Post-Game Talk: | Pens vs Jerks | Loss | Letang is a moron

[Pens x]

We had a significant amount of forwards missing time last year which led to a player in Jankowski getting an extended look. Hextall made a deal to acquire a player to knock him out and Sullivan immediately scratched him for Gaudreau once he showed himself to be a better talent.

Bylsma and Sleepy would never have given Gaudreau that chance unless they had injuries. It was either forfeit or use AHL guys. You gotta give the guys in the AHL a shot, and it paid off last year.

Sleepy and Bylsma stood by Jank for 2+ months where he scored 1 point (empty net goal). They are doing the same dumbass stuff this season. There are defensive players and there are AHL players good at defense playing in the NHL. Sleepy was given a free pass because he “needed time to evaluate.” It is alarming it took as long as it did for him to see a guy like Jank wasn’t an everyday player.

Here we are doing the same crap this season with other turds that will be part-time players next year if they are lucky.

I can’t wait to see what players accept Bylsma’s rose to come play with us next season that have no business playing in the league.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Yeah I agree with your Simon assessment. He's not gonna provide much offensively on the 4th line but he's a good energy guy, is generally responsible, and posses the puck well. What more do you want from a 4th liner? Yeah I'd love a guy that actually scores and does all those things too, but you ain't gettin that for what you pay Simon.

Simon is just such a weird player for people to get hung up on. I get complaining about like Zucker because he isn't providing the value you want from his cap hit but Simon is providing exactly what we're paying for, and that's fine.

Like the only gripe I would have about Simon is that maybe he plays too many games, I would scratch him when he has a bunch of bad games, which he does, but then it's like who do we think Sully trusts in that spot? Zohorna?

It is what it is.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I think he’s especially valuable when he’s with Boyle who really cannot skate the puck up ice at all anymore. Not really ZAR’s forte either. Simon is definitely good at getting the puck and quickly getting on his horse through the neutral zone for either a dump in or skating it in.

The best I saw Simon was when he was with O'Connor. I can't really remember what that line was, something like Simon-O'Connor-Rodrigues? Or was it O'Connor-Carter-Simon?

I liked the role he played on that line, I would love Angello up with ZAR and Boyle, if we want a crash line, get a bloke that can actually play a solid role there and is a right handed shot. Of course, none of this matters when our boy Blue is back.

If any team offers either a raise though, Simon + ZAR, this summer, it was nice knowing them.

 

[metalan2]

McCann was gone for nothing and got rid of him for something.

This didn't have to be true. They could have unprotected Turbo.

 

[metalan2]

Bylsma and Sleepy would never have given Gaudreau that chance unless they had injuries. It was either forfeit or use AHL guys. You gotta give the guys in the AHL a shot, and it paid off last year.

Sleepy and Bylsma stood by Jank for 2+ months where he scored 1 point (empty net goal). They are doing the same dumbass stuff this season. There are defensive players and there are AHL players good at defense playing in the NHL. Sleepy was given a free pass because he “needed time to evaluate.” It is alarming it took as long as it did for him to see a guy like Jank wasn’t an everyday player.

Here we are doing the same crap this season with other turds that will be part-time players next year if they are lucky.

I can’t wait to see what players accept Bylsma’s rose to come play with us next season that have no business playing in the league.

Exactly. You have to openly root for injuries so the roster can be fixed somehow.

 

[Gurglesons]

This didn't have to be true. They could have unprotected Turbo.

Then Blueger or Carter would be available.

 

[Rakell67]

Then Blueger or Carter would be available.

Turbo and McCann leaving opened up space for McGinn to be signed as well.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Then Blueger or Carter would be available.

Imo and I mean IMO...

Neither McCann nor Turbo, or both are worth losing Teddy Blueger for.

f***. That. Noise.

Turbo and McCann leaving opened up space for McGinn to be signed as well.

