Player Discussion: Olli "Captain" Juolevi | II

[UsernameWasTaken]

I see the feelings about Juolevi are still a bit mixed. Re his play - keep in mind that even before the draft it was obvious to all that he doesn't currently have the strength to play in the NHL (very few 18 year olds do) - so to the extent he doesn't physically look NHL-ready, this is 100% expected.

Honestly, I watched him all last season - I think you made a really great pick with him and in the end you'll be rewarded.

On a self-serving note, any idea when he might be re-assigned to the Knights?

Click to read more...

 

[WTG]

I see the feelings about Juolevi are still a bit mixed. Re his play - keep in mind that even before the draft it was obvious to all that he doesn't currently have the strength to play in the NHL (very few 18 year olds do) - so to the extent he doesn't physically look NHL-ready, this is 100% expected.

Honestly, I watched him all last season - I think you made a really great pick with him and in the end you'll be rewarded.

On a self-serving note, any idea when he might be re-assigned to the Knights?

He'll probably be given 1 more game, maybe 2.

 

[JA]

Olli Juolevi is a long-term project. Fortunately, most top defencemen are projects. Goaltenders take even longer on average. Patience is required. Victor Hedman took years to develop. I would be curious to see what Olli looks like on the ice in five years. Jordan Subban is already three years into his post-draft development, and we can see that his game is still growing.

 

[WTG]

LD Olli Juolevi - London Knights PT2

Born May 5, 1998 | Helsinki, FIN
Height 6 ft 3 in (191 cm)
Weight 188 lb (85 kg; 13 st 6 lb)
Position Defence
Shoots Left

A competitive spark-plug, Olli Juolevi is a complete, all-around defenceman who can hem the opposition in their own end or make things difficult for the opposition at home; either way, he puts the pressure on and lays it on thick. A strong and balanced skater, he can rush the puck through the neutral zone with ease or backcheck with haste. Uses his size to his advantage, but knows his physical limits and plays within them. Instead of playing overly physical, he makes his presence felt by exhibiting his high-end playmaking ability and puck possession play. All-in-all, a well-rounded blueliner who thrives under pressure and can be trusted in all situations.

http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=196391​

Continue

 

[JA]

Olli Juolevi is a long-term project. Fortunately, most top defencemen are projects. Goaltenders take even longer on average. Patience is required. Victor Hedman took years to develop. I would be curious to see what Olli looks like on the ice in five years. Jordan Subban is already three years into his post-draft development, and we can see that his game is still growing.

 

[skyo]

Olli Juolevi is a long-term project. Fortunately, most top defencemen are projects. Goaltenders take even longer on average. Patience is required.
Victor Hedman took years to develop. I would be curious to see what Olli looks like on the ice in five years.

Yup it was expected Juolevi would need more time to develop, he was full of confidence in the summer, but has quickly realized the work he needs to put in now to be quicker/smarter/stronger yada yada.

Imo Juolevi will be a boon to have when Edler's contract expires in 3 years, by then Juolevi should be able to handle top 4 NHL minutes, then in 4-5 years time be a top pairing guy, basically taking over Edler's spot as his heir apparent/protégé.

 

[biturbo19]

Yup it was expected Juolevi would need more time to develop, he was full of confidence in the summer, but has quickly realized the work he needs to put in now to be quicker/smarter/stronger yada yada.

Imo Juolevi will be a boon to have when Edler's contract expires in 3 years, by then Juolevi should be able to handle top 4 NHL minutes, then in 4-5 years time be a top pairing guy, basically taking over Edler's spot as his heir apparent/protégé.

Yeah. Juolevi said all the right things in terms of his goal being to make this team and everything, but it always felt like there was at least a hint of understanding that it was highly unlikely.

It's really not a big deal, and nothing to be ashamed of, or fearful of for Canucks fans. He's an 18 year old physically underdeveloped defenceman. Happens all the time with defencemen in particular. Expecting him to jump right in was always a pie in the sky expectation for anyone who deeply held that belief.

 

[TacitEndorsement]

Olli Juolevi is a long-term project. Fortunately, most top defencemen are projects. Goaltenders take even longer on average. Patience is required. Victor Hedman took years to develop. I would be curious to see what Olli looks like on the ice in five years. Jordan Subban is already three years into his post-draft development, and we can see that his game is still growing.

