GDT: People We Watch On Ice Regularly vs. People We Watch When They Play The First Group Of People (2PM)

[OrrNumber4]

Coach is a convenient scapegoat. I am sure there are problems with DeBoer, but the roster simply isn't good enough. That is on the players and DW. Burns is playing very poorly, Jones has been awful, and the forwards have needed help all season (plus players like Thornton have regressed).

Especially in recent games, where the poor defensive play can be blamed on the players executing and making mistakes more than it can be on strategy.

 

[Domm]

anyone notice ole Hoffman hitting up Karlsson in the first two minutes then the refs having to split them up? don't think I saw them together on the ice at the same time since that

 

[matt trick]

SJ's Key Problems:
1. Goaltending (d-zone coverage gets a D, but our duo give up way, way too many softies)
2. Defensive zone coverage
3. Powerplay strategy & execution (zone entries are okay, puck movement is awful)
4. Offensive zone creativity (overly reliant on point shots)
5. Forward depth, playmakers in particular, are sorely lacking
6. Brent Burns looks terrible

Things that I like:
1. Erik Karlsson looks very good and Vlasic looks world's better than he did with Burns.
2. Ferraro is going to be a top 4 d-man if he's not already
3. PK is excellent
4. Marleau is still a top 9 forward
5. Kane's worth his contract
6. We didn't give Labanc a big contract, hopefully this leads to another bridge to try and prove that he is a top 6 fwd
7. When Hertl is healthy the team looks like a playoff team, despite tons of problems
8. The Pacific is still pretty bad
9. Gregor and Gambrell look like quality fourth liners, Goodrow looks like a 3rd liner. I wouldn't have bet on any of those things prior to the year. Small victories

Wilson has a few options
1. Acquire some depth to find out where his problems actually are (Georgiev, Tofolli/Wood/Pageau)
2. Go Big game hunting and empty the tank for Hall (Sorensen/Ferraro, Merkely/Chitwin, 1st 2021) or to a lesser degree Kreider
3. Keep your powder dry and lie in wait for an ideal playmaking winger who may not become available (Voracek, Giroux, Wheeler, or someone like Nyquist)
4. Pay someone to take Dell, and see if Korenar can make a run
5. Fire the coach (or at least Spott). Not sure a new coach can help goaltending or forward depth, but they can make some system updates, and add some creative wrinkles in the offensive zone.

I like Hall as he fits into the newer, faster NHL, and he produces a ton at even strength. I'm a big believer in the concept that there is no substitute for elite talent. I don't see a franchise center falling into our laps, which means Couture & Hertl must be surrounded with elite wings, elite D, and (at least) average goaltending for them to win. That being said, I think the player they need isn't Hall, but a two-way wing who can hold the puck and create offense. Nyquist was the right fit, and while not elite, he'd be a huge boon to this roster. If one of those doesn't become available, do you make a move for Hall and then try and pick up a playmaking forward later.

 

[landshark]

Here's some stunning insight from TheAthletic/DeBo:

Is there any sort of common thread to the trip they are on now when compared with the first two in October?
“I don’t know. I think every trip is different,” coach Peter DeBoer said. “You’re at different points (of the season).”
So what’s been the issue on the current trip? The primary problem, according to the coach, is the Sharks are getting behind far too early.

Paywall: Another blowout loss as Sharks' road struggles continue to...

 

[Friday]

anyone notice ole Hoffman hitting up Karlsson in the first two minutes then the refs having to split them up? don't think I saw them together on the ice at the same time since that

Hoffman was suspended in like 2017 for cross checking Logan in the head. That guy sucks

 

[Coily]

Hoffman was suspended in like 2017 for cross checking Logan in the head. That guy sucks

He said after the game that he chased Karlsson around asking him to fight.

Really making the case that he didn't have a hand in his wife's psycho antics...

 

[hohosaregood]

Here's some stunning insight from TheAthletic/DeBo:

Is there any sort of common thread to the trip they are on now when compared with the first two in October?
“I don’t know. I think every trip is different,” coach Peter DeBoer said. “You’re at different points (of the season).”
So what’s been the issue on the current trip? The primary problem, according to the coach, is the Sharks are getting behind far too early.

Paywall: Another blowout loss as Sharks' road struggles continue to...

It doesn't help that a 2 goal deficit is pretty much a guaranteed loss for us

 

[Anomie2029]

Coach is a convenient scapegoat. I am sure there are problems with DeBoer, but the roster simply isn't good enough. That is on the players and DW. Burns is playing very poorly, Jones has been awful, and the forwards have needed help all season (plus players like Thornton have regressed).

Especially in recent games, where the poor defensive play can be blamed on the players executing and making mistakes more than it can be on strategy.

This is simply not true. This roster is still better than the majority in the NHL and the awful play is a result of some awful systems that have been bad for the last few seasons.
The underlying numbers this season are mimicking the numbers on the tail end of last season - with a roster that was better.

It must be a really good coincidence that in the defensive zone that our D allow free reign in front of net - you don't think that's a system issue? Our offence relies of taking the puck low, cycling once or twice before sending it to the point to either shoot or dump it back low. Is it just the players that have decided to play this way or is it the system? What about the breakout - is it just all the forwards deciding to stay high and leave the zone forcing the D to flip the puck out or stretch pass out or is that a system issue?

