Poll: What's the largest gap in skill between professional hockey leagues in North America?

[Tburkulowsys]

Long time lurker, first-time poster here. Curious as to your opinion as to which rung on the hockey ladder is biggest between the five professional North American leagues.

I've excluded the LNAH in the poll as it seems to be its own thing and is not even trying to be some sort of developmental league the way the FPHL and SPHL are. I would like to hear where you think it sits when compared to the other five leagues in the comments though.

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[BruinsFan37]

Would the worst NHL team beat the best AHL team?
Would the worst AHL team beat the beat ECHL team?
Would the worst ECHL team beat the best SPHL team?
Would the worst SPHL team beat the best FPHL team?

Is basically what you're asking. In a seven game series, worst vs. best my gut says;

NHL (worst) vs. AHL (best) - NHL wins 4-1
AHL (worst) vs. ECHL (best) - AHL wins 4-2
ECHL (worst) vs. SPHL (best) - ECHL wins 4-3
SPHL (worst) vs. FPHL (best) - SPHL wins 4-3

 

[Centrum Hockey]

Would the worst NHL team beat the best AHL team?
Would the worst AHL team beat the beat ECHL team?
Would the worst ECHL team beat the best SPHL team?
Would the worst SPHL team beat the best FPHL team?

Is basically what you're asking. In a seven game series, worst vs. best my gut says;

NHL (worst) vs. AHL (best) - NHL wins 4-1
AHL (worst) vs. ECHL (best) - AHL wins 4-2
ECHL (worst) vs. SPHL (best) - ECHL wins 4-3
SPHL (worst) vs. FPHL (best) - SPHL wins 4-3

If the Detroit Red Wings played the Milwaukee Admirals in a Series it would be a 4 game blow out in favor of Detroit. The Red Wings defencemen would make at least 90 percent of the Admirals forwards and centers ineffective.

 

[Tburkulowsys]

I haven't thought of it in terms of the best vs the worst team scenario. I came up with the question when I got bored and started looking at team rosters on Elite Prospects. From that, I figured the biggest gap was actually between the FPHL and the SPHL as I found the FPHL seems to source its players from rather low-level junior and college club programs, whereas the SPHL generally gets decent college varsity and junior A players. I took a brief look at the Carolina Thunderbirds roster and it does look like they might be somewhat competitive at the SPHL level, however.

 

[210]

If the Detroit Red Wings played the Milwaukee Admirals in a Series it would be a 4 game blow out in favor of Detroit. The Red Wings defencemen would make at least 90 percent of the Admirals forwards and centers ineffective.

Yeah, this. The only way a team of a lesser league wins even one game is by total blind luck.

 

[FissionFire]

Even the worst players on the Red Wings are all-star level AHL players. It would be a one-sided thrashing if they played a series, especially with how well Bernier has played this year. If you started Howard, you might at least have a game or two close.

 

[royals119]

Looking at it from an individual player perspective,
Many AHL players are going to be NHL regulars, and in fact some are full time NHL players on rehab.
Most regular ECHL players could hold their own as AHL fourth liners and the top tier sometimes end up in the NHL
Top level SPHL players are fill ins in the ECHL. The occasional guy who sticks was usually an ECHL player who got cut out of training camp due to too many players being assigned from the AHL and is just biding his time in the SPHL.
I can't comment on the FHL to SPHL gap, since I haven't seen a lot of their games, but looking at the rosters the FHL looks like mostly local guys who would otherwise be playing rec league, where the SPHL are generally much more like pro teams.

I would say the gap generally gets smaller as you go up, so the biggest would be FHL to SPHL, then SPHL to ECHL, etc. Of course a team from a higher league would be a team from a lower league in a real game every time.

 

[Tburkulowsys]

Looking at it from an individual player perspective,
Many AHL players are going to be NHL regulars, and in fact some are full time NHL players on rehab.
Most regular ECHL players could hold their own as AHL fourth liners and the top tier sometimes end up in the NHL
Top level SPHL players are fill ins in the ECHL. The occasional guy who sticks was usually an ECHL player who got cut out of training camp due to too many players being assigned from the AHL and is just biding his time in the SPHL.
I can't comment on the FHL to SPHL gap, since I haven't seen a lot of their games, but looking at the rosters the FHL looks like mostly local guys who would otherwise be playing rec league, where the SPHL are generally much more like pro teams.

I would say the gap generally gets smaller as you go up, so the biggest would be FHL to SPHL, then SPHL to ECHL, etc. Of course a team from a higher league would be a team from a lower league in a real game every time.

Yeah, that's my perspective as well, but I've not watched much minor league hockey at all. Mostly just clips on You Tube. I'm wondering if those that voted AHL to ECHL are looking at things more from a team, rather than an individual player perspective. I've heard that the ECHL has especially unstable rosters and that may also affect the level of play to some degree.

 

[royals119]

Yeah, that's my perspective as well, but I've not watched much minor league hockey at all. Mostly just clips on You Tube. I'm wondering if those that voted AHL to ECHL are looking at things more from a team, rather than an individual player perspective. I've heard that the ECHL has especially unstable rosters and that may also affect the level of play to some degree.

That is true, and they also play a lot of 3 in 3 games with crazy travel. The Royals played last Friday in Maine, Saturday in Massachusetts, and Sunday afternoon at home in Pennsylvania. If you only saw the Sunday game your opinion of the league would be much different. Also, if you see teams right after they have added three players off waivers and signed two guys from the SPHL, they aren't going to look as good as if they have their entire regular roster playing together for two weeks. Partly from an individual skill level standpoint and also from a systems standpoint. The coach has probably simplified things a lot with that first roster, and there are still going to be lots of "system" errors, plus missed passes from guys not remembering if that team mate they just met at morning skate who is headed up ice and partially behind an opponent, is right handed or left handed. The ECHL also runs with 10 forwards, so when you figure injuries, penalties, etc at least 8 of the ten will get PP time, and at least six of ten will play PK, so some guys are getting a ton of ice time compared to the NHL or AHL, particularly if they start the game shorthanded or have a couple fights or a misconduct handed out.

