"Rebuilding" is infecting sports

[Pilky01]

Salary caps are fundamentally bad for sport.

Baseball is undergoing an unprecedented and much needed self correction. Leagues like the NHL and NBA will have a much more difficult time getting spending under control.

 

[JJ68]

1st overall pick should be given to the #1 team that doesn't make the playoffs. That would encourage teams to stay competitive, make trades and build. The absolute worst is being caught in mediocrity hell. You can't make a run in the playoffs, or just miss the playoffs every year and still get a crappy pick in the 10-20 range.

Totally agree

 

[LeafsNation75]

you know it's funny how bad the flyers were in 06-07 say what you want about holmgren but he was a genus from being the worst in one year to the next year a successful year despite not getting the first overall pick, he turned the team around in one year, i mean he traded for a goalie in biron and a defensive ready player in coburn, parent, upshall during that dreadful season, he didnt get draft picks, he went after players. in the offseason he wasnt finished, he traded for hartnell, kimo timonen, lupul, jason smith, signed briere. he didnt rely on picks, he went after players and that's what turned our team around, if homer didnt make those moves, we would be the oilers of bad. we didnt win the cup in 10 but he really should get alot of credit, i mean that team was bad in the toilet like oilers and turned it around in one season by making gutsy moves and that paid off.

that's what alot of bad teams do, they rely on picks and dont trade them to fix your team now.

all im saying if the rangers gm is gutsy like homer was this offseason, i think he can turn that team around, it's just the matter of taking risks to build that team.

Do you ever say what if the Flyers got the 1st pick in 2007, because it was Patrick Kane who scored the Stanley Cup winning goal against them in 2010.

 

[Soundgarden]

Not a big picture view. How long have you been watching hockey? The game has changed massively because of the cap. Teams lost their identity and every team is built the same now. Also killed rivalries.

More than 20 years. What team do you root for?

My team certainly never lost it's identity, in fact it's made their identity evolve into something better. Again, it may just be the team you root for, my team has plenty of bad blood when we meet Chicago, Anaheim, Dallas or St. Louis.

 

[tucson83]

Do you ever say what if the Flyers got the 1st pick in 2007, because it was Patrick Kane who scored the Stanley Cup winning goal against them in 2010.

that what sucks about the lottery, it is what is.

 

[AIexisLafreniereNYR]

If only the Knicks took this approach. It only took Porzingis tearing his ACL to start playing the young guys more, and yet they never traded their vets.

Rebuilding and "tanking" is crucial

 

[jetsforever]

If all that matter is that your favorite team is competitive every single year, perhaps try college sports.

or European soccer

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Hawks didn't tank for Kane/Toews they just sucked. Think they're a prime example of why the system works. As has been mentioned the periennial tankers like EDM usually stay in the basement.

Wait? You say Chicago didnt tank just sucked, and then Edmonton is tanking?

Edmonton isnt purposely tanking, they just suck.

Pick one or the other.

 

[Deuce22]

Tanking is intentionally losing games in order to heighten the odds of a high draft pick. This is rare.

Rebuilding is trading off older or more expensive players in order to eventually field a better team. It is a reasonable decision when management doesn't think the current players are capable of competing for a cup.

Sucking is being bad because of poor management.

These are 3 different things and it is important not to lump them together.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Are the NBA and MLB competitive?

I wouldn't know because I don't bother tuning in because those leagues are pre-determined as far as I can tell. You already know your team has no chance before the season even begins.

I'm a fan of the salary cap and also support the "rebuild" because it is the only way you will get top talent. How else do you think you can get core franchise players?

Only one way to do it so better get on it.

 

[VictoriaJetsFan]

The only way to eliminate tanking/rebuilding is to have the lottery be a true lottery, every team has the same shot at the number one pick.

 

[LeafsNation75]

The only way to eliminate tanking/rebuilding is to have the lottery be a true lottery, every team has the same shot at the number one pick.

The NHL should have done that during the 2005 lottery for Sidney Crosby.

 

[SotasicA]

The only way to eliminate tanking/rebuilding is to have the lottery be a true lottery, every team has the same shot at the number one pick.

Maybe every non-playoff team?

 

[Evincar]

Are the NBA and MLB competitive?

I wouldn't know because I don't bother tuning in because those leagues are pre-determined as far as I can tell. You already know your team has no chance before the season even begins.

I'm a fan of the salary cap and also support the "rebuild" because it is the only way you will get top talent. How else do you think you can get core franchise players?

Only one way to do it so better get on it.

How do you know its pre-determined if you dont tune in? Lol. I can speak for the MLB but not the NBA.

