Playoff #1Cs - lots on this list. We don't have one.

[Buds17]

View attachment 869807

Matthews aint it. All these guys can carry the puck and drive play. They aren't just shooters.

NHL Playoffs All-Time Points per Game Leaders

NHL players who hold the all-time record for the most points per game in NHL playoffs. All-time playoff points per game leaders for NHL players.

www.quanthockey.com

Hot Take: Matthews is a right winger.

Hotter Take: Cale Makar's production means more as a RD than as a C!

One of the worst things about these playoffs in particular was that some of the team's "best" performers didn't play in all of the games (Matthews, Nylander, Woll).

 

[notbias]

An elite #C needs to generate more offence than they give up.


View attachment 869826

Playoff #1C


DEFINITIONS:

(1)imo a #1 center is above a PPG tho if someone brings elite defence it can be a bit lower

(2) needs to be able to handle a large workload and be effective in all situations, first line center just means he is on the first line in terms of production.

(3)
Top 30 in the entire league in scoring (not just among centers)
Top 25 in the entire league in +/-
Top 10 in the entire league in even strength points

Matthews generates more offense than he gives up... so does Marner for that matter.

They are both around the McDavid level for scoring vs getting scored on.

Drai is an even player by the way.

I'll help him out...
Let be generous and say the Oilers started their rebuild in 2010 with the Hall pick. (they picked top 10 the season before also, and missed the playoffs every season since losing in the Final in 2006 up till 2017)
2010 -1st Hall
2011 -1st, 19th RNH & Klefbom
2012 -1st (Yak)
2013 -3rd Nurse
2014 -3rd (Drais)
2015 -1st (McD)
2016 - 4th Pulj
2017 -22nd Yama (finally a little improvement and made playoffs)
2018 -10th Bouchard (sucking again)
2019 -8th Broberg
2020 -14th Holloway (made playoffs)
then they made the playoffs in 2017, and right back to missing twice in a row, with the Best player on the planet since 2015.
The Oilers best season since 2006 was winning 2 rounds in 2022 while missing the playoffs 12 times in that span with insanely high draft picks to help jumpstart their rebuild(s)
4x #1 overall
2x #3 overall
1x #4 overall
thats insane, and was over 7 seasons, and 2 of those picks was a 'bust'.
So, given when they started their rebuild and the insanely high picks over a 7 season straight period they should be a Dynasty team, so, they do suck. (until they win a cup)

Leafs started in 2014 with the Nylander pick at #8
then Marner @ #4
and Matthews at #1 in 2017 and made the playoffs that season (same season as the Oilers) and never missed since.
The Leafs were not expected to make the playoffs until 2020 at earliest, but exceeded expectations and took every team they played (as the underdog) to 7 games. ...they also suck, (until they win a cup) but at least they didnt have a 5 year head start and only had 3 top 10 picks over 3 seasons to become a regular playoff team. their biggest problem was not sucking for longer and stocking up more players.


Florida is one of the top defensive teams this season, even if they dont look it. (statistically) TB isnt but, they still have Hedman and Vasy.

Ya, I just posted their record since McDavid joined, figured I'd at least allow them to look like a somewhat credible franchise.

But when you have McDavid and your best season is getting swept in round 3, it is still not good enough.

 

[Jojalu]

An elite #C needs to generate more offence than they give up.


View attachment 869826

Playoff #1C


DEFINITIONS:

(1)imo a #1 center is above a PPG tho if someone brings elite defence it can be a bit lower

(2) needs to be able to handle a large workload and be effective in all situations, first line center just means he is on the first line in terms of production.

(3)
Top 30 in the entire league in scoring (not just among centers)
Top 25 in the entire league in +/-
Top 10 in the entire league in even strength points

There are 39 players in NHL history who are a PPG in the playoffs. ( Min 50 points) You don't need to be, or will be PPG to be a #1 C.

The 10 active players who currently are PPG in playoffs will most likely fall out or regress slightly as their careers continue outside of Crosby.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

There are 39 players in NHL history who are a PPG in the playoffs. ( Min 50 points) You don't need to be, or will be PPG to be a #1 C.

