Phoenix bankruptcy/ownership Part XV - SITREP: SNAFU

[LadyStanley]

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=674335

Previous thread carry on.

Where am I going? I don't know.
When will I get there? I ain't certain.
All I know is I am on my way. -- Paint Your Wagon

Click to read more...

 

[Jesus Christ Horburn]

Can someone explain what the story behind Ice Edge is? I mean, they must have some alternate destination in mind if the Coyotes can't make it work in Phoenix (Reinsdorf had the escape clause after five years, and we all speculated he would move the team to KC or elsewhere).

The group is made of six Canadians and two Americans, and they're trying to split games in Canadian cities, which seems very pro-Canadian to me. Is it possible they want to move the team somewhere in Canada (ex. Vaughn) in a few years if Phoenix doesn't work?

 

[lillypad33]

I still find it funny that the NHL has an escape clause allowing them to leave after 1 year!

 

[Fugu]

Round up of the most recently linked articles from the just-closed thread:

American Law Magazine reviews players in the courtroom, calls it sports law case of the year
http://amlawdaily.typepad.com/amlawdaily/2009/08/cadwalder-on-coyotes.html

Costs rising for the COG in courtroom, lawyers fees unreal

http://www.canada.com/sports/Glendale+spent+keep+Coyotes+report/1933068/story.html

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4425240&name=lebrun_pierre

Doan has a message for Balsillie: give Phoenix a chance

http://www.azcentral.com/12news/news/articles/2009/08/26/20090826coyotesbills08262009-CR.html

Resnick on the legal costs (for the city), possible future

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/27/sports/hockey/27coyotes.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

NY Times on the NHL possibly stepping into a quagmire.

Legal experts say the argument that the league acted in an anticompetitive manner may have merit. Any behavior, they say, that excludes potential owners in a way that is detrimental to the health of the team can be viewed as a restraint on trade. The Coyotes have lost millions of dollars in Arizona and Balsillie argues that the team will have an avid fan base in Hamilton.

If the league “knew that Reinsdorf’s bid was just a cover, just to allow the N.H.L. to reject Balsillie’s bid, then there’s a case,” said Gabriel Feldman, director of the Sports Law Program at Tulane University

.

Arizona paper lamenting Glendale-

"Along the way, a horrible falsehood has spread across the globe, the myth that hockey can't work in the desert. Wrong. The Valley can support hockey, and has supported hockey in the past. This is a Glendale problem, one born from bad teams and long commutes and a bad decision to build an arena in a cotton field. This is not an Arizona problem."

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coyotes/articles/2009/08/26/20090826spt-bickley.html

National Post Editorial Board- the emporer has no clothes

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/...itorial-board-let-the-phoenix-coyotes-go.aspx

 

[LadyStanley]

http://www.fromtherink.com/2009/8/27/1003891/a-closer-look-at-the-nhls-bid-for

Mirtle looks at NHL bid


http://ktar.com/?sid=1203788&nid=520

Sports Arizona looks at situation after NHL bid made.

 

[Fugu]

David Naylar from The Globe:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/relocation-of-coyotes-possible-under-nhl-bid/article1266237/

After months of espousing its commitment to keep the Phoenix Coyotes in Glendale, Ariz., the NHL appears unsure hockey can work in the desert after all.

In an about-face, the league's bid to purchase the Coyotes out of bankruptcy court specifically mentions it is open to relocating the team.
...

The NHL bid mentions nothing about a commitment or desire to keep the team in Phoenix and casts further doubt on the team's viability in Phoenix by stating: "Despite the continuous efforts to facilitate the sale of the Phoenix hockey club to a qualified owner committed to keeping the team in Glendale, the NHL has reluctantly concluded that it is necessary to submit this bid for the NHL to acquire and operate the team."
...

Since the NHL states in its bid that it "does not anticipate there would be a net profit upon a resale of the team to a Glendale buyer," its own interests, and those of the creditors, would likely be best served by relocating the team to a market where its value could be maximized beyond $140-million.

 

[Dr Pepper]

JB's gotta be laughing at this; he was right all along.

 

[Space Herpe]

I still find it funny that the NHL has an escape clause allowing them to leave after 1 year!

