Ranking On Roster Defenseman #7

[MadDevil]

I don't think it was that bizarre. Greene/Larsson was reliable (and very good at what they were asked to do) and we all know every coach loves, and often times lean on, reliable players.

 

[NjDevsRR]

Not a single dman in the bottom 4 had an adequate partner last season. None of the 4 were capable of anchoring a pairing.

Merrill and Severson are young and inexperienced it is reasonable at this point that neither can anchor a pairing.

But this all stemmed from Larsson and Greene being inseparable.

I half wonder if Larsson(chained to Greene) was used the way he was soley to trade him...because it made no sense whatsoever. If he was truly a budding #1 shutdown guy why wouldn't you put him with Moore or Merrill allowing Greene to baby sit a a Severson or even Schlemko to create two better pairings and spread out minutes and situations? The usage was bizare.

Interesting thought.

I did always wanted to see Moore with Larsson last year. I really feel like Moore can be more of an offensive threat if he has a reliable strong partner. His skating is world clas. I want to see him transitioning the puck up more often.

 

[Nubmer6]

Larsson with Gelinas was actually pretty good years ago. I'm surprised we never went back to them as an experiment. I could see Moore being even better paired with Lars. Too bad we'll never know now.

 

[JimEIV]

I don't think it was that bizarre. Greene/Larsson was reliable (and very good at what they were asked to do) and we all know every coach loves, and often times lean on, reliable players.

25 minute pair vs 40 minute 2 pairs? The usage wasn't just bizare it was idiotic.

And here is the catch.. they weren't very good as a top pairing... in fact they were the worst top pairing in the entire league in terms of possession, shots and points.

They were the boxer that last 12 rounds winning no rounds, landing no punches and we are celebrating the fact they didn't get knocked out.

Their usage and output was what you'd expect from a good bottom pairing for 15 ES minutes ..except they did it for 22 most nights as our first pair.

The way our defense was managed last season was horrible.

 

[Zippy316]

25 minute pair vs 40 minute 2 pairs? The usage wasn't just bizare it was idiotic.

And here is the catch.. they weren't very good as a top pairing... in fact they were the worst top pairing in the entire league in terms of possession, shots and points.

They were the boxer that last 12 rounds winning no rounds, landing no punches and we are celebrating the fact they didn't get knocked out.

Their usage and output was what you'd expect from a good bottom pairing for 15 ES minutes ..except they did it for 22 most nights as our first pair.

The way our defense was managed last season was horrible.

There were asked to shutdown the opponents top lines and they did that.

The way our team was constructed last year our best chance of winning was having Zajac, Greene, and Larsson neutralize a top line scoring wise while we capitalize with other lines -- usually Henrique's -- or the PP.

The likely alternative to what we did last year would've been Moore/Schlemko - Larsson and Greene - Severson. Would those pairings be able to handle going up against top lines? I would give the benefit of the doubt to Greene - Severson, but I'm not too sure about Moore/Schlemko in this.

 

[JimEIV]

There were asked to shutdown the opponents top lines and they did that.

Their usage was akin to having John Madden as your first line center.

 

[Eberle Is Edmonton13]

If Greene were to be traded, what kind of value would you be looking to get for him? Or in a vacuum what kind of value would you say he holds? Thanks

 

[njdevils1982]

If Greene were to be traded, what kind of value would you be looking to get for him? Or in a vacuum what kind of value would you say he holds? Thanks

well presented post.

i feel that any trade for greene would be like a trade for zajac. he's worth more to the team at this stage of his career than any meager return, so the "value" would have to be intriguing (and be real, no team is lining up to get him and lose anything worth it to them)

as for vacuum trade? i have no clue ……but remember, he is the captain of this team at the moment

maybe others would be more helpful to your question on that front

 

[VoidCreature]

I'm gonna be honest, and I don't know that this will be a popular opinion here, but Greene isn't a top pairing defenseman. He's a great #3 maybe a low end #2, but I think our goaltending has made our D look better than it is for a long time now. I don't think we've had any true top pairing guys since Niedermayer and Stevens. We certainly haven't had a #1 since then.

I also think Ben Lovejoy and Greene aren't that far apart, if there's any separation at all. Greene probably has more offense, and I think Shero wants to get that out of him more this year, so I doubt we see them paired up together unless it gets really grim with the young guys.

If we can pick up another top 4 type defender through trade I think we won't see too much backspin from last year.

 

[njdevils1982]

I'm gonna be honest, and I don't know that this will be a popular opinion here, but Greene isn't a top pairing defenseman. He's a great #3 maybe a low end #2, but I think our goaltending has made our D look better than it is for a long time now. I don't think we've had any true top pairing guys since Niedermayer and Stevens. We certainly haven't had a #1 since then.