Well our first line C is the best paid ever.

No where near the PPG list

 

[Jojalu]

Well our first line C is the best paid ever.

No where near the PPG list

He is top 100 all time. I think 64th

 

[notbias]

Well our first line C is the best paid ever.

No where near the PPG list

We should just get a player like Gretzky, our players are too selfish, and Gretzky only topped out at 6.5 million.

 

[Jojalu]

Well our first line C is the best paid ever.

No where near the PPG list

He needs a really good year and a deep run.

If he goes 30 in 20 or something like that, he would be in the top 20.

He has probably half his career left to figure it out. Hopefully next year

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Looking at this list I'd like to sign Gretzky, can't believe he's not already taken

 

[Trapper]

You know how people have been saying for 5 years they’d like to see the team under a different coach.
Well I’d like to see Matthews under a different core.

 

[JKG33]

Watching these playoffs I can't help but think how much better off this team would be if Matthews and Marner were swapped out for Miller and Guentzel. Two objectively "worse" regular season players, that're paid significantly less, yet they're ripping it up these playoffs.

It's absolutely pathetic that those two in the playoffs are so far behind their regular season and contract comparables, and they're even behind some "inferior" players too

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Well I’d like to see Matthews under a different core.

I’m sure McJesus would like a playoff run with an NHL goalie.

 

[kevsh]

MacKinnon
0.42 Career GPG - Season
0.55 Career GPG - Playoffs

Draisaitl
0.48 Career GPG - Season
0.66 Career GPG - Playoffs

Pastrnak
0.51 Career GPG - Season
0.44 Career GPG - Playoffs

Kucherov
0.44 Career GPG - Season
0.36 Career GPG - Playoffs

Crosby
0.44 Career GPG - Season
0.31 Career GPG - Playoffs

Ovechkin
0.58 Career GPG - Season
0.44 Career GPG - Playoffs

Matthews
0.65 Career GPG - Season
0.41 Career GPG - Playoffs

For some players their goal scoring elevates in the playoffs, some drops a bit and others - okay, one - it falls off a cliff.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

For some players their goal scoring elevates in the playoffs, some drops a bit and others - okay, one - it falls off a cliff.

Points is worse because Matthews can’t pass as well as other top C.

It’s not Matthews fault. His game just isn’t there in the post season (open look shots).

It never will be.

He needs McDavid to set him up.

 

[socko]

Let's see what the team looks like without Marner, at least I hope we see it. I believe Matthews will appear different like he did when he was playing with Domi and Bert. I believe ridding the team of Marner will help the entire team, his attitude gone will be addition by subtraction. That doesn't mean everything will be roses, but it will help.

Draisaitl is great on the powerplay, better than Auston, but Auston is better in every other respect. Drai is not a good skater and he doesn't play defense or score 5 on 5 like Auston does. He also benefits from playing on the same team as McDavid much like Hyman does. There is no way in hell he's a better player than Auston. Negative ghost rider.

 

[AvroArrow]

I've seen some pretty ridiculous takes form you, but saying the Oilers suck has to be high on the list of clueless opinions.

Please explain to us how you arrived at this conclusion?

They're dog shit as a team, they are a legitimate lottery team without McDavid. Their goaltending is the worst in the entire league by a mile, like Samsonov would be a better option.

Their blue line is horrendous. Ekholm is a great defender, Nurse is average, Bouchard is literally carried by Ekholm defensively and carried by McDavid offensively. Stat watchers will tell you he's "elite offensively" the same way they preached that Tyson Barrie is elite and a norris candidate, lots of clueless posts about him.

Draisaitl is one of the worst players off the puck. Elite offensively but bad defensively with minimal effort in his own end. Hyman is great, but again without McDavid he doesn't even score 30 goals this year.

