Reactions to Army's Press Conference

[Reality Czech]

I don’t take a ton away from the interview that we/I didn’t already think or know.

I will say that I am getting annoyed with Army’s proclamations that fans won’t support the team unless it’s winning. It makes it sound like we don’t have committed fans. He continues to make claims that he knows our fans. He has also (in the past) alluded to some Canadian team fans as bing willing to show up even if the team is losing. I am not sure why the comparison was need. Army just doesn’t want to do it because he doesn’t want to live through it (he admitted that much in the presser). He could just say that a leave the fans out of it. He may also be right about a majority of our fans. But to me it’s unnecessary to bring up. He makes attempts not to knock his players or coaches, so why take a passive aggressive stance with fans?

If you and ownership don’t want to rebuild just say that and leave it at that. It’s your decision how you build the team. It’s our decision whether we support that or not.

He should have squashed Q as a potential coach by saying something like we are not going that route.

Maybe he reads this forum? I've seen fans openly say they hope the Blues lose and other unrealistic fans that seem to expect a contender every single year no matter what. Or people calling for his head after the first two below average seasons since the first year he took over as if they know how to run an NHL team better than he does.

I hope we do hire Q and it wouldn't surprise me if they are considering it. Everyone should check out his interview on the Cam and Strick Podcast if they're interested in his perspective instead of basing judgments on unconfirmed reports or speculation.

 

[Thallis]

Maybe he reads this forum? I've seen fans openly say they hope the Blues lose and other unrealistic fans that seem to expect a contender every single year no matter what. Or people calling for his head after the first two below average seasons since the first year he took over as if they know how to run an NHL team better than he does.

I hope we do hire Q and it wouldn't surprise me if they are considering it. Everyone should check out his interview on the Cam and Strick Podcast if they're interested in his perspective instead of basing judgments on unconfirmed reports or speculation.

Sounds like we'll support the team even if it's losing to me.

 

[Celtic Note]

Sounds like we'll support the team even if it's losing to me.

We already did once.

 

[TK 421]

Hard no on Q for me regardless of how good/bad a coach you may believe him to be. For me I don't think we should be willingly taking on the stigma that comes with associating with him even if it seems unfair, the potential PR blowback from that is too big for me to even consider it. He acquired that stink elsewhere so I view it as a needless misstep to willingly rekindle that relationship.

 

[bleedblue1223]

We already did once.

To an extent, there is the reality of the business side. If we tank and attendance drops to 12-15k, even for just a couple seasons like it did in 05-07, that can have a major long-term impact. I do think there is a limit to how bad the team can be, while also having strong attendance and healthy revenues.

 

[Celtic Note]

To an extent, there is the reality of the business side. If we tank and attendance drops to 12-15k, even for just a couple seasons like it did in 05-07, that can have a major long-term impact. I do think there is a limit to how bad the team can be, while also having strong attendance and healthy revenues.

I don’t disagree, but there was a comment here that he possibly reads our boards. A lot of us here lived though the last rebuild and we’re still committed to the team. It’s not like our entire fan base would just bail. And, the last rebuild was also not to try and make the team more competitive for the future. It was to sell. I think there would be more support this go around if people knew we needed to do it to get back to the Cup and that supporting the team through it was important to keeping our local ownership intact. Would that keep fair weather/bandwagon fans around? Probably not, but we also shouldn’t be a cap team if we are making that commitment so revenues wouldn’t need to be as high.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

While the die hards will remain the casual and fair weather fans will take a back seat until we get good again.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I think there is a balance, and for the most part Army has found that. We added a bunch of picks and Dean at the 2023 deadline, while also remaining competitive enough to not have a huge impact on revenues. I know some would prefer a more scorched earth approach to get higher picks, which is a valid approach, but I'm not sure ownership wants that, and from a hockey perspective, unless you get an absolute homerun pick with a generational player, it's certainly a risky strategy.

If we can move Buchnevich for a haul, I think Army will do that, but I also think he'll make some moves to try and keep us competitive.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

I so wish I could crush some beers with Army, Stillman and other management and talk off the record about the team and players and potential trades and stuff like that. Would love to get their honest, un-filtered opinions.

Some of them, you're going to have to get them really drunk to have a shot.

he did when answering about schenn as captain mentioned the support of thomas, parayko, and faulk (by name) and that support would be even stronger next year with a year in their roles. so while i don' think faulk is untouchable, i wouldn't read into his comments that he is necessarily on way our. faulk had rough year and army didn't want to pile on, but he isn't gonna praise guy for play below his standards.

Schenn is going to retire here. If Schenn had started his career here, I think Armstrong would be thinking about putting his number in the rafters.