Brockstar is missing Blue for sure, he looks best with him and they both have shown a ton of chemistry which is fantastic seeing Blue lost his boy Tanev. So I like that swap, especially given the term Tanev is under, which is a JR special, ridiculous term signings. Also Heinen has been a solid add, he's kind of like a tweener version of McCann/Tanev. If Heinen can keep building chemistry with Geno and Kapanen, great.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Exactly. You have to openly root for injuries so the roster can be fixed somehow.

In the situation we're in right now, we have to actively root for Zucker and Blueger to come back from their injuries which will force Boyle and Simon out of the line-up which does ease some of the pain. Or, well, all of it for who we have, then the pain of how they're used begins, again.

 

[Gurglesons]

Turbo and McCann leaving opened up space for McGinn to be signed as well.

We are a better team without McCann and Tanev especially if it results in us losing Blueger or Carter.

 

[Big Poppa Pump]

The point is that on any given night no one has any idea how the game is going to be called. You can acknowledge this fact while also not accepting it as a good thing. Refs have way too much impact on games. Not taking both guys there for obvious infractions most likely cost us that game.

99% of hockey fans are ok with a punch to the head just not being called? Might want to redo your polling on that one.

There’s no point to a rulebook if you’re just going to use your own (changing) standard to call a game.

It's clear you haven't watched much hockey. Refs didn't cost us the game. That's the bitchy, whiny excuse people like you like to use.

99% would be ok with calling Trocheck for the rough and Letang for the cross check, or not calling either. I've seen it go either way over 1000 times. Refs decided to let it go, and I, along with 99% of the viewers were ok with that decision. If you watch more hockey, you'd see that this happens ALL THE TIME. Then Tanger loses his shit...

Trocheck skates away and Letang slashes and roughs Trocheck. Easy penalty call and was well deserved. Trocheck baited Letang and Letang bit hard.

I'm going to go over this one more time....

99% would be OK with just calling the Trocheck rough, but most likely, Letang would've gotten 2 for cross checking...
99% would be OK with calling the Trocheck rough and Letang cross check.
99% would be OK with calling neither.

Refs let it go, like they have done 1000's of times over the years... Then Letang loses his shit and that's the ballgame.

You either get it now or choose not to. Either way, my advice to you is to watch more hockey.

 

[Rakell67]

We are a better team without McCann and Tanev especially if it results in us losing Blueger or Carter.

I don't disagree. Blueger has been missed since he went down from the uncalled cheapshot by that fat coward Dildo. Carter provides more veteran calmness and needed size/clutch scoring. McGinn replaces what Tanev brought but with a little more scoring and less hyperactivity. McCann came up empty in the playoffs. He was great for regular season hot streaks and empty nets. I wouldn't care if he was reacquired. Maybe Francis would take a slightly used Kapanen.

 

[Gurglesons]

I don't disagree. Blueger has been missed since he went down from the uncalled cheapshot by that fat coward Dildo. Carter provides more veteran calmness and needed size/clutch scoring. McGinn replaces what Tanev brought but with a little more scoring and less hyperactivity. McCann came up empty in the playoffs. He was great for regular season hot streaks and empty nets. I wouldn't care if he was reacquired. Maybe Francis would take a slightly used Kapanen.

the argument was between Carter and McCann. Given what Carter did for us to stabilize the 2C hole this year, hard for me to fault the decision. I say this as someone with @ColePens and @Honour Over Glory that was hot for McCann. McCann could’ve been molded into a 3C here, but honestly he lacks the playmaking awareness of Carter and Blueger.

 

[ColePens]

the argument was between Carter and McCann. Given what Carter did for us to stabilize the 2C hole this year, hard for me to fault the decision. I say this as someone with @ColePens and @Honour Over Glory that was hot for McCann. McCann could’ve been molded into a 3C here, but honestly he lacks the playmaking awareness of Carter and Blueger.

I loved every single thing McCann was in florida and what he showed glimpses of.