 

[Stephen]

My feeling about Auston Matthews is he has all the tools to play whatever way he wants and shows us little bits and pieces of a Selke guy, a Rocket winner, Hart and Lindsay level, shot blocking machine, takeaway artist, faceoff specialist, the ceiling is unlimited. But it’s never consistently the same recipe every night of the week, the motivation levels are up and down and come playoff time you always see glimpses of him taking it to that Mackinnon, Draisaitl, McDavid level but it’s brief flashes.

I also think he’s more of a player who responds to the environment around him. He’s not really a leader who can dictate how the game should go. When he’s with Marner, he star to mirroring Marner, giving up all his size and power advantages to play east west hockey. When he’s with a Domi Bertuzzi line, suddenly he looks more dialled in as a north south guy. He seemed more blue collar when he had Hyman as his digger.

I think the path forward for him is something like what Florida did to build around Aleksander Barkov. You put enough junk yard dogs around him doing all that ugly playoff stuff, he’ll join the fight and be part of it. And I think it’ll be successful. You put him with a dekes and dangles offensive crew he’s not going to spearhead it with a power game.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

the motivation levels are up and down and come playoff time you always see glimpses of him taking it to that Mackinnon, Draisaitl, McDavid level but it’s brief flashes.

You can teach someone how to be a more effective 3rd D, how to play shit down hockey, how to be a better Centre.

You can’t change drive. Drive is an unnatural if not irrational desire to win. That’s not AM34.

 

[Stephen]

You can teach someone how to be a more effective 3rd D, how to play shit down hockey, how to be a better Centre.

You can’t change drive. Drive is an unnatural if not irrational desire to win. That’s not AM34.

I think you build the team with the characteristics you value around Auston Matthews and allow him to gamebreak within the environment that you’ve created. Matthews does a good job mirroring what’s around him. But he doesn’t dictate it. In Florida, Barkov and Huberdeau’s teams were always so soft and underachieving but you put Tkachuk, Bennett, Montour, Cousins and friends around Barkov, give Huberdeau the boot and it just works better.

 

[Scion]

Why is this thread not locked?

 

[socko]

You can teach someone how to be a more effective 3rd D, how to play shit down hockey, how to be a better Centre.

You can’t change drive. Drive is an unnatural if not irrational desire to win. That’s not AM34.

I agree with the 2nd sentence. But not really the first.

Nobody is going to make Draisitil a good skater at the point or have him playing shutdown hockey. That is frankly less realistic than Matthews developing a drive. I saw Yzerman develop a drive in his career, extremely rare but it has happened. Draisitil will be a good skater when pigs fly. He's a PP specialist. Nothing wrong with that. He's phenomenal on the PP. Wish we had him.

 

[Smif]

The thing is Ham he could do it if he wanted to. He could take command of the puck and be that elite play driver. He does have the skills. He just doesn't have the desire.

I think he has the desire, he just doesn't have the killer instinct.

Growing up our guys have been so immensely skilled that they didn't have to try very hard, same thing in the regular season. In the playoffs the intensity level grows by so much our guys become average players.

 

[notbias]

You can teach someone how to be a more effective 3rd D, how to play shit down hockey, how to be a better Centre.

You can’t change drive. Drive is an unnatural if not irrational desire to win. That’s not AM34.

Why do you think he doesn't have drive?

Is it because he usually leads the forwards in all the stats that people use for "effort"?

He just can't score, it's always an issue of execution, not drive.

You don't get to his level without drive.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Why do you think he doesn't have drive?

He has a lot of drive.

I’m talking about non-normal obsessional drive (“elite”) that happens with some elite players.

You wouldn’t want to have that kind of drive. It’s awkward. Ask Crosby’s wife.

 

[HockeyVirus]

I think the takes about Matthews are ridiculous. He was outstanding round 1 last year and was this year until he was hurt. He has figured it out IMO.

A new coach and new core he will play his part

 

[57 Years No Cup]

You can teach someone how to be a more effective 3rd D, how to play shit down hockey, how to be a better Centre.

You can’t change drive. Drive is an unnatural if not irrational desire to win. That’s not AM34.

AKA A SORE LOSER. I would love a team full of sore losers.

Why is this thread not locked?

Why should it be locked?