He said ownership will let him spend if they agree it makes sense.

Which really means "ownership will let him spend" which really means "Tom Stillman will let him spend." Because outside of his first couple years, I don't think there's been a year here where he hasn't spent to the cap - and done it as quickly as possible in the offseason - and ownership has told him no, you can't do that.

I also agree that he see's Krug as holding some value, honestly I do as well. The problem is we don't have the defensive minded team to insulate his purely offensive instincts and minimize his mistakes. Taking all that into account I do think that Army tries once again to move on from Krug this summer and I could see some team will bite on a discounted price for him.

That's 3 years of retention. That's a long time to retain, a long time to have $3.25M off limits when supposedly trying to build a team that's able to make the playoffs even if we're filtering in kids on cheap contracts along the way.

As to whether Krug gets bought out, ... Armstrong backed way off from his December comments, back to his usual I don't like doing it, I think it's wasteful, is burning money remark. Which, those of you thinking he could tell Krug "take a trade or I'm sending you to Springfield" should listen to Armstrong's remark re: buyouts and it should kill every last iota of your idea that sending Krug to Springfield is ever going to happen - because if Armstrong thinks a buyout is lighting money on fire, sending $8M to play in Springfield is obliterating it with gallons of diesel fuel.] I think a buyout is still an absolute last resort, but I also think it's more on the table than in prior years.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

While the die hards will remain the casual and fair weather fans will take a back seat until we get good again.

Another thing to add to this. Since the last time re did a rebuild, ticket prices have skyrocketed, which will be another hurdle to getting people to go to games.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

I think there is a balance, and for the most part Army has found that. We added a bunch of picks and Dean at the 2023 deadline, while also remaining competitive enough to not have a huge impact on revenues.

Blues fans would support a rebuild knowing that's the plan. Maybe not thrilled about it, but the St. Louis metro area is a blue-collar area. As long as fans are being dealt with honestly and guys on the team are hard-working, they'll show up to support the team.

It's when they get the smoke blown up my ass messaging, ownership / management is clearly mailing it in while pretending otherwise, that fans get pissed off and stay away.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Blues fans would support a rebuild knowing that's the plan. Maybe not thrilled about it, but the St. Louis metro area is a blue-collar area. As long as fans are being dealt with honestly and guys on the team are hard-working, they'll show up to support the team.

It's when they get the smoke blown up my ass messaging, ownership / management is clearly mailing it in while pretending otherwise, that fans get pissed off and stay away.

Die-hards will, and the casuals will come back, but going from about 18k to about 15k is a real concern. If Army tells the fans that our plan is to tear it down, get rid of a few roster players and attempt to get multiple top 5 picks, what do you think attendance will look like? It won't be the worst in the league, but it'll be near the bottom for a couple seasons.

From your perspective, that's what they are doing, they are blowing smoke up your ass, but fans aren't staying away, attendance and support is the same as ever.

 

[Spektre]

Meh, it was pretty much as expected... oh and wow JR has gained weight..

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Die-hards will, and the casuals will come back, but going from about 18k to about 15k is a real concern. If Army tells the fans that our plan is to tear it down, get rid of a few roster players and attempt to get multiple top 5 picks, what do you think attendance will look like? It won't be the worst in the league, but it'll be near the bottom for a couple seasons.

From your perspective, that's what they are doing, they are blowing smoke up your ass, but fans aren't staying away, attendance and support is the same as ever.

1. If ticket prices are $60, $70, $80 a pop in the upper bowl on top of $15 beers, $12 sodas, $8 popcorns, $10 hot dogs (or whatever concessions are at a game) then yeah, attendance will drop to 15,000. Something about value of entertainment.

2. Again, I think attendance will be fine if everyone knows what the plan is, communications are open and honest, and fans can see hard-working guys and progress. If it's a roster largely made up of 30+ guys, one foot into retirement, and the kids on the team have max upsides of 3rd, 4th line guys and 6/7 defensemen they won't show up.

3. Attendance was technically a sellout this year, because tickets were sold early in the season on the promise this would be a playoff-contending team able to compete with a Dallas, ahead of a Winnipeg. And, because the team is still riding the post-Cup wave. Attendance was also technically a sellout last year, and we all recall late-season games where there were a handful of fans dressed as empty seats.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The promise that we'd be able to compete with Dallas and ahead of Winnipeg? You'll need to show receipts on that one. I think it's very real scenario that our attendance could end up like the Sharks. Buffalo has typically had strong attendance, so maybe people want to argue we are like that, but again, we can look at our last rebuild when we were terrible, I would expect similar results.