Most true first and second line ECHL players have the skill to play in the AHL. They often don't get the opportunity because there are only so many spots available, and lots of drafted players and AHL vets that get those opportunities first.

 

[JMCx4]

I voted ECHL to SPHL, but AHL to ECHL could be a very close second. While the lower tier teams in each pair may send a considerable number of players to the higher league every season, very few of those players get any playing time while far more simply fill a roster/bench spot (sometimes for several teams in sequence in the case of ECHL assignments). In contrast, the FPHL has more than a few players each year who make the jump to the SPHL & stick.

 

[Tburkulowsys]

Yeah, this. The only way a team of a lesser league wins even one game is by total blind luck.

I figure if you've dropped the Milwaukee Admirals in the NHL to be the 32nd team, they'd actually have a better season than the Rumble Bees did this year. I think they might be around the level of the 1974-75 Washington Capitals.

 

[210]

I figure if you've dropped the Milwaukee Admirals in the NHL to be the 32nd team, they'd actually have a better season than the Rumble Bees did this year. I think they might be around the level of the 1974-75 Washington Capitals.

Well, you'd have to take out all the Nashville contracted players, and that would end any hope at all of winning anything.

 

[JMCx4]

Well, you'd have to take out all the Nashville contracted players, and that would end any hope at all of winning anything.

Under those conditions, Rumble Bees defeat the MIL Ads 1-0 after 32 rounds of a shootout & the Ads' EBUG pulls a hammy. A moral victory for Barry Soskin & the FPHL!

 

[Cyclones Rock]

This is a great poll!

Given the NHL as the world's best league, part of me wants to say the gap between the best and the 2nd best North American league is the highest.

The other part says that the gap between the lowest affiliated league (ECHL) and the next (SPHL) is the highest. Most players who try out for the ECHL after junior/college and don't make it call it a career and move on to their life's work. Given that other than Scott Darling that there are no players who have ever made it from the SPHL to the NHL (and Darling had extenuating circumstances) and there are plenty of ECHL grads in the NHL, I think I'll have to go ECHL to SPHL, though the high end talent in the NHL compared to the AHL players is a huge gap as well.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

It's from the SPHL to the ECHL. Players who are on an NHL contract but assigned to the AHL are there because the NHL club believes that they can play in the NHL. Same with AHL contracted players assigned to the ECHL.

SPHL players who get called up to the ECHL fill third-pair D spots, third line/10th forward spots, and generally clear waivers when the player they're filling in for returns from call-up or injury. That means that no coach or exec believes that player can positively impact their team in the ECHL at that time. A lot of those players also cleared waivers after ECHL training camps concluded.

It's important to note that there is more game film available on players than ever before. There's a saying, "There's no secrets in scouting," meaning that every player is known to a certain degree or they can be easily seen. When (INSERT SPHL PLAYER NAME HERE) hits the ECHL waiver wire, coaches and players know who he is and what he can do. It's not like they're signing guys off a faxed resume from Peter Cooney anymore.

 

[Tburkulowsys]

This is a great poll!

Given the NHL as the world's best league, part of me wants to say the gap between the best and the 2nd best North American league is the highest.

The other part says that the gap between the lowest affiliated league (ECHL) and the next (SPHL) is the highest. Most players who try out for the ECHL after junior/college and don't make it call it a career and move on to their life's work. Given that other than Scott Darling that there are no players who have ever made it from the SPHL to the NHL (and Darling had extenuating circumstances) and there are plenty of ECHL grads in the NHL, I think I'll have to go ECHL to SPHL, though the high end talent in the NHL compared to the AHL players is a huge gap as well.

Yeah, I think the answer to the question as phrased " which rung on the hockey ladder is biggest between the five professional North American leagues" is likely ECHL to SPHL. The FPHL to SPHL and the ECHL to AHL options both seem to have more players with overlapping skill levels. When I answered SPHL to FPHL what I think I noticed is that the FPHL lacks any sort of depth. They actually do get a decent share of viable SPHL guys among their college club and third-tier junior sourced players.

 

[CrazyEddie20]

Yeah, I think the answer to the question as phrased " which rung on the hockey ladder is biggest between the five professional North American leagues" is likely ECHL to SPHL. The FPHL to SPHL and the ECHL to AHL options both seem to have more players with overlapping skill levels. When I answered SPHL to FPHL what I think I noticed is that the FPHL lacks any sort of depth. They actually do get a decent share of viable SPHL guys among their college club and third-tier junior sourced players.

Right, basically if not for the FPHL, the guys that aren't starters in that league wouldn't be playing "professional" hockey. Some of them weren't even good enough to play real college hockey or free-to-play Junior before playing in the FPHL. That just goes to show what a joke that league is -- that plenty of players who are well above the skill level required to play in a "professional" league for "prospects" would rather NOT PLAY than play in the FPHL.

 

[Tburkulowsys]

Right, basically if not for the FPHL, the guys that aren't starters in that league wouldn't be playing "professional" hockey. Some of them weren't even good enough to play real college hockey or free-to-play Junior before playing in the FPHL. That just goes to show what a joke that league is -- that plenty of players who are well above the skill level required to play in a "professional" league for "prospects" would rather NOT PLAY than play in the FPHL.

Yeah, an FPHL roster seems to resemble a random selection of 20 or so people from Adrian College that happen to play hockey. There's probably enough talent there to fill a five team FPHL conference.