Salary Cap: Pens Salary Cap Thread: Dr Strangedubas "Tankination" is the most monstrously conceived and dangerous communist plot we have ever had to face."

[Gurglesons]

Yeah, that was an absolute collapse.

It's just so weird how people act like Ron Hextall single handidly destroyed this franchise in the span of two-three years when he moved literally nothing of consequence.

Jared McCann, Brandon Tanev, Mike Matheson and John Marino had little to no effect on this franchise over the last few years.

He didn't trade a single 1st round pick.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

lol.

Fine and well-thought-out retort with objective evidence provided.
Who can argue with those solid 3 letters?

 

[Goalie_Bob]

I mean, technically they did miss the playoffs because they lost in the qualifying round.

We lost 8 of 11 heading into 3/10.

They probably lost 8 of 11 going into 3/10 of this season, then have righted the ship.

And everyone knows the Covid Cup playoffs was done that way for a cash grab at TV money. The Pens were in a playoff spot when they shut it down. That cannot be disputed. Stop what ifing it and go with the facts.

 

[Ryder71]

lol.

It's just so weird how people act like Ron Hextall single handidly destroyed this franchise in the span of two-three years when he moved literally nothing of consequence.

Jared McCann, Brandon Tanev, Mike Matheson and John Marino had little to no effect on this franchise over the last few years.

He didn't trade a single 1st round pick.

Not a fan of taking Pickering as our 1st rounder in '22.

 

[Gurglesons]

Fine and well-thought-out retort with objective evidence provided.
Who can argue with those solid 3 letters?

GDT: - Free Agency: Dr Strangedubas or How We Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Nerd

I don't know too much about graves but 4.5M really isn't that much for a top 4 Dman

forums.hfboards.com

"Go rewatch any playoff series with Graves.

He's going to be this board's least favorite player by January."

Not even worth the effort to quote the other stuff.

They probably lost 8 of 11 going into 3/10 of this season, then have righted the ship.

And everyone knows the Covid Cup playoffs was done that way for a cash grab at TV money. The Pens were in a playoff spot when they shut it down. That cannot be disputed. Stop what ifing it and go with the facts.

Must've forgot how bad they looked. Typical Mike Sullivan.

Plus Matt Murray was absolutely trash that year until the playoffs.

Not a fan of taking Pickering as our 1st rounder in '22.

Why?

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't even know why the Hextall argument is getting re-hashed again. He did a good job at first and I think he didn't get enough credit for how well he handled the losses in the expansion draft. He then did a terrible job at the end, which was capped off by him trading a 2nd rounder for a $5 million Granlund after getting lucky with getting out of some of his other bad deals.

His 2022 off-season and 2022-2023 season is what killed any chances of this team contending. He let Rodrigues walk despite ERod wanting to stay, which has been an absolutely disastrous decision with how solid of a middle-6 guy ERod has been since. He kept Kapanen at an inflated price even though Kapanen was rapidly falling off as a player. The only depth guys he added were Poehling and Archibald, both of who didn't even hit 15 points. Now add on regression from McGinn, Blueger and Carter and it was a miserable bottom-6 situation that was entirely of Hextall's doing.

He was so focused on making changes to the defense to make it more physical that he completely botched the bottom-6, and I'd even argue the changes he made to the defense made the team worse and hurt the bottom-6's ability to transition the puck. And none of this even includes his magnum opus mistake with the Granlund trade, after luckily getting out of the McGinn and Kapanen mistakes.

So yeah, when someone says "the only reason this team fell off in 2022-2023 is because of goaltending injuries", it's very easy to see how bullshit that is.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

GDT: - Free Agency: Dr Strangedubas or How We Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Nerd

I don't know too much about graves but 4.5M really isn't that much for a top 4 Dman

forums.hfboards.com

"Go rewatch any playoff series with Graves.

He's going to be this board's least favorite player by January."

Not even worth the effort to quote the other stuff.

Oh because YOU didn't like the signing that equates to "generally"? Note my exact statement:all were generally well-received on here
Do you always not read posts or just rush to reply when someone pushes against your narrative?

But man you sure nailed the Eller prediction!

 

[Ryder71]

GDT: - Free Agency: Dr Strangedubas or How We Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Nerd

I don't know too much about graves but 4.5M really isn't that much for a top 4 Dman

forums.hfboards.com

"Go rewatch any playoff series with Graves.

He's going to be this board's least favorite player by January."

Not even worth the effort to quote the other stuff.



Must've forgot how bad they looked. Typical Mike Sullivan.

Plus Matt Murray was absolutely trash that year until the playoffs.



Why?

I just don't think he's a very good prospect. Wasn't looking good in WB last year. Murashov though, could be a sleeper.

 

[chethejet]

Hextall made some really poor decisions that hamstrung the Pens in both contracts and talent. Carter was a disaster to give out the over 35 contract with a zero out Trading not only a second but for a player that wasn't close to what was needed was simply a joke. The player draft was not good and of course taking Petry and that contract was just head shaking at the expense of two defensemen and only showing a 3rd round pick. Old news but Dubas was limited and I do think he can move Karlsson for a nice package. Did he sign Jarry for to much? The jury is still out to me. Acciari was a contract that 3 years and I was disappointed in his physical presence. Graves was not good this year. So if Graves Jarry and Acciari can rebound, then things can be better. Smith is a plug and has to go. No one saw that coming but the facts are the facts.

 

[Gurglesons]

Oh because YOU didn't like the signing that equates to "generally"? Note my exact statement:all were generally well-received on here
Do you always not read posts or just rush to reply when someone pushes against your narrative?

But man you sure nailed the Eller prediction!

Do we think Eller is good? Are you bragging about Lars Eller?