I'm with ya there Pad! It does seem like a back-handed acknowledgement of something bigger.

The something bigger being the lease issue. (From what I've read, it seems that's the problem.)

How bad is it?

Yes, I can Google away, but I'm sure someone here knows some sites or some basic ins and outs of the deal.

I wonder if it is like the deal the Isles have...where they get basically nothing from the food, beer, soda, parking...etc...

 

[CanadaBacon]

I'm with ya there Pad! It does seem like a back-handed acknowledgement of something bigger.

The something bigger being the lease issue. (From what I've read, it seems that's the problem.)

How bad is it?

Yes, I can Google away, but I'm sure someone here knows some sites or some basic ins and outs of the deal.

I wonder if it is like the deal the Isles have...where they get basically nothing from the food, beer, soda, parking...etc...

Its an acknowledgement that Phoenix is not a hockey market.

 

[billy blaze]

I'm with ya there Pad! It does seem like a back-handed acknowledgement of something bigger.

The something bigger being the lease issue. (From what I've read, it seems that's the problem.)

How bad is it?

Yes, I can Google away, but I'm sure someone here knows some sites or some basic ins and outs of the deal.

I wonder if it is like the deal the Isles have...where they get basically nothing from the food, beer, soda, parking...etc...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=1693100

six years ago it was reported to be the best lease ever, hockey was an afterthought, land development was the key, then they screwed it up, the recession hit, the Coyotes and Glendale was never about hockey, it was about growing the city, as I've said before they rolled the dice and lost, the hockey fans of Phoenix are the ones who really got screwed

 

[edog37]

JB's gotta be laughing at this; he was right all along.

how much further can the BoG run this league into the ground....

 

[LeftCoast]

Strange strategy for the NHL.

I haven't followed these threads closely in weeks, so forgive me if this point has been made before.

By putting in a bid for the Coyotes, the NHL has actually weakened its position. It's possible they had no choice if the Reinsdorf bid is truely falling apart. But it would be reasonable to interpret the BOGs rejection of Balsillie's ownership petition as a restraint of trade, subverting the court's to maximize the return to creditors.

IANAL - but the league's action certainly bolsters Balsillie's anti-competitive argument and if I were the judge, I would not take having the auction process subverted in this way without some very pointed questions to the NHL.

At the same time, the fact that the NHL bid allows them to relocate further weakens their position on retaining the team in Phoenix. It is really starting to look more and more like "anybody but Balsillie and anywhere except Hamilton".

 

[billy blaze]

Adam Proteau- Hockey News

NHL ownership

http://www.thehockeynews.com/articl...L-ownership-not-all-its-cracked-up-to-be.html

 

[LadyStanley]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/pu...a-roasting-over-Phoenix-bid-is?urn=nhl,185514

Puck Daddy looks at the media roating the NHL is getting after submitting bid and asks: "is it fair"?



LeftCoast - Reinsdorf's bid is out of the picture. The only three bids on the judge's table are Balsillie (whom the NHL claims is not an authorized bidder), Ice Edge (who still have unmet conditions and could pull out), and the NHL.

 

[Space Herpe]

Strange strategy for the NHL.

I haven't followed these threads closely in weeks, so forgive me if this point has been made before.

By putting in a bid for the Coyotes, the NHL has actually weakened its position. It's possible they had no choice if the Reinsdorf bid is truely falling apart. But it would be reasonable to interpret the BOGs rejection of Balsillie's ownership petition as a restraint of trade, subverting the court's to maximize the return to creditors.

IANAL - but the league's action certainly bolsters Balsillie's anti-competitive argument and if I were the judge, I would not take having the auction process subverted in this way without some very pointed questions to the NHL.

At the same time, the fact that the NHL bid allows them to relocate further weakens their position on retaining the team in Phoenix. It is really starting to look more and more like "anybody but Balsillie and anywhere except Hamilton".

I think Canada's Competition Comittee ruled that the NHL is "in the clear" when it comes to deciding who can own and who can't. I think...

What is intresting about that is the NHL is, as of right now, the one who can determine who wins by giving the winner of the bid a "thumbs up" or a "thumbs down" on being approved as an owner. It that case the NHL can overide the court. But, is that allowed?

