing with the team who drafted them...


Thanks!

Click to read more...

 

[oooooooooohCanada]

4 years for euros after some googling. I think that means Sorokin's rights expire after the 2018-2019 season.

 

[Alklha]

There is no transfer agreement with the KHL, so the Islanders retain the rights to Ilya Sorokin until 30 June 2023. That would be the first time he is eligible for UFA.

 

[BagHead]

There is no transfer agreement with the KHL, so the Islanders retain the rights to Ilya Sorokin until 30 June 2023. That would be the first time he is eligible for UFA.

This seems to be the consensus I've seen from people who are paid to know. Essentially, Russian players NHL rights are owned semi-permanently by the team that drafted them. UFA or trade are the only things that get them away from that team.

 

[nyr2k2]

The Rangers drafted Ilya Gorokhov in 1995 yet held his rights, per the team's website, until like 2013. So I don't know how that works. It's different for guys in the KHL than for European players as there's no transfer agreement with the KHL.

 

[Djp]

The Rangers drafted Ilya Gorokhov in 1995 yet held his rights, per the team's website, until like 2013. So I don't know how that works. It's different for guys in the KHL than for European players as there's no transfer agreement with the KHL.

Rules were different under old CBAs.


Generally its 4 years for European players from their draft year if there is exchange agreements.

If a player goes tot he KHL then teams retain their rights until they are UFAs.

Even then teams can retain rights beyond that due to special circumstances such as sides agree to arbitration then player signs with KHL.

 

[Vujtek]

There is no transfer agreement with the KHL, so the Islanders retain the rights to Ilya Sorokin until 30 June 2023. That would be the first time he is eligible for UFA.

Since there is no transfer agreement in place between NHL and KHL, the Islanders basically retain the rights to Ilya Sorokin indefinately. The UFA age does not apply here. Sorokin is classified as a 'defected player' and thus CBA article 10.2 (b) and League By-Law Section 15 are the applicable rules here. Those are complicated rules but essentially it comes down to Islanders owning the rights to Sorokin indefinately. Commissioner Bettman would need to rule him as a free agent if certain conditions are met and for Islanders to lose his rights at any point. Lets just say that's highly unlikely to happen, therefore Islanders retain his rights indefinately.

 

[mouser]

Yup, without the transfer agreement rights are held indefinitely. The reasoning makes sense--if there's no transfer agreement then there's never a guarantee the drafting team ever has an opportunity to sign the player.

I think these players still count against the 90 man reserve list, and teams are free to renounce their rights to these players if they chose to.

Searching the NHL player list reveals some names who rights are still being held past UFA age:

Anton Krysanov - drafted 2005 by Arizona
Sergei Gayduchenko - drafted 2007 by Florida

 

[Blue Goose]

Since there is no transfer agreement in place between NHL and KHL, the Islanders basically retain the rights to Ilya Sorokin indefinately. The UFA age does not apply here. Sorokin is classified as a 'defected player' and thus CBA article 10.2 (b) and League By-Law Section 15 are the applicable rules here. Those are complicated rules but essentially it comes down to Islanders owning the rights to Sorokin indefinately. Commissioner Bettman would need to rule him as a free agent if certain conditions are met and for Islanders to lose his rights at any point. Lets just say that's highly unlikely to happen, therefore Islanders retain his rights indefinately.

Yup, without the transfer agreement rights are held indefinitely. The reasoning makes sense--if there's no transfer agreement then there's never a guarantee the drafting team ever has an opportunity to sign the player.

I think these players still count against the 90 man reserve list, and teams are free to renounce their rights to these players if they chose to.

Searching the NHL player list reveals some names who rights are still being held past UFA age:

Anton Krysanov - drafted 2005 by Arizona
Sergei Gayduchenko - drafted 2007 by Florida

And these same rules would apply to Gusev and VGK, right?

 

[mouser]

And these same rules would apply to Gusev and VGK, right?

Would think so. Don't see any reason why Gusev would be different.

 

[seabass45]

Have a feeling Sorokin isn't going to make it as an islander. Would imagine he's a throw in to some sort of trade in the future. Garth can afford to do this with Soderstrom in the system.

 

[Vujtek]

And these same rules would apply to Gusev and VGK, right?

Yes, applies to all drafted players from a European league with no transfer agreement (Russia, Switzerland...) with the NHL. Once those players sign their ELC's (/first NHL-contracts), then they fall into RFA/UFA-system in regards to how long teams hold their rights, but prior to that teams hold their rights basically indefinitely.

 

[Blue Goose]

Would think so. Don't see any reason why Gusev would be different.

Yes, applies to all drafted players from a European league with no transfer agreement (Russia, Switzerland...) with the NHL. Once those players sign their ELC's (/first NHL-contracts), then they fall into RFA/UFA-system in regards to how long teams hold their rights, but prior to that teams hold their rights basically indefinitely.

Yeah, that's what I thought - thanks for confirming. Lots of TB fans laughing at McPhee thinking they'll just sign Gusev in two years, but I didn't think that was the case.

In fact, I'm convinced the reason that Gusev re-signed in the KHL for two more years, is so that when he does come over to Vegas in summer 2019, he can sign a one-year ELC that'll take him right to UFA (which makes perfect sense to me).