Red Line's Top 10 F's for Draft

[neelynugs]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/columnist/woodlief/2005-07-08-red-line-report_x.htm

have a look...

Click to read more...

 

[turnbuckle*]

Thanks alot. A pretty good list, although I think RLR got there players a little mixed up. Ryan's the player who is impossible to knock off the puck, not Latendresse. I suppose Red Line missed the Under 18s, because I saw Latendresse get knocked on his can at least a half dozen times by European 17-year-olds. That does not, IMO, make him "impossible" to move off the puck, especially when he reaches the next level and those bodychecks are coming from the likes of Rob Blake and Barrett Jackman.

I know I have been overly critical of Guillame on these boards, but it's only because he is overrated by some IMO, Red Line being one of them.

I don't think there's an NHL scout out there that doesn't list skating as a critical component in drafting a high-end prospect. That reason alone will more than likely keep him out of the top ten, perhaps even the top 20.

I've only talked to a couple of scouts this draft year so far due to the draft's uncertainty, but neither of them consider Latendresse to be top ten material, nor do I following ten or so viewings this past year. Ryan on the other hand is viewed as a surefire top 5 pick by both scouts I queried; in fact, he was considered a top three pick.

That's the beauty of the draft though. As was stated in another recent thread, no two teams' lists are the same, and this year there is much divergence of opinion on who will go where after Crosby, perhaps even more than most seasons, so I'm sure there will be some surprise picks throughout the first round. It should be fun - too bad it won't be down the road in Ottawa as first scheduled.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Skille over Ryan?

 

[misfit]

I think Skille is a great prospect, but I definately wouldn't rate him above Ryan and Koptar

 

[KH1]

I disagree with you about Latendresse, turnbuckle. I think that his game is a little less developed than some other prospects but he has shown nothing to suggest that he won't be a premeir power forward in the NHL. His game is powerful and he is a strong skater for somebody his size. Watch him be the one of the best five players from this draft.

 

[HabLover]

Thanks alot. A pretty good list, although I think RLR got there players a little mixed up. Ryan's the player who is impossible to knock off the puck, not Latendresse. I suppose Red Line missed the Under 18s, because I saw Latendresse get knocked on his can at least a half dozen times by European 17-year-olds. That does not, IMO, make him "impossible" to move off the puck, especially when he reaches the next level and those bodychecks are coming from the likes of Rob Blake and Barrett Jackman.

I know I have been overly critical of Guillame on these boards, but it's only because he is overrated by some IMO, Red Line being one of them.

I don't think there's an NHL scout out there that doesn't list skating as a critical component in drafting a high-end prospect. That reason alone will more than likely keep him out of the top ten, perhaps even the top 20.

I've only talked to a couple of scouts this draft year so far due to the draft's uncertainty, but neither of them consider Latendresse to be top ten material, nor do I following ten or so viewings this past year. Ryan on the other hand is viewed as a surefire top 5 pick by both scouts I queried; in fact, he was considered a top three pick.

That's the beauty of the draft though. As was stated in another recent thread, no two teams' lists are the same, and this year there is much divergence of opinion on who will go where after Crosby, perhaps even more than most seasons, so I'm sure there will be some surprise picks throughout the first round. It should be fun - too bad it won't be down the road in Ottawa as first scheduled.

OHG....you talked to two scouts!!!

Although Latendresse wasn't a FORCE over at the U18's, he was very good at times for Team Canada. The international game is different from NA and it probably doesn't fit Latendresse's game as it may some others. I mean, I was probably more impressed with a guy like Clune than I was w/Latendresse most of the time, but we all know Clune will not be selected before Latendresse at the NHL draft. Bobby Ryan would have had the same criticisms as Latendresse had he played at the U18's. Like I said the International game is different than NA and Latendresse's strength, which is down low on the smaller ice, smaller area from the boards in and more body contact is not as common on the big ice. Ryan would not have been as effective either.

 

[Anthony Mauro]

OHG....you talked to two scouts!!!

Although Latendresse wasn't a FORCE over at the U18's, he was very good at times for Team Canada. The international game is different from NA and it probably doesn't fit Latendresse's game as it may some others. I mean, I was probably more impressed with a guy like Clune than I was w/Latendresse most of the time, but we all know Clune will not be selected before Clune at the NHL draft. Bobby Ryan would have had the same criticisms as Latendresse had he played at the U18's. Like I said the International game is different than NA and Latendresse's strength, which is down low on the smaller ice, smaller area from the boards in and more body contact is not as common on the big ice. Ryan would not have been as effective either.

For a guy who refuses to take off his tinted glasses, you sure didn't check hard enough.

Obviously, Clune can't be selected before Clune. Priceless.

Now, your argument couldn't just be plain and simple that Ryan is American and Latendresse is Canadian? There is no argument then. Ryan is better than Latendresse. Ryan can dominate the game with the puck on his stick and doesn't show his skating deficiencies as poorly as Latendresse.

 

[HabLover]

For a guy who refuses to take off his tinted glasses, you sure didn't check hard enough.

Obviously, Clune can't be selected before Clune. Priceless.

Now, your argument couldn't just be plain and simple that Ryan is American and Latendresse is Canadian? There is no argument then. Ryan is better than Latendresse. Ryan can dominate the game with the puck on his stick and doesn't show his skating deficiencies as poorly as Latendresse.

Ha Ha......so Ryan hide's his skating deficiencies better than Latendresse, oh great comeback!

And I guess Latendresse can't handle the biscuit as well as Ryan, as you say, but check the stats there bud and Latendresse's look better than Ryan's over the last 2 yrs and he was injured to end last year and start this year, but still performed. You can also say Ryan played on one of the best teams in the CHL which should have helped.

Oh yeah, and Latendresse is Canadian too, so he's obviously better off the start!