 

[RageQuit77]

"Rebuilding" itself isn't bad thing if it's done for the reason, and in rational, long term manner. And most importantly: ended when it's time to do that.

It's bad if "the process" becomes a perpetual, enormously hungry mouth of Molok that eats unhealthy high proportion of some of best, but expendable children of hockey, never giving a change to them to grow up and mature, in a shadow of extremely well paid High-Priest of sacrifice bowing to the dusty sculptures of long gone epic heroes, echoing sacred prayers for them from the pages of old tomes of distant memories of a dynastic time... and no matter how devotedly, the new dynasty never begins...

While a sacrificial mound of the bones of top draft picks and young assets keeps piling up. Over eras.

 

[Rorschach]

Teams rebuild because they have a team incapable for competing for the Cup, aka a "bad" team.

Rebuilds work when the team has a good organization but a bad team.

Rebuilds fail because a team has a bad organization and a bad team.

Don't only look at the latter as proof that rebuilds don't work. All of the multi-championship teams the last 10 years have had a multi-year rebuild. Chicago with three Cups drafting Kane and Toews; Los Angeles drafting Doughty, Hickey and Schenn; Boston drafting Kessel and Seguin; Pittsburgh drafting Fleury, Crosby, Malkin and Staal.

In each case the team above not only tanked for high picks, they also signed a lot of key free agents, made key trades and developed other non-lottery picks into core players. That's what good orgs do. Not doing those things as part of the rebuild is what causes some teams to be perpetually rebuilding.

And in order to have that good organization, the owner and front office need to be in sync.

 

[412 Others]

I love the salary cap. I love tanking.

These are my contributions to this thread.

 

[Whaleafs]

Teams only have a small window to compete for a championship. The Rangers had their window a few years ago peaking in the finals appearance. Then you inevitably regress. When you’re a marginal team you sell off assets to get high draft picks and start over and rebuild. This is the natural cycle. There are teams at the top and teams at the bottom. Are 31 teams supposed to finish 41-41-0 every year ? There’s no shame in rebuilding.

 

[Pilky01]

Are the NBA and MLB competitive?

I wouldn't know because I don't bother tuning in because those leagues are pre-determined as far as I can tell. You already know your team has no chance before the season even begins.

You stated you don’t watch those leagues, you don’t care about them, but regardless you already know the result is pre-determined.

If you did watch those sports you would know MLB has more parity than any other NA league.

Are 31 teams supposed to finish 41-41-0 every year ?

Yes. That is the entire point of parity. To push everyone towards the middle. 31 teams with the exact same record is the theoretical objective.

 

[Calendal]

Maybe every non-playoff team?

I really like this idea. I could give better odds every time a team does not pick in top3.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Salary caps are fundamentally bad for sport.

absolutely.

it dilutes talent, and kills the actual competitiveness of a league for a perceived competitiveness.

advocates say "look at all the teams in contention late" but ignore its because you have artificially forced all of the teams to the same level of mediocrity. by forcing the elevation of the bad teams, you also cut the legs out from under the great ones until every one is the same bunch of boring blah.

the cap is also the main reason scoring has been low. Scoring was so high in the 80s and early 90s because you had garbage teams and teams loaded with top talent. That let the top talent play against far inferior competition and jack up their stats in the process.

when every team is close together in talent, you get stale mates on the ice. Neither team can break through the other because every one is closely matched. So instead you get what we have now, guys skating up and down the ice hoping for 1 or 2 deflection goals.

 

[Machinehead]

Are the NBA and MLB competitive?

I wouldn't know because I don't bother tuning in because those leagues are pre-determined as far as I can tell. You already know your team has no chance before the season even begins.

I'm a fan of the salary cap and also support the "rebuild" because it is the only way you will get top talent. How else do you think you can get core franchise players?

Only one way to do it so better get on it.

 

[Whaleafs]

You stated you don’t watch those leagues, you don’t care about them, but regardless you already know the result is pre-determined.

If you did watch those sports you would know MLB has more parity than any other NA league.



Yes. That is the entire point of parity. To push everyone towards the middle. 31 teams with the exact same record is the theoretical objective.

Hyperbole is hard

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

lets check in on a no cap league that has revenue sharing...

MLB the last 10 years:

8 different World Series winners
15 different teams have made the World Series

Also in the last 10 years, only 3 teams have failed to make the playoffs. Mariners, Marlins and Padres.

And that is in a league where only 10 out of 30 teams makes the playoffs

 

[SprDaVE]

Get rid of the salary cap and you won't get rebuilding teams nearly as much.