This is wrong. Hedman has played full NHL seasons straight out of his draft year. He had 20 points that year, same as Edler has last season.

 

[racerjoe]

I don't mind being patient at all, I just hope the Canucks can as he still can't play in the AHL next season, and if he isn't ready I don't want to rush him to play NHL hockey like we did with McCann, who by the midway mark was clearly not ready.

 

[WTG]

This is wrong. Hedman has played full NHL seasons straight out of his draft year. He had 20 points that year, same as Edler has last season.

I mean Edler didn't have a 51 goal scorer to play with tho, and Edler played less games.

 

[JA]

This is wrong. Hedman has played full NHL seasons straight out of his draft year. He had 20 points that year, same as Edler has last season.

Hedman played full NHL seasons as soon as he was drafted, but he was not a fearsome player like he is now.

That took years to develop. He was nowhere near close to being the player he is today. For the first few years, he was extremely average.

Here are a few articles that share this view of Victor Hedman:

http://lastwordonsports.com/2015/06/14/victor-hedman-the-picture-of-patience/

Victor Hedman: The Picture of Patience
By
Brianne Spiker -
June 14, 2015

...

Hedman was considered to be the total package during his draft year. Big, mobile and smart with offensive ability, he was good enough to play in the Swedish league as a teenager. But the hype didn’t lead to instant NHL dominance. 18-year-old defencemen rarely dominate and Hedman was no exception. But despite the combination of moving up to the best league in the world, the culture change and playing on a Tampa team that wasn’t very good, Hedman’s rookie year was a success.

However, progression was slow for Hedman for his second and third NHL seasons. Offensively, he saw little improvement while his defensive game developed slower than anticipated. The Lightning continued to believe in Hedman but some were disappointed in the player who drew comparisons to Chris Pronger and expected immediate results. It didn’t help that he was being outshone by fellow Swedish defenceman Oliver Ekman-Larsson, who went sixth overall in the same draft as Hedman.

...

Hedman’s development is the picture of patience. Even though he was a high pick, he didn’t emerge until last year and he hasn’t even hit his prime yet as a defenceman as he is still only 24. Every player develops at a different rate and Hedman just happened to take a little longer than anticipated. Fans sometimes expect high picks to become stars right away and it just doesn’t happen right off the bat. But in this case, the wait was worth it to see Hedman become a dominant defenceman.

...

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/nhl-east/tampa-bay-lightning/victor-hedman-repaying-the-lightning-for-their-patience/

Victor Hedman Repaying the Lightning for their Patience
By Andy Dudones
Posted on August 21, 2015

Elite defensemen are hard to come by these days. Perhaps that’s why it took Tampa Bay Lightning blueliner Victor Hedman six seasons to finally be considered part of that exclusive club. After registering 93 points over the past two years — on top of leading the Bolts to within two wins of a Stanley Cup Championship in June — there’s no shortage of recognition for the 24-year-old Swede.

Hedman’s rise to star status, however, wasn’t achieved overnight. Nothing worth having ever is. But how could the second-overall pick in the 2009 NHL Entry Draft go overlooked up until now?

...

Very seldom does a rookie enter the NHL, or any other major pro sports league, and dominate. The ones that experience success still do so while feeling the inevitable growing pains as part of the developmental process. From there, they further blossom.

Per the common norm, rookies are nourished with grooming in the AHL. They become accustomed to the grind of a pro hockey schedule, while skating against peers who are more talented, and in a lot of cases, more experienced than opponents in European and junior leagues.

For all the benefits of growing into an NHL level player down on the farm, that wasn’t for Hedman, as is the case for an array of talent selected within the top 5-10 slots in the draft. It’s not like the Lightning had a choice in the matter, though — not if they wanted to expedite their future star defenseman’s development.

...

Since entering the league as an 18-year-old prospect from the Swedish League, Tampa Bay’s top defender has endured plenty of alterations to his surroundings.

In his first five seasons in the NHL, Hedman has skated for three different coaches, Rick Tocchet, Guy Boucher, and Jon Cooper, who recently wrapped up his second full season of manning the Tampa Bay bench.

“It took a little longer than I wanted, but it’s a learning curve and you have to go through it. It was good for me to come over when I was 18 and learn the game,” Hedman told Tal Pinchevsky of NHL.com before the start of last season. “Obviously Tampa had a lot of faith in me and believed in me. It’s been good, but there’s been some pain here and there. There have been some tough games and tough years. It’s all worth it now.”