But let's not fool ourselves. He went ghost town like no other. That guy got what he deserved when they let him go. It sucked because I really felt he had the tools that fit our team. He sure as f*** did not show them consistently. I'll take TB/Carter all day.

 

[Gurglesons]

I loved every single thing McCann was in florida and what he showed glimpses of.

But let's not fool ourselves. He went ghost town like no other. That guy got what he deserved when they let him go. It sucked because I really felt he had the tools that fit our team. He sure as f*** did not show them consistently. I'll take TB/Carter all day.

Yeah it really sucks. The talent is there, the numbers in the regular season are there, the analytics are there. But he disappears in games and playoffs. Blueger and Carter when they aren’t scoring are.

 

[metalan2]

Then Blueger or Carter would be available.

McCann is immensely more valuable than Carter and more valuable than Blueger.

 

[metalan2]

In the situation we're in right now, we have to actively root for Zucker and Blueger to come back from their injuries which will force Boyle and Simon out of the line-up which does ease some of the pain. Or, well, all of it for who we have, then the pain of how they're used begins, again.

Yes, for sure. I can't believe I want Zucker back this bad. Boyle is decent 4C and in my opinion provides much more than ZAR does.

 

[Gurglesons]

McCann is immensely more valuable than Carter and more valuable than Blueger.

In what ways? Regular season points and goals when games don’t matter. The analytic heads need to realize the game is different in the playoffs and players like McCann don’t succeed there. Love the guy, but later.

 

[Ryder71]

McCann is immensely more valuable than Carter and more valuable than Blueger.

You're crazy if you think McCann is better than Teddy, that's just utter nonsense. Teddy is a far more reliable 200ft player game in and game out.

 

[tom_servo]

The first mistake you made is already shoehorning these players into those names. They're not the next Rust or Kuhnhackl or Blueger. They're the next themselves. The fact that Sullivan tries to use them as previous iterations of his faves is a massive issue. We don't need a next ZAR or Simon.

I wasn't suggesting they imitate specific players. I'm suggesting they're either not ready or there's no room. Better opportunity next year.

We need these kids to get a shot to see what they have to offer without limiting their usage to one of those types. There's obviously good options to use in those situations like Zohorna, Bellerive, etc. Even Gruden to be honest would be a good option for a bottom 6 role.

But Puustinen isn't someone you start on the 4th. If you do, as a coach, you're (not you) a f***ing idiot at assessing your own talent on your team.

"Obviously"

You're just taking a handful of players and saying "please promote these guys."

What's broken with this group that you think .5 AHL ppg Jordy Bellerive would fix? In '16 there were actual shortcomings mended by WBS. This year? It's just playoff/injury roulette.

I would say next year will bring more opportunities. I'm looking forward to what Puustinen has to offer. But I'm a patient guy.

 

[tom_servo]

McCann is immensely more valuable than Carter and more valuable than Blueger.

You really need to explain this post.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I loved every single thing McCann was in florida and what he showed glimpses of.

But let's not fool ourselves. He went ghost town like no other. That guy got what he deserved when they let him go. It sucked because I really felt he had the tools that fit our team. He sure as f*** did not show them consistently. I'll take TB/Carter all day.

Yeah McCann's biggest issues were consistency and he would look disengaged, he did his best Koltsov impersonation with skating really really fast, but other than that, he looked lost for stretches and then would go on a hot streak. While that's something a learning player would go through in his development, the Pens didn't have the ice time for him to figure it out like Seattle is giving him, also Sully kept bouncing him around as LW/C/RW and that probably didn't help. There was that brief stretch he was a C and he looked great, I can't even remember now who the wingers were.

But as for Carter, he's a big body that has pedigree, you know what you're getting with him, his issue is the opposite for ice time, he's getting too much at his age vs McCann getting random ice times. I don't fault the move, to me we'd lose Blueger if we had both McCann and Tanev, given how bizarre Francis' picks were, I wouldn't be shocked if he tried to take Blueger from the Penguins as his 3c.