 

[Blueston]

The promise that we'd be able to compete with Dallas and ahead of Winnipeg? You'll need to show receipts on that one. I think it's very real scenario that our attendance could end up like the Sharks. Buffalo has typically had strong attendance, so maybe people want to argue we are like that, but again, we can look at our last rebuild when we were terrible, I would expect similar results.

yeah, Army was clear that we weren't gonna be on level of dallas or colorado. we ended up right at the point level that i think he and many of us expected, 87-93 points, in playoff race but not contender. he thought we would be on level with winnipeg, because (he said this explicitly yesterday) everyone expected winnipeg was gonna deal scheiffele and helle. when they kept them, that changed caclulus on jets. but it doesn't change where we are or our plan.

 

[Celtic Note]

The promise that we'd be able to compete with Dallas and ahead of Winnipeg? You'll need to show receipts on that one. I think it's very real scenario that our attendance could end up like the Sharks. Buffalo has typically had strong attendance, so maybe people want to argue we are like that, but again, we can look at our last rebuild when we were terrible, I would expect similar results.

Even if that is the case, why are teams other than us able to weather that reduction in attendance and we are not? That seems more like an ownership issue than a fan one. If the reason that the team cannot do a rebuild is that ownership cannot afford the hit, that’s is fine. But say that’s what’s up and leave it at that. Why bring the fans into as if it’s the fans fault we cannot do a rebuild. The owners cannot afford and our GM doesn’t want to go through it. That’s the reason. Other GMs and owners can do it. The Blues organization cannot. Ok. Fine. I can respect our ownership not having deep enough pockets (they still have a crazy return on investment ahead with the current valuation compared to the purchase price so they could always finance through debt if they have good financials).

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Die-hards will, and the casuals will come back, but going from about 18k to about 15k is a real concern.

On further thought, I should qualify my statement a bit.

I think in a rebuild we'd get fans to show up at about 17K, plus or minus 15%, and that would change depending on whether we're 10% through the rebuild, 25% through the rebuild, 50% through the rebuild, whatever the actuary chart says for that. And really the starting point isn't the thing, it's knowing that plus or minus part and how that compares to other teams in the league if they do a rebuild.

 

[bleedblue1223]

yeah, Army was clear that we weren't gonna be on level of dallas or colorado. we ended up right at the point level that i think he and many of us expected, 87-93 points, in playoff race but not contender. he thought we would be on level with winnipeg, because (he said this explicitly yesterday) everyone expected winnipeg was gonna deal scheiffele and helle. when they kept them, that changed caclulus on jets. but it doesn't change where we are or our plan.

Yeah, Jets exceeding expectations, doesn't change how we should have viewed our season. It would've been silly to say that we'd be competing with the Devils at the beginning of the year, but we were 11 points ahead of them.

 

[BlueKnight]

I don’t take a ton away from the interview that we/I didn’t already think or know.

I will say that I am getting annoyed with Army’s proclamations that fans won’t support the team unless it’s winning. It makes it sound like we don’t have committed fans. He continues to make claims that he knows our fans. He has also (in the past) alluded to some Canadian team fans as bing willing to show up even if the team is losing. I am not sure why the comparison was need. Army just doesn’t want to do it because he doesn’t want to live through it (he admitted that much in the presser). He could just say that a leave the fans out of it. He may also be right about a majority of our fans. But to me it’s unnecessary to bring up. He makes attempts not to knock his players or coaches, so why take a passive aggressive stance with fans?

If you and ownership don’t want to rebuild just say that and leave it at that. It’s your decision how you build the team. It’s our decision whether we support that or not.

He should have squashed Q as a potential coach by saying something like we are not going that route.

My thoughts as well and I want nothing to do with Q as coach.

If Army retires from hockey he would make a great politician.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Even if that is the case, why are teams other than us able to weather that reduction in attendance and we are not? That seems more like an ownership issue than a fan one. If the reason that the team cannot do a rebuild is that ownership cannot afford the hit, that’s is fine. But say that’s what’s up and leave it at that. Why bring the fans into as if it’s the fans fault we cannot do a rebuild. The owners cannot afford and our GM doesn’t want to go through it. That’s the reason. Other GMs and owners can do it. The Blues organization cannot. Ok. Fine. I can respect our ownership not having deep enough pockets (they still have a crazy return on investment ahead with the current valuation compared to the purchase price so they could always finance through debt if they have good financials).

I mean, it's not all of the above. Blues fans are not Cardinals fans and willing to go in record numbers if the team falls off. Stillman's group doesn't have the deepest of pockets or willing to go through years of financial loss, so they have a desire to not tank and get back to the playoffs in a relative short amount of time. The Blues organization is a team that has done well scouting in the mid/late 1st and early 2nd, so Army also probably feels that we can build a contender without having to tank and get a top 5 pick.