I also think Ben Lovejoy and Greene aren't that far apart, if there's any separation at all. Greene probably has more offense, and I think Shero wants to get that out of him more this year, so I doubt we see them paired up together unless it gets really grim with the young guys.

If we can pick up another top 4 type defender through trade I think we won't see too much backspin from last year.

cmon ….we had paul martin as a bonafide #1 D man, hitting nothing in sight for a few seasons

he was awesome

 

[VoidCreature]

cmon ….we had paul martin as a bonafide #1 D man, hitting nothing in sight for a few seasons

he was awesome

Was he that good? I didn't watch much back then. If anyone came close it'd be him for sure.

 

[njdevils1982]

Was he that good? I didn't watch much back then. If anyone came close it'd be him for sure.

sarcasm.

he was the defacto #1 ... soft like a pillow or butter or 3 ply toilet paper. had a decent career but never a player that would take the team to any level better. and wasnt a 'leader type'

i hated him as a devil


greene is what the team needs now……charmin was a

"ok….. sure, if thats the best we got left and go with it"

a vanilla game

 

[Bleedred]

well presented post.

i feel that any trade for greene would be like a trade for zajac. he's worth more to the team at this stage of his career than any meager return, so the "value" would have to be intriguing (and be real, no team is lining up to get him and lose anything worth it to them)

as for vacuum trade? i have no clue ……but remember, he is the captain of this team at the moment

maybe others would be more helpful to your question on that front

This.

He's worth more to us than someone would be willing to trade for him, just like Cammalleri. Greene is 34 (will be less than a month into the season) and has 4 years left at $5 or $5.5 million per year. It's a more than fair contract, just like Cammalleri's. I just don't think many teams will be giving us fair value for any of these contracts, Zajac's included.

I'd want a #2 young but established defenseman for Greene, with the potential to be a #1. Not really sure what name I'd throw out there, but it's likely to get a laugh out of the fanbase with which whatever player it is, currently plays for.

 

[VoidCreature]

sarcasm.

he was the defacto #1 ... soft like a pillow or butter or 3 ply toilet paper. had a decent career but never a player that would take the team to any level better. and wasnt a 'leader type'

i hated him as a devil


greene is what the team needs now……charmin was a

"ok….. sure, if thats the best we got left and go with it"

a vanilla game

Oh.

Sarcasm is hard to read through text sometimes, at least for me.

My brother really liked Paul Martin, so mostly I get my view into what he was like from him.

He was a puck mover, I know that. Seemed serviceable on the Pens his few years there.

Edit: wait, Paul Martin was still on the team in 2010? Wow, how come I have like no memory of how he played for us?

 

[njdevils1982]

Oh.

Sarcasm is hard to read through text sometimes, at least for me.

My brother really liked Paul Martin, so mostly I get my view into what he was like from him.

He was a puck mover, I know that. Seemed serviceable on the Pens his few years there.

serviceable sure. but in the wake of the 05 lockout he was not a beacon of light of the roster for me.

in every all time devils thread martin falls behind colin white 100 times out of 100

white filled his role properly. martin just did what he did…unremarkable but 'there'

greene inspires the team. therein lies the differences

 

[Triumph]

Paul Martin was really good and criminally underrated. Hell, I forgot about him until he was mentioned by someone else. I think he was a top 30 defender in the league in 2009, but maybe not any other year - one problem was he rarely scored goals.

Andy Greene probably isn't in the top 30 and may not have been at any point during his career, but he's definitely in the top 60 and possibly in the top 40.

 

[NjDevsRR]

Greene may not be a bonafide #1 but he is a legit 1st pairing dman in this league. Speaking of criminally underrated, Greene is definitely that. He is such a smart hockey player.

 

[MadDevil]

Greene and Zajac are both kind of in that "just a really good, reliable player" mold. They'll never get accolades because they don't do much offensively, but they play a very important role on this team, especially given where we are with kids hopefully taking over some of their responsibilities in the next few years.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Martin might have been soft, but he was a very good defender for us during his time.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Greene is a top pairing defenseman but not an elite one because he is great defensively but limited offensively. It's also worth noting that all his coaches have very high opinions of Greene as a player you can rely on and pair with other defensemen to bring out the best in those defensemen. Greene is an extremely valuable player to this team not just because of what he can do defensively but how much he can help other players develop their games. He's extremely underrated, apparently even by other Devils fans

 

[Devils Dominion]

There is no question that the defense has to be upgraded by October.

 

[lucscaps]

There is a part of me that enjoys that Martin lost the cup the his year to the pens. After all he left us to go there for a better shot at winning it.

 

[MadDevil]

There is no question that the defense has to be upgraded by October.

I don't know how much you can really upgrade it between now and October. I think at this point we probably see what we've got early in the season and then adjust accordingly.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

I still cringe that Moore is ranked higher than Merrill. Merrill has such better hockey sense and more potential. He just needs to stay healthy.