Confirmed with Link: Phaneuf's Contract Talk Pt.2 - 7yrs/49million
- Thread starter Paradoc
- Start date
Boreal01
Registered User
As I said earlier, shut down types tend to get out of position regularly. That tends to happen when your playing style if predicated on big hits. In fact, Chicago's top pairing is no different even though they have a mid-pairing dedicated to shutting down top lines. This is ignoring the fact that Phaneuf does not have the support of ANY of these defenceman.
It's ironic that we have a number who are suggesting that we ought to imitate contenders, but there are no prototypical PMDs on Boston or Chicago. Instead, you have more of the all-round, big-hitting, physical puck rushing D which describes Phaneuf. We should actually be retaining him, and moving out Gardiner AND Franson. St Louis seems to do fine with just one in Shattenkirk, I don't think Gardiner has the IQ to be one.
As for the Phaneuf and Weber skating comparison, the latter is a bit better, but the difference isn't that extreme. J-Bo is a lot stronger, but Dion is quite average. What makes Shea look better is Barry Trotz hard trap system. Our system, in contrast, isn't that type due to the terrible commitment by our forwards and an eye candy mid and bottom pairing that isn't doing what someone like Shattenkirk can do.
It's ironic that we have a number who are suggesting that we ought to imitate contenders, but there are no prototypical PMDs on Boston or Chicago. Instead, you have more of the all-round, big-hitting, physical puck rushing D which describes Phaneuf. We should actually be retaining him, and moving out Gardiner AND Franson. St Louis seems to do fine with just one in Shattenkirk, I don't think Gardiner has the IQ to be one.
As for the Phaneuf and Weber skating comparison, the latter is a bit better, but the difference isn't that extreme. J-Bo is a lot stronger, but Dion is quite average. What makes Shea look better is Barry Trotz hard trap system. Our system, in contrast, isn't that type due to the terrible commitment by our forwards and an eye candy mid and bottom pairing that isn't doing what someone like Shattenkirk can do.
Diatomic
Mitch Matthewlander
achtungbaby
Registered User
- Oct 31, 2006
- 4,792
- 25
I've said this on the main board but I'll repeat it here. You know it's probably not the greatest contract when you feel the need to mention that the cap is going up and that we had no one to replace him with, every time you discuss the deal. It's like when Schenn was still here and someone felt compelled to mention that he was leading the league in hits every time his poor play was brought up.
Kurtz
Registered User
- Jul 17, 2005
- 10,111
- 6,989
But those people defending Schenn proved correct. His standing as the league's hits leader added immensely to his value. It was a big reason why we were able to get JVR for him.
There is a very real and legit reason as to why that happens, and I am surprised I actually have to explain it. The majority of the debates that take place here, are usually focused on one thing, combine that with the biases here,and non Leaf fans and posters who troll on a regular basis, often times looking at the entire picture and all encompassing facts presents a realistic debate taking all things into consideration.
Mess
Global Moderator
Players and agents around the league are loving the new Phaneuf contract as it will become the new benchmark comparable that all other NHL Dmen that play top pairing minutes and able to out produce Phaneuf statistically will use to get their new deals.
> $7 mil will become the new standard.
> $7 mil will become the new standard.
Commander Clueless
Hiya, hiya. Pleased to meetcha.
- Sep 10, 2008
- 15,476
- 3,347
Overpaid!
Just like most players getting signed these days!
No but seriously, Phaneuf and Kessel got some pretty hefty extensions here, but I am glad to have both of them back.
I'll take paying guys like this the big bucks over paying middle of the road guys not much less.
(That statement earns suspicious looks thrown towards Blake and Komisa....I mean Clarkson and Gleason)
Just like most players getting signed these days!
No but seriously, Phaneuf and Kessel got some pretty hefty extensions here, but I am glad to have both of them back.
I'll take paying guys like this the big bucks over paying middle of the road guys not much less.
(That statement earns suspicious looks thrown towards Blake and Komisa....I mean Clarkson and Gleason)
ACC1224
Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
- Aug 19, 2002
- 73,973
- 39,717
Not sure he will but it would be interesting to see how closely he was considered.
Would be funny if Dion gets invited and Subban is left off... I haven't followed it too closely but I've read that they aren't fans of bringing in Subban as the 5/6/7 dman.
Mess
Global Moderator
Before the Winter Classic they had a 1/2 hour making of the Olympic team with Steve Yzerman and the brain trust and they discussed all positions and players they were focused on, not the automatics but more so the bubble players to fill out the roster mainly.
Phaneuf's name never came up that I heard, but they talked about PK Subban and Dan Boyle, as well as Seabrook and Pietrangelo as players they will be looking at closely in the remaining days as bubble players.
Mess
Global Moderator
The cap rising significantly will lesson the impact on the team, however the decline of the player with age in the later years when he is 34-36 and still a $7 mil cap hit will be a factor.
For the next 5 years from 29-34 might not be an issue in that respect, believing he will continue to contribute at his present performance.
Dion will not be alone as players like Clarkson etc will have that same overlapping decline and production in later years and overlapping at the same time.
So that to me seems like the Leafs are going for in the next 5 year window to win a Cup, because after that time age and decline will be putting downward pressure on Cup hopes thereafter of their current core players.
It's going to take 3 years before Kess/Dion at a combined 15m cap hit will start to balance out across the league.
To many top teams have to many top players at cap combinations that favor them much more then our top 2 do.
Punch Drunk Loov
Gaaaaary Roberts!
- Dec 6, 2011
- 4,973
- 2,755
dubey
$$$$$$$*NICE*$$$$$$$ 69 in 79 $$$$$$$*NICE*$$$$$$$
No. As most player agents are based out of the Toronto area and unfortunately do not have the means to communicate or travel outside of the city - the Leafs generally set the standard for player contracts.
lol
Mess
Global Moderator
In a Cap World overpaying players hurts team competitiveness overall so when Leafs pay their top players among the highest at their position it makes winning it all that much tougher as other teams are getting much better bang for their cap buck.
Case in point Duncan Keith an automatic for Team Canada and a 2 time Cup winner and Norris contender annually makes $5.5 mil cap as opposed to Leafs taking Phaneuf @$7.0 mil. Chicago has the better player, higher scorer, proven winner and + $1.5 mil more cap space to build a contending team around. Duncan Keith's points at mid point 39 and more than Phaneuf's pace 34 for the full year.
If you had to pick just one that gave you the best bang for cap buck contract it be Keith and if you also get and additional $1.5 mil extra cap its a grand slam advantage for Chicago.. How does Toronto beat the Cup champs when their players are cheaper and better?
Spending smarter not harder is the moral of the story here, why some teams have automatic advantages when it comes to hoisting a Cup.
Last edited:
exactly, to my point of I wonder why the leafs can't get these players signed for similar deals.
they almost have to pay small market type of deals to keep their core players
Sometimes I wonder if team profits, potential playoff revs per game has any impact on player camp bargaining position.
Seems to me, two of the highest profit teams in the league TO/NYR seem to have the worst luck with deals.