It is what it is, the damage of losing both is almost entirely lessened by keeping Blueger and adding McGinn and Heinen while also having cap savings in that regard. To me, it worked out fine.

There was no way McCann and Tanev were getting top line minutes like they were in Seattle, here, so their production looks nice to play the hindsight game in, but the context would be entirely lost on anyone that makes that comparison now.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I wasn't suggesting they imitate specific players. I'm suggesting they're either not ready or there's no room. Better opportunity next year.



"Obviously"

You're just taking a handful of players and saying "please promote these guys."

What's broken with this group that you think .5 AHL ppg Jordy Bellerive would fix? In '16 there were actual shortcomings mended by WBS. This year? It's just playoff/injury roulette.

I would say next year will bring more opportunities. I'm looking forward to what Puustinen has to offer. But I'm a patient guy.

Again you think I am going with this group is broken, it's not.

It's a matter of resting some of the older players, Boyle for one was playing far too much earlier on and started to look gassed and not as engaged, when he was off for a bit and came back, he looked good again, funny how an older player with severe health issues, might look like that.

So in that vein - Would it hurt us in the slightest to call up a player from the AHL to give them a game or 2 on the 4th line? Absolutely not. Bellerive has that snarl and energy you'd want on a 4th line for a call up, same for Angello who has looked good when called upon, Zohorna has looked good in his recent call ups, etc. Knowing where these kids are at now, is easier than say the last week of the season you lose a few players before the end of the season and suddenly are struggling to think of who might fit where with question marks at the NHL level, heading into the playoffs Game 1 and 2 or beyond.

Apparently that's entirely lost on you, mate, come on now, you might need to see some WBS games to see what these kids have to offer. Gruden is one I think would be a smart 4th line player that could eventually be a solid 3rd liner, just a smart position player that knows where to be on the ice to pick off passes, has that Blueger/Letestu smarts with his positioning and 2-way play.

I mean, imagine game 80, we lose Simon and Boyle, so we dress Zohorna and still have 12 we can play, then game 81 we lose Blueger and Rodrigues.

Now what?

"What was broken in this group!!!" wrong question, mate.

You either plan for all outcomes and be prepared or you sit at home and wonder what went wrong, like the last 4yrs.

 

[Pens x]

I would say next year will bring more opportunities. I'm looking forward to what Puustinen has to offer. But I'm a patient guy.

I guess that’s why you love Hextall.

 

[Pens x]

Again you think I am going with this group is broken, it's not.

It's a matter of resting some of the older players, Boyle for one was playing far too much earlier on and started to look gassed and not as engaged, when he was off for a bit and came back, he looked good again, funny how an older player with severe health issues, might look like that.

So in that vein - Would it hurt us in the slightest to call up a player from the AHL to give them a game or 2 on the 4th line? Absolutely not. Bellerive has that snarl and energy you'd want on a 4th line for a call up, same for Angello who has looked good when called upon, Zohorna has looked good in his recent call ups, etc. Knowing where these kids are at now, is easier than say the last week of the season you lose a few players before the end of the season and suddenly are struggling to think of who might fit where with question marks at the NHL level, heading into the playoffs Game 1 and 2 or beyond.

Apparently that's entirely lost on you, mate, come on now, you might need to see some WBS games to see what these kids have to offer. Gruden is one I think would be a smart 4th line player that could eventually be a solid 3rd liner, just a smart position player that knows where to be on the ice to pick off passes, has that Blueger/Letestu smarts with his positioning and 2-way play.

I mean, imagine game 80, we lose Simon and Boyle, so we dress Zohorna and still have 12 we can play, then game 81 we lose Blueger and Rodrigues.

Now what?

"What was broken in this group!!!" wrong question, mate.

You either plan for all outcomes and be prepared or you sit at home and wonder what went wrong, like the last 4yrs.

I think we would just forfeit or play 9 dmen in your examples.