Recycling the same coaches

[Rob]

The last couple weeks we have seen NHL teams hire coaches that have already been fired in the NHL. Jim Montgomery. Rick Bowness. Bruce Cassidy. John Tortorella.

Do you think the NHL recycles coaches more than other sports leagues?

Click to read more...

 

[Suntouchable13]

I think NBA does it quite a bit too. For example, Scott Brooks went from Oklahoma City, to Washington, now he is coaching Portland. Frank Vogel coached Indiana, then Orlando, then LA Lakers. 2 example, sure, but there are plenty more.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Just to play devils advocate here for a second, maybe there's a serious talent void in the major junior/college/amateur/pro hockey coaching pool. HF this could be your call to action.

 

[Pens x]

GM’s are lazy AF in the NHL when it comes to recycling coaches.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

what "fresh new face" has come up and been successful in recent years?

 

[Breakers]

NFL is the worst out of the major sports
1: perform well as an assistant
2: get head coaching job
3: perform like garbage in role and get fired
4: get assistant coach job

And repeat cycle

 

[Bounces R Way]

what "fresh new face" has come up and been successful in recent years?

Jared Bednar. Jon Cooper.

 

[Cuphead]

NFL is the worst out of the major sports
1: perform well as an assistant
2: get head coaching job
3: perform like garbage in role and get fired
4: get assistant coach job

And repeat cycle

This is called the Peter Principle; promotion until they reach a level of relative incompetence.

Good head coaches are rare and don't last forever. It makes sense to give a good assistant coach or coordinator with a proven skillset, a chance at the next level.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Coaching positions at prestigious college football and basketball programs pay better than the NHL. So, at least the NFL and NBA at least have an excuse. Hockey has a major farm system that doesn't pay very well and they still recycle coaches. Hockey also requires far less in-game strategy, so the impact of head coaching is less than either football or basketball. Just an old boys club through and through.

 

[EpochLink]

I think the NFL has better support when it comes to new coaches getting a fresh start. They start out being assistants/coordinators then jump to the head coaching ranks.

 

[Mr Positive]

teams want instant resutls. At least the veterans have some established track record. There's also an established record of coach just "losing the room", and so even though they fail with their team they achieve success with a new team, as a fresh voice.

 

[Menzinger]

Combination of pro hockey front office guys are too insular and not wanting to go beyond the small circle of guys they're comfortable with.

Paired with the pressure to deliver instant results.


Still funny that they think a coach whose spent the last half decade failing with two other teams is just going to automatically turn things around when they hire him...

 

[Clint Eastwood]

Please please please kill this narrative. This has gotta be a meme or running joke at this point right?

List of coaches who were on their first run/are about to have their first run

Marty St. Louis
Andre Tourigny
Don Granato
Derek King ----> Luke Richardson
Brad Larsen
Jay Woodcroft
Dean Evason
DJ Smith
Sheldon Keefe
Derek Lalonde
Lane Lambert
Rod The Bod
Jon Cooper
Jared Bednar


Doesn't even factor in some of the recently fired coaches too like David Quinn, Andrew Brunette, Jeremy Colliton, Dominik Ducharme and Jeff Blashill who to be frank, all sucked.

And plenty of these "recycled coaches" are excellent at their jobs like Cassidy, Boudreau, Laviolette, Sutter, and Sullivan. This is also Montgomery's second run as an NHL head coach. His first gig wasn't even 5 years ago.

So please, for the love of baby Jesus, stop posting this thread every 10 minutes.

 

[Hisch13r]

It’s the NHL way. Once you get into that old boys club you basically have a job for life.

 

[Jacob]

Jared Bednar. Jon Cooper.

And for every one of those there’s a Ducharme, Colliton, Quinn, Green, Blashill.

The “recycled” coaches often have success; Sullivan, Berube, Gallant, Cassidy. I think nothing really prepares anyone for coaching in the NHL and you have to learn on the job and that usually means making mistakes and not having a ton of success at first. Nobody wants a coach that needs to learn as he goes, they want someone that has already figured it out.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

It’s the NHL way. Once you get into that old boys club you basically have a job for life.

not really.