No one has simply said it is just the coach. DW needs to take responsibility for doing absolutely nothing with the Goaltending situation (players and goalie coach), or handcuffing the team with so many long-term deals. The players need to make better choices and play with more confidence.

But the style of play is the coach - and that's where the team is struggling.

 

[landshark]

It doesn't help that a 2 goal deficit is pretty much a guaranteed loss for us

Yah, but he's basically saying the Sharks are getting behind. "Behind far too early?" Is it better to fall behind later in the game? It's like answering "we're not scoring more goals than our opponents..."

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

This is simply not true. This roster is still better than the majority in the NHL and the awful play is a result of some awful systems that have been bad for the last few seasons.
The underlying numbers this season are mimicking the numbers on the tail end of last season - with a roster that was better.

It must be a really good coincidence that in the defensive zone that our D allow free reign in front of net - you don't think that's a system issue? Our offence relies of taking the puck low, cycling once or twice before sending it to the point to either shoot or dump it back low. Is it just the players that have decided to play this way or is it the system? What about the breakout - is it just all the forwards deciding to stay high and leave the zone forcing the D to flip the puck out or stretch pass out or is that a system issue?

No one has simply said it is just the coach. DW needs to take responsibility for doing absolutely nothing with the Goaltending situation (players and goalie coach), or handcuffing the team with so many long-term deals. The players need to make better choices and play with more confidence.

But the style of play is the coach - and that's where the team is struggling.

I think what @OrrNumber4 needs to clarify is what the roster is not good enough for? For making a deep SC run? Yeah, I agree. But this roster should still be able to make it to the playoffs. Specially in the Pacific Division.

Our system is too predictable. I don't think the team itself has much of an identity. We are not a great checking or defensive team. We cannot score enough to be an offensive team. We are not the most physical team either. I remember the year we had the SC run, we had a great forecheck and we also cleared the zone quick with short tape-to-tape passes. Basically beat out the opponents forecheck and exit the zone. Now, we just struggle getting out of the zone and turn the puck over a lot.

 

[hohosaregood]

I feel like with the way the NHL is going, this point based offense is a really risky system. You need a really dynamic defense and a lot of responsible forwards to make it work. You need defensemen who can make space for themselves and you need a forward always ready to cycle back to the point to cover. Looking at our roster, we do have plenty of those but the problem is that fundamentally it's not a viable strategy nowadays. Since we have all these passes that are going back towards our side of the ice, any mistake in the o-zome means that we're basically springing a breakout for the other team. So there's not a lot of room for error especially when there are so many teams with really aggressive d-zone play looking to capitalize on mistakes

 

[Pavelski2112]

He said after the game that he chased Karlsson around asking him to fight.

Really making the case that he didn't have a hand in his wife's psycho antics...

What a piece of shit. Seriously, f*** Hoffman.

 

[Anomie2029]

I think what @OrrNumber4 needs to clarify is what the roster is not good enough for? For making a deep SC run? Yeah, I agree. But this roster should still be able to make it to the playoffs. Specially in the Pacific Division.

Our system is too predictable. I don't think the team itself has much of an identity. We are not a great checking or defensive team. We cannot score enough to be an offensive team. We are not the most physical team either. I remember the year we had the SC run, we had a great forecheck and we also cleared the zone quick with short tape-to-tape passes. Basically beat out the opponents forecheck and exit the zone. Now, we just struggle getting out of the zone and turn the puck over a lot.

The identity stuff I find interesting. There seems to be a big emphasis on it, but I wonder how much of it is really required. Jim Montgomery in Dallas when asked about the turnaround Dallas has had this season said he perhaps focused too much on identity rather than just letting the players play to their strengths. This is what I think is happening in San Jose.

The Sharks are playing systems that do not suit the players. When the Sharks look their best, as you identified, they have the close support breakout with a stretch option, their forecheck is a strong 1-2-2 (strong as opposed to heavy - the Sharks have rarely been a heavy team).

 

[Lebanezer]

He said after the game that he chased Karlsson around asking him to fight.

Really making the case that he didn't have a hand in his wife's psycho antics...

He’s not so bright. Plus it makes him and his wife look really guilty.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Yah, but he's basically saying the Sharks are getting behind. "Behind far too early?" Is it better to fall behind later in the game? It's like answering "we're not scoring more goals than our opponents..."

Think he's implying they start chasing the game at that point instead of sticking to his "system".

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Think he's implying they start chasing the game at that point instead of sticking to his "system".

Yup. When they get behind, they immediately move more towards blowing the zone early if they think they're going to have the puck instead of supporting the breakout. They also try more dangles, this is especially true of Meier and Labanc, instead of taking what's available to them.

 

[Kegsey]

Here's some stunning insight from TheAthletic/DeBo:

Is there any sort of common thread to the trip they are on now when compared with the first two in October?
“I don’t know. I think every trip is different,” coach Peter DeBoer said. “You’re at different points (of the season).”
So what’s been the issue on the current trip? The primary problem, according to the coach, is the Sharks are getting behind far too early.

Paywall: Another blowout loss as Sharks' road struggles continue to...

That’s so insightful.

 

[Used As A Shield]

Yup. When they get behind, they immediately move more towards blowing the zone early if they think they're going to have the puck instead of supporting the breakout. They also try more dangles, this is especially true of Meier and Labanc, instead of taking what's available to them.

Seriously, they try and force EVERYTHING.