Throughout his time in Tampa, Hedman has been a part of various pairings, a component that certainly doesn’t aid development. Names such as Kurtis Foster, Brett Clark, Eric Brewer, Sami Salo, and most recently, Anton Stralman, have all shared the blue line with the gifted Swede.

While Hedman held his own, producing as he developed with different pairings, it’s no coincidence the former Modo Hockey sensation hit his stride while playing with eight-year veteran Stralman.

...

He was expected from the start to be a high-end player, but did not deliver on those promises until just a few years ago.

 

[biturbo19]

I don't mind being patient at all, I just hope the Canucks can as he still can't play in the AHL next season, and if he isn't ready I don't want to rush him to play NHL hockey like we did with McCann, who by the midway mark was clearly not ready.

That's going to be a really interesting camp for Juolevi.

Just looking at him out on the ice now...you can tell he's got a very good frame to work with, but still very "small" in terms of packing on some beef. How much size and strength he can feasibly add in a year without compromising other elements of his play is going to be the delicate balancing act.

And having to send him back to the OHL again next year would be a really tough sell on many different levels.

 

[F A N]

That's going to be a really interesting camp for Juolevi.

Just looking at him out on the ice now...you can tell he's got a very good frame to work with, but still very "small" in terms of packing on some beef. How much size and strength he can feasibly add in a year without compromising other elements of his play is going to be the delicate balancing act.

And having to send him back to the OHL again next year would be a really tough sell on many different levels.

I think Juolevi will naturally fill out as he ages. We all do. Combined with some gym work, he should be able to pack on some muscle without it affecting his game. It could take a few years before he reaches his physical prime.

I actually don't think it's a problem not having Juolevi play in the NHL at age 19. I don't think it's a tough sell, although Juolevi may want to return to Finland to play.

 

[racerjoe]

I think Juolevi will naturally fill out as he ages. We all do. Combined with some gym work, he should be able to pack on some muscle without it affecting his game. It could take a few years before he reaches his physical prime.

I actually don't think it's a problem not having Juolevi play in the NHL at age 19. I don't think it's a tough sell, although Juolevi may want to return to Finland to play.

I don't mind him going back to the OHL this year, but I think I would want him to go to finland next year. It's just tough with players like this where you don't want them to go straight to the NHL, but they are probably too good to stay in the CHL. Really think there should be a 1 player exempt rule per NHL team.

 

[CanaFan]

I don't mind him going back to the OHL this year, but I think I would want him to go to finland next year. It's just tough with players like this where you don't want them to go straight to the NHL, but they are probably too good to stay in the CHL. Really think there should be a 1 player exempt rule per NHL team.

I don't know that I buy that Juolevi is too good for the CHL yet. Defensively maybe but he has a ways to go in terms of learning to control the tempo of a game and not just defer to forwards with quick outs. He could also stand to run a PP and work on the skills that go with that. I doubt any FEL team is going to let a 18 year old newcomer do that whereas in London he'll get that opportunity. Too risky he just gets buried on a FEL team.

 

[racerjoe]

I don't know that I buy that Juolevi is too good for the CHL yet. Defensively maybe but he has a ways to go in terms of learning to control the tempo of a game and not just defer to forwards with quick outs. He could also stand to run a PP and work on the skills that go with that. I doubt any FEL team is going to let a 18 year old newcomer do that whereas in London he'll get that opportunity. Too risky he just gets buried on a FEL team.

Fair enough, I was projecting a bit for next year, his 19 year old season when he still can't play in the AHL.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Send him back to junior.

 

[CanaFan]

Fair enough, I was projecting a bit for next year, his 19 year old season when he still can't play in the AHL.

Ah gotcha, for some reason thought you meant the upcoming season. Depending on how his year with London goes then I could be in favour of that idea. I just feel there is a missing element to Juolevi's game right now and it isn't as simple as confidence or strength. He needs to find a balance between his conservative, always-at-home game and being a bit more disruptive in the other two zones of the ice. I'm hoping another year at a lower level (but with excellent coaching and systems in London) can help him develop that game before he moves up to either NHL or a team in Europe.