And what happens when you tank to the bottom, and you don't get a generational talent. What if you get guys like Kakko and Lafreniere. What if we get a #1 and they are Erik Johnson 2.0. What if you do land a star player, but in the years of tanking, you fail to build an actual team around them and you end up like Buffalo? I think this board focuses on the upside too much and ignores the risk.

 

[Majorityof1]

Yeah, Jets exceeding expectations, doesn't change how we should have viewed our season. It would've been silly to say that we'd be competing with the Devils at the beginning of the year, but we were 11 points ahead of them.

Let's not compare ourselves to a team that exceeded expectations. Instead let' compare ourselves to one who vastly underperformed expectations. I got to hand it to you, that is one hell of a glass half-full approach.

 

[BuLLeT1291]

I don’t take a ton away from the interview that we/I didn’t already think or know.

I will say that I am getting annoyed with Army’s proclamations that fans won’t support the team unless it’s winning. It makes it sound like we don’t have committed fans. He continues to make claims that he knows our fans. He has also (in the past) alluded to some Canadian team fans as bing willing to show up even if the team is losing. I am not sure why the comparison was need. Army just doesn’t want to do it because he doesn’t want to live through it (he admitted that much in the presser). He could just say that a leave the fans out of it. He may also be right about a majority of our fans. But to me it’s unnecessary to bring up. He makes attempts not to knock his players or coaches, so why take a passive aggressive stance with fans?

If you and ownership don’t want to rebuild just say that and leave it at that. It’s your decision how you build the team. It’s our decision whether we support that or not.

He should have squashed Q as a potential coach by saying something like we are not going that route.

Sounds like you just don’t want to hear the truth. He is 1000% correct though. The attendance falls below 10k a night if they actually rebuild and run into a SJ situation. This org could not handle that for 5+ years and he knows that. I am standing in Legrands right now waiting on a sandwich. You know how many people have any St. Louis Blues attire on? 0. There is more city attire on than Blues.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

And what happens when you tank to the bottom, and you don't get a generational talent. What if you get guys like Kakko and Lafreniere. What if we get a #1 and they are Erik Johnson 2.0. What if you do land a star player, but in the years of tanking, you fail to build an actual team around them and you end up like Buffalo? I think this board focuses on the upside too much and ignores the risk.

By that measure, why ever take any risk because there's potential downside? Nothing in life is guaranteed except death and taxes. Once upon a time, Bruce Springsteen's live album. Also once upon a time, showing up on Oprah's show for anything made you tens of millions of dollars at a minimum. Maybe today, Taylor Swift dropping new tracks and making billions upon billions of dollars. Maybe also that the Kardashians are never f***ing going away, no matter how annoying they get and how much people become omfg, stfu about them, no one f***ing cares.

If Armstrong is as good as people claim, the Buffalo scenario isn't happening. If he's not and it does, ... well, then we'll all know, won't we. You set up your best plan, try to execute on it as well as possible, adjust it if/when needed based on how events play out. You don't create a plan, decide you're sticking to it no matter what, and if the iceberg is dead ahead you ram right f***ing through it because I GOTTA PLAN, GODDAMNIT, I AIN'T BUDGING!

Sounds like you just don’t want to hear the truth. He is 1000% correct though. The attendance falls below 10k a night if they actually rebuild and run into a SJ situation. This org could not handle that for 5+ years and he knows that. I am standing in Legrands right now waiting on a sandwich. You know how many people have any St. Louis Blues attire on? 0. There is more city attire on than Blues.

Armstrong was talking 50-point seasons for 4, 5 years and not getting to be playoff competitive for 10. Let's tap down that hyperbole quite a bit, because it was (is) a very straw man statement to justify the current approach. With where we are and with the prospects we have and the pieces on hand, if we ended up in that situation something went (horribly) wrong.

"Sinking" to the 70s for a season, maybe two? I don't think that's unreasonable. No, it's not a guaranteed top-5, top-3, top-2 pick absent a lottery win, but you should get a lot better player at 5 than 16. Especially if our scouting staff is as good as people say it is. And again, no one is saying let's be utter shit for 4, 5 years, load the f*** up on top prospects and then come roaring out because everyone realizes the risks that follow that approach.

 

[Drubilly]

Sounds like you just don’t want to hear the truth. He is 1000% correct though. The attendance falls below 10k a night if they actually rebuild and run into a SJ situation. This org could not handle that for 5+ years and he knows that. I am standing in Legrands right now waiting on a sandwich. You know how many people have any St. Louis Blues attire on? 0. There is more city attire on than Blues.

Cool story bro but how’s that sammich??