 

[Hedberg]

What is with Redline's obssesion with Jack Skille. He is probably a mid 1st rounder, not a top 5 pick!

 

[HabLover]

What is with Redline's obssesion with Jack Skille. He is probably a mid 1st rounder, not a top 5 pick!

I don't know cuz he didn't do too much at the U18's, other than the single goal he scored, but yet somehow he was great there and is hyped by Redline.

 

[Legionnaire]

What is with Redline's obssesion with Jack Skille. He is probably a mid 1st rounder, not a top 5 pick!

Tournaments aren't everything guys.

Skille reminds me a lot of Ryan Smyth. Where do you think a guy like that should be select in this draft? Mid first round?

 

[neelynugs]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/columnist.jsp?content=20050708_104413_5812

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I don't know cuz he didn't do too much at the U18's, other than the single goal he scored, but yet somehow he was great there and is hyped by Redline.

While I would agree that Woodlief is a bit over-the-top in his enthusiasm for Skille, his job is to rate prospects based on their pro-potential, not necessarily critique every single shift they're on the ice. One shift, game, or even tournament isn't a secure indicator for how good a player is or will be. In Skille's case, Woodlief is looking at his talents (size, speed, shot, two-way play, hitting) and making a very good case that he can be an impact player at the next level. He might be wrong, but at least he and other scouts look at the big picture instead of being bogged down by a narrow view.

 

[ZombieMatt]

I've only talked to a couple of scouts this draft year so far due to the draft's uncertainty, but neither of them consider Latendresse to be top ten material, nor do I following ten or so viewings this past year. Ryan on the other hand is viewed as a surefire top 5 pick by both scouts I queried; in fact, he was considered a top three pick.

That's the beauty of the draft though. As was stated in another recent thread, no two teams' lists are the same, and this year there is much divergence of opinion on who will go where after Crosby, perhaps even more than most seasons, so I'm sure there will be some surprise picks throughout the first round. It should be fun - too bad it won't be down the road in Ottawa as first scheduled.

You're right, everything is different, and its a good point to make.

Example...one regional team scout told me he thought Latendresse may be top five worthy.

He's the best example, I think, this year of a guy all over the board.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/columnist.jsp?content=20050708_104413_5812

If he's that good, he culd be in the top 5 IMO. Certainly a player that I'd like to see on the Oilers!!!

 

[Puckhead]

What is with Redline's obssesion with Jack Skille. He is probably a mid 1st rounder, not a top 5 pick!

I never understood why people have to look at RLR or some other prospect rankings so literally. These are 17 and 18 year olds who are being selected, and with the exception of a few, none are really expected to step in and contribute, let alone dominate. RLR is a very significant rating publication, and they are not saying that Skille is a better than Ryan or Latendresse. They are trying to tell you that based on what they have seen thus far in their play, and what they feel their personal make up is all about, the type of player they will be. Which is what they are there to do. So really, you can't say any of these rating services are out to lunch, until you look back in about 3-5 years in most cases and compare then with what we are reading now.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

For a guy who refuses to take off his tinted glasses, you sure didn't check hard enough.

Obviously, Clune can't be selected before Clune. Priceless.

Now, your argument couldn't just be plain and simple that Ryan is American and Latendresse is Canadian? There is no argument then. Ryan is better than Latendresse. Ryan can dominate the game with the puck on his stick and doesn't show his skating deficiencies as poorly as Latendresse.

This is definitely the funniest thing on HFBoards yet, no disrespect to anyone.

 

[Anthony Mauro]

This is definitely the funniest thing on HFBoards yet, no disrespect to anyone.

Was there disrespect towards me?

It IS a fact that HabLover's arguments stem from nationality time to time.

 

[Anthony Mauro]

Ha Ha......so Ryan hide's his skating deficiencies better than Latendresse, oh great comeback!

And I guess Latendresse can't handle the biscuit as well as Ryan, as you say, but check the stats there bud and Latendresse's look better than Ryan's over the last 2 yrs and he was injured to end last year and start this year, but still performed. You can also say Ryan played on one of the best teams in the CHL which should have helped.

Oh yeah, and Latendresse is Canadian too, so he's obviously better off the start!

Bobby Ryan
2003-2004 Regular Season 65 22 17 39 52
2004-2005 Regular Season 62 37 52 89 51
2005 Playoffs 8 2 7 9 2 8

Latendresse, Guillaume
2003-2004 Regular Season 53 24 25 49 66
2004-2005 Regular Season 65 29 49 78 76
2005 Playoffs 6 6 4 10 7

I think you're stretching a bit, bud. They don't look that different. And Ryan's team was only obviously better because of RYAN. The guy was dominant, mostly game in and game out. Can't say that about Latendresse.

 

[FearTheFlyers]

And Ryan's team was only obviously better because of RYAN.

For the most part, this is true.

 

[HabLover]

Bobby Ryan
2003-2004 Regular Season 65 22 17 39 52
2004-2005 Regular Season 62 37 52 89 51
2005 Playoffs 8 2 7 9 2 8

Latendresse, Guillaume
2003-2004 Regular Season 53 24 25 49 66
2004-2005 Regular Season 65 29 49 78 76
2005 Playoffs 6 6 4 10 7

I think you're stretching a bit, bud. They don't look that different. And Ryan's team was only obviously better because of RYAN. The guy was dominant, mostly game in and game out. Can't say that about Latendresse.

Oh yeah, of course man, it was all becuz of Mr. Ryan that Owen Sound had some success this year. It probably didn't have anything to do with the fact they were one of the better defensive teams in the OHL this year. Or it probably didn't have anything to do with Brad Richardson having a breakout year after being injured the year before. Yeah, you're right, it was all big bad Bobby Ryan!