 

[Woodrow]

Here's the list of coaches who won the cup on the 4th team they coached:
Darryl Sutter
Pat Burns
Scotty Bowman(he also won with the second and fifth team he coached)
Jacques Demers

And coaches who won on the third team they coached

Joel Quenneville
Claude Julien
Mike Keenan
Dick Irvin (he also won with the second team he coached)
Art Ross
Tommy Gorman (he also won with the second team he coached)




Of the 39 coaches who head coached last season 14 of them were on at least their 3rd team.

 

[EpochLink]

It’s the NHL way. Once you get into that old boys club you basically have a job for life.

Ask Mike Gillis that…got fired in 2014 and hasn’t sniffed any NHL management job since.

Now works for the NHLPA in some capacity.

 

[Nasti]

Ask Mike Gillis that…got fired in 2014 and hasn’t sniffed any NHL management job since.

Now works for the NHLPA in some capacity.

Gillis made some enemies along the way.

 

[Artorius Horus T]

its a sum of many things

old boys club
false believe in na superiority
money
fear
locality
control

etc. etc.

The funny thing is, as much as it is "home grown, old boys club league"
NHL always ends up copying what we Europeans create,
most famously the Red Machine,

What ever innovation we make, you copy.

So i suppose...you guys know that Europe is actually better at coaching
and better at many things, so if you'd brought in European head coach,
more would follow and you would have to admit European superiority.

 

[Mikeshane]

There are all these stats for all sorts of things hasn't anyone looked at this. It gets complained about so much I would think some analytics master would have the answers for us. Why have you failed us masters of analytics.

1. How does the NHL compare with other leagues for recycling coaches.
2. What is the winning percentage of first time coaches versus coaches with previous experience.
3. Who is better at winning playoff series' first time or experienced coaches.

 

[ES]

I think it's a bit overplayed.

Here are 32 (actually 33) most recent new coaches who have started a season (includes those who start their first season in the autumn)

1.-3. (new hires in 2022)
Derek Lalonde
Luke Richardson
Lane Lambert
4.-5. (mid-season hires 2021-22 who continued)
Martin St. Louis
Jay Woodcroft
6. (new hire in 2021)
André Tourigny
7.-8. (mid-season hires in 2020-21 who continued)
Dominique Ducharme
Don Granato
9.-12. (mid-season hires in 2019-20 who continued)
Dean Evason
Sheldon Keefe
D.J. Smith
Geoff Ward
13. (mid-season hire in 2018-19 who continued)
Jeremy Colliton
14.-17. (new hires in 2018)
Rod Brind'Amour
Jim Montgomery
David Quinn
Todd Reirden
19.-21. (new hires in 2017)
Bob Boughner
Travis Green
Phil Housley
22. (mid-season hire in 2016-17 who continued)
Doug Weight
23. (new hire in 2016)
Jared Bednar
24.-26. (new hires in 2015)
Jeff Blashill
Dave Hakstol
John Hynes
27. (mid-season hire in 2014-15 who continued)
Dave Cameron
28.-30. (new hires in 2014)
Willie Desjardins
Mike Johnston
Bill Peters
31. (mid-season hire in 2013-14 who continued)
Craig Berube
32.-33. (new hires in 2013)
Dallas Eakins
Patrick Roy

Jon Cooper slots just outside as he was hired in the middle of the season 2012-13. Additionally, following coaches have got a job mid-season, but have not continued into next season.
Andrew Brunette
Derek King
Dave Lowry
Bob Murray
Ryan Huska (two games between Ward and Sutter in CGY)
Tom Rowe
Todd Nelson
Peter Horachek (twice)

 

[Super Hans]

Just to play devils advocate here for a second, maybe there's a serious talent void in the major junior/college/amateur/pro hockey coaching pool. HF this could be your call to action.

I can't even teach the urinals to not overflow at my current gig, let alone teach a bunch of kids how to play hockey. How much do these guys make, is it more than $0? Might give it a try.

 

[IslesNorway]

There's certainly a few names that just goes around and around endlessly. They have just about enough success somewhere to ensure they'll get a new gig somewhere else.

Coaching in the NHL is either a season or two, perform badly, and you'll never be seen again, or you join the cycle.

 

[Butch 19]

GM’s are lazy AF in the NHL when it comes to recycling coaches.

Good, well thought-out response,,,

Would read again.