Provorov: Over or underrated?

[Starat327]

So I've been reading the trade forum for years now and I feel like I've got a decent grasp on players values, team needs, etc.

Lately, I've seen a lot more threads where people ask for Provorov in trades where I can't quite fathom Provorov being the ask (Boeser being the latest, but I've seen it for players like Connor, Ehler, and Mantha, to name a few).

So I don't know if I'm necessarily in the right spot given the team he plays for, but is Provorov underrated because Philly isn't playing great hockey, and because Ghost is ahead of him offensively, limiting his PP time? Or do you think we overrate him because he's our first homegrown potentially elite defender in quite some time, and we watch him all the time.

Thoughts?

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[hatcher]

He is good but along way to go. Best we got

 

[Striiker]

So I've been reading the trade forum for years now and I feel like I've got a decent grasp on players values, team needs, etc.

Lately, I've seen a lot more threads where people ask for Provorov in trades where I can't quite fathom Provorov being the ask (Boeser being the latest, but I've seen it for players like Connor, Ehler, and Mantha, to name a few).

So I don't know if I'm necessarily in the right spot given the team he plays for, but is Provorov underrated because Philly isn't playing great hockey, and because Ghost is ahead of him offensively, limiting his PP time? Or do you think we overrate him because he's our first homegrown potentially elite defender in quite some time, and we watch him all the time.

Thoughts?

If you're getting player value based on things written on the trade board then you absolutely do not have a decent grasp. That place is full of idiots who have no clue what they're talking about.

 

[Starat327]

If you're getting player value based on things written on the trade board then you absolutely do not have a decent grasp. That place is full of idiots who have no clue what they're talking about.

I don't base my values off what' written on the trade board. I read it to understand teams needs and how they would value a given player based off of that.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

No

 

[Rebels57]

Massively Underrated by non-Flyers fans.
Slightly Overrated by Flyers fans.

But this is taking into account that he is only 20 and not even close to entering his prime yet. He is a special young player that will only get better.

 

[whitstifier]

Massively Underrated by non-Flyers fans.
Slightly Overrated by Flyers fans.

But this is taking into account that he is only 20 and not even close to entering his prime yet. He is a special young player that will only get better.

Point per game, bb

 

[Jtown]

overrated. LOve him but he still has a long way to go in terms of offense, pp, and costly turnovers. I wonder how much of his stick handling issues are a result of that huge stick of his.

 

[Rebels57]

overrated. LOve him but he still has a long way to go in terms of offense, pp, and costly turnovers. I wonder how much of his stick handling issues are a result of that huge stick of his.

His 14 ES points in 38 games with 42.4% ozone starts and Andrew MacDonald as his partner is actually really good.

He is tied with 8 other defensemen for the 7th most ES points this season. Some of the guys he is tied with?

P.K. Subban
Zack Werenski
Victor Hedman

2017‑2018 NHL Defensemen Scoring Leaders

He has lower ozone starts than all of them too.

His PP production is not good, but the entire unit is dysfunctional and badly needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. There is more to give from him there.

 

[deadhead]

Provorov is a work in progress, he's regressed a little this year defensively because he's being more aggressive on offense and loses focus at times. But he leads the team in TOI by a wide margin at 20 years old, but like most NHL players at that age, is going through growing pains.

In a couple years, he'll be 25+ minutes a game and a top 5 NHL defenseman.
Top 10 ES scorer who is also a key PK player.
His biggest deficiencies right now are turnovers and lack of feel for QB the PP.

 

[JXC]

If this is what a Sophomore Slump looks like, the Flyers have a gem. Timonen’s IQ, Desjardins’ poise, Howe’s skating, and, of course, the creative chops of

 

[Appleyard]

I think objectively he would be a #2 right now on a contender... and is capable of playing as a #1 at age 20.

I mean, I am not sure it is possible to overrate that in a way. There have only been a handful of players since the lockout capable of being as good as he has so far at the same age.

 

[tictactoe]

Sophomore player? Overrated of course.

 

[flyersfan187]

I do like how Provy has started to play more in the offensive zone as well as throw the body more this season. Provy does all the little things well already and his hockey IQ is off the charts. If we could somehow pry away Doughty or Karlsson to pair with him that would be an amazing to watch for many seasons. Or we could wait and see how Myers progresses and that could be a top pair as well.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

I think he is pretty fairly rated. I don't think anyone is saying he's anything too crazy of a great player and I certainly don't think anyone is calling him a bust by any means. He's been our best defender pretty much since he got here and he looks like he is heading for top pair status. He's not a #1 franchise guy RN but that isn't out of the question. He's only what, 19? 20? Kids going to be a mainstay on the blueline for sure.

 

[Goatee220]

I think he's rated accurately right now - a future franchise defenseman and Norris trophy candidate. Not there yet, but within a couple seasons. I think he'll be there in the 2019-2020 season.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

I think he's rated accurately right now - a future franchise defenseman and Norris trophy candidate. Not there yet, but within a couple seasons. I think he'll be there in the 2019-2020 season.

I think it would be fantastic if our D corps were further along the development curve* and we could play him a little less. I think right now his minutes are probably a little heavy. I think he will be fine long-term and it won't do any permanent damage, but it would be nice to not run him into the ground. Even the Terminator eventually melted.

* Part of that is our slow-burn with guys who are ready (Sanheim), part of it is bad luck with injuries (Morin), and part of it is idiotic coaching (Fire ****ing Hakstol).

 

[deadhead]

Top D-men play 25 minutes a night, since his rookie season, Doughty's lowest TOI have been 24:59 and 24:54, he averaged 29:00 in 2014-15.

Plus, read about Provorov's training regime, it's legendary, like Jerry Rice level.

THE MACHINE.

 

[David St Hubbins]

I think it would be fantastic if our D corps were further along the development curve* and we could play him a little less. I think right now his minutes are probably a little heavy. I think he will be fine long-term and it won't do any permanent damage, but it would be nice to not run him into the ground.

We are seeing that right now with more turnovers from him and ghost. But the good news is AMac and Manning ar3 getting the sweet sweet veteran cheese.

 

[usahockey22flyers]

Imagine not having Provy and Ghost?

Lol

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I think many Flyers fans give Provorov a lot more leeway for his (many) mistakes than they do with other defensemen. Many also act as if he's already an elite #1 defenseman. He isn't yet. But he's their horse, and it's promising that he can handle all the responsibilities they give him at age 21.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I’m still not ready to put him into that Norris potential at this point.

 

[Tripod]

Yeah Weber and Suter never won a Norris but have been great D men. I don't think he will post enough points to ever win it.

 

[Magua]

Weber and Suter played PP1 their entire primes when they get nominations. They still do. It’s just impossible without PP1 time to even get a nomination. Even a look at a nomination. 40-45 points with PP2 time is tough enough.

But if you look at it, we have a Norris caliber PP d-man, a Norris caliber top pair, and the penalty kill......man, who the f*** knows. We are piecemealing our Norris trophy winner together and then some. It doesn’t have to be one guy. Depth and overlap is a luxury.

 

[Qyburn]

and it's promising that he can handle all the responsibilities they give him at age 21.

I might even go so far as to call it stunning. That level of consistency is just about unheard of at that age. Even moreso the year before.

I won't even be mad if he never wins the Offensive Defenseman trophy. I know which quality I'd rather be the more prominent of the two.