 

[MS]

I don't know that I buy that Juolevi is too good for the CHL yet. Defensively maybe but he has a ways to go in terms of learning to control the tempo of a game and not just defer to forwards with quick outs. He could also stand to run a PP and work on the skills that go with that. I doubt any FEL team is going to let a 18 year old newcomer do that whereas in London he'll get that opportunity. Too risky he just gets buried on a FEL team.

If a #5 overall pick gets buried on a FEL team, it was a terrible pick. Full stop.

If Juolevi was in Europe this year, it would be colossally disappointing if he was playing anything other than top-4 minutes in that league.

 

[CanaFan]

If a #5 overall pick gets buried on a FEL team, it was a terrible pick. Full stop.

If Juolevi was in Europe this year, it would be colossally disappointing if he was playing anything other than top-4 minutes in that league.

Maybe and I'll admit I don't know too much about the practices of FEL teams. I'd just be cautious of him landing with a Finnish Willie D type coach who has a heavy hankering for playing his vets. Of course I guess the Canucks would (or should) investigate which teams would be most open to a top 4 role for Juolevi so maybe that mitigates it. I honestly don't know how it would play out.

 

[MS]

Maybe and I'll admit I don't know too much about the practices of FEL teams. I'd just be cautious of him landing with a Finnish Willie D type coach who has a heavy hankering for playing his vets. Of course I guess the Canucks would (or should) investigate which teams would be most open to a top 4 role for Juolevi so maybe that mitigates it. I honestly don't know how it would play out.

Teenagers play in the SEL/SM-Liiga pretty regularly - Forsling was a bit of an outlier as a 5th rounder to play so much, but a top-10 draft pick would be expected to play a heavy role. If Juolevi were in Europe next year, he'd be considered the best defensive prospect in all of Europe and should damn well better be playing top-4 minutes if he's there. And if he can't? Wow is it a bad pick.

Watching the game against Edmonton, you could see him struggle with the pace and physicality of playing against men in a way he didn't remotely in London. To me, the best stepping stone would have been going back to Europe for a year, then hopefully making the team in 17-18.

The game looked easy for him already last year in London and I don't see how more of the same is going to maximize his development.

 

[CanaFan]

Teenagers play in the SEL/SM-Liiga pretty regularly - Forsling was a bit of an outlier as a 5th rounder to play so much, but a top-10 draft pick would be expected to play a heavy role. If Juolevi were in Europe next year, he'd be considered the best defensive prospect in all of Europe and should damn well better be playing top-4 minutes if he's there. And if he can't? Wow is it a bad pick.

Watching the game against Edmonton, you could see him struggle with the pace and physicality of playing against men in a way he didn't remotely in London. To me, the best stepping stone would have been going back to Europe for a year, then hopefully making the team in 17-18.

The game looked easy for him already last year in London and I don't see how more of the same is going to maximize his development.

If so then fine. My only recent experience with prospects in pro leagues has been Jasek lighting up the Czech junior league but unable to get ice time in the men's league. May vary from league to league though.

 

[MS]

If so then fine. My only recent experience with prospects in pro leagues has been Jasek lighting up the Czech junior league but unable to get ice time in the men's league. May vary from league to league though.

Bit of a difference between a tiny 6th rounder like Jasek and a #5 overall pick and WJC star like Juolevi.

#1 picks in Europe pretty much ALWAYS play regular top-5/top-9 minutes in their mens leagues in their draft+1 and draft+2 years, unless something is going really wrong in their development.

 

[BB88]

Maybe and I'll admit I don't know too much about the practices of FEL teams. I'd just be cautious of him landing with a Finnish Willie D type coach who has a heavy hankering for playing his vets. Of course I guess the Canucks would (or should) investigate which teams would be most open to a top 4 role for Juolevi so maybe that mitigates it. I honestly don't know how it would play out.

Miro Heiskanen 2017 draft prospect is playing +20 mins in Liiga.

Juolevi would be a superstar in Finland, Pulju& Laine gone it would be all Juolevi, he'd probably play for Finnish national team as well.
Would probably play like Aho, Pulju and Laine around 100 games.

 

[CanaFan]

Bit of a difference between a tiny 6th rounder like Jasek and a #5 overall pick and WJC star like Juolevi.

#1 picks in Europe pretty much ALWAYS play regular top-5/top-9 minutes in their mens leagues in their draft+1 and draft+2 years, unless something is going really wrong in their development.

Fair enough