 

[edog37]

Strange strategy for the NHL.

I haven't followed these threads closely in weeks, so forgive me if this point has been made before.

By putting in a bid for the Coyotes, the NHL has actually weakened its position. It's possible they had no choice if the Reinsdorf bid is truely falling apart. But it would be reasonable to interpret the BOGs rejection of Balsillie's ownership petition as a restraint of trade, subverting the court's to maximize the return to creditors.

IANAL - but the league's action certainly bolsters Balsillie's anti-competitive argument and if I were the judge, I would not take having the auction process subverted in this way without some very pointed questions to the NHL.

At the same time, the fact that the NHL bid allows them to relocate further weakens their position on retaining the team in Phoenix. It is really starting to look more and more like "anybody but Balsillie and anywhere except Hamilton".

that's it right there.....this is a personal pissing contest between JB & Bettman....

 

[CanadaBacon]

I think Canada's Competition Comittee ruled that the NHL is "in the clear" when it comes to deciding who can own and who can't. I think...

What is intresting about that is the NHL is, as of right now, the one who can determine who wins by giving the winner of the bid a "thumbs up" or a "thumbs down" on being approved as an owner. It that case the NHL can overide the court. But, is that allowed?

The thing is, this has never happened before. No one knows what to do here because there is no precedent. This is now at a point where both sides are running around not knowing what to do. There is a good chance the Courts could tell the NHL to go ******* itself.

Remember, the Courts dont give a s*** about JB v GB, this whole process is about the bankruptcy of the Phoenix Coyotes, and all said debt being paid. JB could very well turn out to be the new owner. But like i said, this is all new territory, who knows whats going to happen.

 

[Fugu]

Its an acknowledgement that Phoenix is not a hockey market.

I think this is too simple an interpretation. The location, lease, and management are all factors.

 

[CanadaBacon]

I think this is too simple an interpretation. The location, lease, and management are all factors.

Biggest factor being the lack of fans.

 

[mnwildfan79]

that's it right there.....this is a personal pissing contest between JB & Bettman....

It sure is nice of the BoG to let Bettman use their millions of dollars to engage in a pissing contest.

But yeah, spot on analysis

 

[CGG]

Fairly one-sided article in the Globe, patting themselves on the back for being right all along.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/nhls-fingerprints-all-over-its-damaged-credibility/article1265993/

The article basically scolds Bettman & Friends for handling this so horribly wrong and denying there were any problems in Phoenix all the way along.

Still, no worries, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman said. In a sworn affidavit, he assured the court that bids would be pouring in any minute – not just from Reinsdorf, but from the guys who (sort of) own the Toronto Argonauts, and a host of others, all believers in the bright future of professional hockey in the Valley of the Sun.

...

What a splendid mess. And all of it could have been avoided if the NHL had simply acknowledged Moyes’s troubles a year ago, opted to work with him and his creditors, and dealt with the embarrassment of admitting that not everything was rosy with every franchise in the depths of a recession.

 

[CanadaBacon]

It sure is nice of the BoG to let Bettman use their millions of dollars to engage in a pissing contest.

But yeah, spot on analysis

It actually is true. It points out how inept the BoG is and how GB is the puppet master.

 

[Fugu]

Biggest factor being the lack of fans.

Sure, but fans fail to show up for a variety of reasons. I don't think the catch-all about X not being a hockey market does justice to a situation as complex as this one.

 

[mnwildfan79]

It actually is true. It points out how inept the BoG is and how GB is the puppet master.

If Bettman had the kind of skills it would take to con that man million/billionaires I think he'd be using them for profit not to engage in a pissing contest. But that's just me.

Bettman the puppet master... hilarious!

 

[edog37]

I think Canada's Competition Comittee ruled that the NHL is "in the clear" when it comes to deciding who can own and who can't. I think...

What is intresting about that is the NHL is, as of right now, the one who can determine who wins by giving the winner of the bid a "thumbs up" or a "thumbs down" on being approved as an owner. It that case the NHL can overide the court. But, is that allowed?

the court can't be overriden by a sports league. What would happen would be that JB would be approved by the court & then not be sanctioned by the league.