Players who put up a lot of points, but you question their value

[Eisen]

About that, I don't think we should really count his points as he was too small and weak to play in the NHL so those points trophy's and he being a role-model ought to be taken away. He was a WHA player-nothing more.

Gretzky wished he was Shepelev.

 

[Sam Spade]

Ryan Johansen.

My first thought......

A lot of points?

My second thought.

But I know, he is the new Mr. Intangibles, and he produces "in other ways".

 

[Acallabeth]

Gretzky wished he was Shepelev.

You mean Toews, don't you?

 

[Legionnaire]

Jonathan Toews has scored 20 or more goals every single year he has been in the league.

 

[Armourboy]

Trying to name a few players that haven't already been mentioned:

Viktor Arvidsson, Evgenii Dadonov, Corey Perry, Kyle Connor.

Arvy would not be on this list. There was a question about whether he could keep the production up, but he earns the points he gets. He is always in the middle of things and even plays on both the PK and PP. In fact he is often the net front guy on many of the goals scored.

If I was going to put anyone on the Preds on this list it might be Craig Smith. He puts in goals and skates hard but he feels like a guy you could replace fairly easily.

 

[HOUSUTON]

Klingberg tbh

 

[NoNecksCurse]

Arvy would not be on this list. There was a question about whether he could keep the production up, but he earns the points he gets. He is always in the middle of things and even plays on both the PK and PP. In fact he is often the net front guy on many of the goals scored.

If I was going to put anyone on the Preds on this list it might be Craig Smith. He puts in goals and skates hard but he feels like a guy you could replace fairly easily.

would definitely not be smith.

 

[FinnishCoyote]

Not even putting up many points anymore, but Duclair. Guy is so lazy

 

[Osprey]

I really hate the premise of this thread. If you're putting up points, you're contributing to your team's success and that has value. Like, what devalues a player despite their production? Lack of defense or perceived effort? Attitude problems?

See my post on the last page. Yes, poor defense devalues production. If you can understand how putting up points contributes to team success, then you should also be able to understand how allowing points against takes away from it. Your "value" largely comes down to whether your goals for minus goals against is positive or negative. If other teams score more against you when you're on the ice than your own team scores, then it's hard to argue that you add much value to the team.

 

[GreatSaveLuongo]

This thread begins and ends with Thomas Vanek

 

[Face Of Bear]

Erik Karlsson.

 

[skillhockey]

See my post on the last page. Yes, poor defense devalues production. If you can understand how putting up points contributes to team success, then you should also be able to understand how allowing points against takes away from it. Your "value" largely comes down to whether your goals for minus goals against is positive or negative. If other teams score more against you when you're on the ice than your own team scores, then it's hard to argue that you add much value to the team.

You're not alone on the ice, it' gm/coach job to get right ppl around. Be it really talented offensive winger or center, all you need to do is pair him with really good defensive forward and the talented guy can do pretty much what he wants. Defending is lot easier than creating offense, especially when it can be done as a team effort. There are players who are good at both but they're extremely rare.

 

[pheasant]

Arvy would not be on this list. There was a question about whether he could keep the production up, but he earns the points he gets. He is always in the middle of things and even plays on both the PK and PP. In fact he is often the net front guy on many of the goals scored.

If I was going to put anyone on the Preds on this list it might be Craig Smith. He puts in goals and skates hard but he feels like a guy you could replace fairly easily.

Wasn't until you mentioned the Preds that I realised my mistake. I was thinking of Cam Atkinson, from Columbus. Just flubbed the names. Atkinson, not Arvidsson.

 

[DrDangles]

McDavid. Yeah he gets a lot of points when he's on the ice, but when's the last time he scored when he was on the bench? It gives pause and makes you wonder if there are some work-ethic issues at play.

I read this in Kevin's voice

 

[ItMe]

Voracek

 

[Fire Sweeney]

Merio Lemyou is #1 in history of sports for this

 

[Gord]

Eberle.

 

[Osprey]

You're not alone on the ice, it' gm/coach job to get right ppl around. Be it really talented offensive winger or center, all you need to do is pair him with really good defensive forward and the talented guy can do pretty much what he wants. Defending is lot easier than creating offense, especially when it can be done as a team effort. There are players who are good at both but they're extremely rare.

I agree with this when it comes to forwards, but my original post and the OP's were in reference to defensemen. For defensemen, unlike forwards, how well they defend is just as important as how well they create offense, if not more so. You might even argue that, for defensemen, scoring is easier than defending, since defensemen will put up points simply by being put on the ice with scoring forwards, but keeping pucks out of their nets takes more attention on their part.

 

[Atoyot]

Patches, JVR, and moneyman(E. Kane).

All offense, no defense, don't do the grunt work, no clutch.

The guys that will score 2 goals in a 6-2 blowout.

So you've never watched Kane play, got it. All he does is grunt work.

 

[KingsHockey24]

Toews

The title was players who put up a LOT of points. Not 40 points silly.

 

[Nithoniniel]

Phil Kessel used to have this reputation.

Was about to say. This fit Kessel from a few years ago perfectly. He was also the epitome of a "you can't win with him"-player. Good example for why that kind of reasoning need to die.

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Out of that forward core, who else would you put on? Just because you don’t have better options /=/ he’s good defensively. Patches is a ghost. I’ll admit I’m no Habs fan but the only time I see his name on the scoresheet is in games that are lopsided wins/loses.

That has been the case for a number of seasons, not simply this year.

Your hate is blinding you.

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

This thread begins and ends with Thomas Vanek

JVR is a very strong candidate.

 

[Les Averman]

Voracek is a very interesting one for the Flyers. Obviously a big time point producer but he really makes some boneheaded decisions. Awful turnovers, forces passes when presented with an open shot, and just disappears for random parts of games. Great example was last week, against, I believe the Canadiens, when he was horrendous for the first 59 minutes of the game. Then he scores the game tying goal with a minute left and the game winner in OT.

Definitely puts up the points and is a very important player, but sometimes I wonder if the team would be better off dealing a guy like that for a huge haul back. Won't happen and not saying we should, but he's a very frustrating player at times.

 

[Soundgarden]

would definitely not be smith.

Maybe last year, but this year he's really on his game.