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Hated the Eller contract when it was signed. Then I began to really like Lars Eller and what he was bringing most nights... but THEN I had to watch this coaching staff trip all over themselves to vastly overplay him this whole season and now I've kinda come all the way back around again to how I felt, initially.

I mean... it's not his fault but here we are.

 

[MrBrightside]

I don't even know why the Hextall argument is getting re-hashed again. He did a good job at first and I think he didn't get enough credit for how well he handled the losses in the expansion draft. He then did a terrible job at the end, which was capped off by him trading a 2nd rounder for a $5 million Granlund after getting lucky with getting out of some of his other bad deals.

How well he handled the losses in the expansion draft? Managing to lose both McCann and Tanev while protecting Carter was batshit crazy GM'ing. But I would agree that it's odd to be revisiting this at the moment.

 

[Gurglesons]

How well he handled the losses in the expansion draft? Managing to lose both McCann and Tanev while protecting Carter was batshit crazy GM'ing. But I would agree that it's odd to be revisiting this at the moment.

Not really. He replaced McCann and Tanev with Rodrigues and Heinen which cost about 4 million less.

 

[MrBrightside]

Not really. He replaced McCann and Tanev with Rodrigues and Heinen which cost about 4 million less.

If the suggestion there is that any combination of any of those players is equivalent to McCann, we will agree to disagree. Getting lucky with a couple of scrap heap UFA's helped offset it somewhat, but the process was horrendous and McCann alone is more valuable than the replacements.

 

[Gurglesons]

If the suggestion there is that any combination of any of those players is equivalent to McCann, we will agree to disagree. Getting lucky with a couple of scrap heap UFA's helped offset it somewhat, but the process was horrendous and McCann alone is more valuable than the replacements.

Both scored more goals that season than Jared McCann ever had in a PIT jersey.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Protecting Carter was one of the dumbest moves Hextall did, second only to signing him to that contract.

 

[MrBrightside]

Both scored more goals that season than Jared McCann ever had in a PIT jersey.

Ok. They are better than a guy who has put up 132 points the last 2 season. Hextall smart.

 

[Pancakes]

Protecting Carter was one of the dumbest moves Hextall did, second only to signing him to that contract.

Easily the dumbest move he made. Seattle wasn't going to claim him, and even if they did, who cares.

If this team has McCann the past two seasons they're a playoff team from that alone. Sully would have misused him but he still would have given secondary scoring even while being misused

 

[Gurglesons]

Ok. They are better than a guy who has put up 132 points the last 2 season. Hextall smart.

I'd take Evan Rodrigues over Jared McCann every day of the week.

McCann is an empty calorie scorer on a bad team.

McCann would've been Kasperi Kapanen 2.0 here under Mike Sullivan. 15 goal - 15 assist guy who succeeded when the top six was hurt.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yeah, and even if you protected him, why sign him to that poison pill awful contract? Hextall deserved being fired for that alone.

The problem is I don’t think Dubas has done any better, and that was a low bar to clear.

 

[K Fleur]

We haven’t had a bottom 6 worth caring about since Matt Cullen left the first time.

 

[Empoleon8771]

How well he handled the losses in the expansion draft? Managing to lose both McCann and Tanev while protecting Carter was batshit crazy GM'ing. But I would agree that it's odd to be revisiting this at the moment.

My point was more that he did a really good job at replacing who he lost with McCann and Tanev. ERod, Heinen and McGinn both did a great job at replacing what they lost with McCann and Tanev in 2021-2022. The issue is that he let ERod go and Heinen and McGinn fell off dramatically.

I'd take Evan Rodrigues over Jared McCann every day of the week.

McCann is an empty calorie scorer on a bad team.

McCann would've been Kasperi Kapanen 2.0 here under Mike Sullivan. 15 goal - 15 assist guy who succeeded when the top six was hurt.

If Hextall would have actually kept ERod, you'd have a point here. But he didn't keep ERod.

I would also take Rodrigues over McCann in a bottom-6 role. But the decisions Hextall made led to them having neither, and instead having Kapanen's bloated contract and the carcass of Carter on their 3rd line.

 

[Pancakes]

I do think it's fair to ask whether our bottom six would score much even with better players on it due to the way Sullivan deploys it and how he asks them to play.

That said, still have zero doubts we're a playoff team with McCann and E-Rod in our bottom six.

I wonder if E-Rod was let go because of cap concerns or if Sully was mad at him over the penalty he took vs the Rangers. If the latter, that's yet another black mark against Sully and his massive ego.

 

[Gurglesons]

If Hextall would have actually kept ERod, you'd have a point here. But he didn't keep ERod.

I would also take Rodrigues over McCann in a bottom-6 role. But the decisions Hextall made led to them having neither, and instead having Kapanen's bloated contract and the carcass of Carter on their 3rd line.

Rodrigues was allegedly not re-signed due to the coaching staff and their feelings on what he did in Game 6 of the playoff series against the Rangers according to local PIT media.

I do think it's fair to ask whether our bottom six would score much even with better players on it due to the way Sullivan deploys it and how he asks them to play.

That said, still have zero doubts we're a playoff team with McCann and E-Rod in our bottom six.

I wonder if E-Rod was let go because of cap concerns or if Sully was mad at him over the penalty he took vs the Rangers. If the latter, that's yet another black mark against Sully and his massive ego.

I mean if you add 8 million dollars of players to anyone's bottom six they are better.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Why can't we all just say "this team has been mismanaged at all levels ever since JR let Tom Wilson give him night terrors" and leave it at that? Hextall... Dubas... Sullivan... FSG... it's all middling-to-bad. And they are all guilty of more or less just shrugging their collective shoulders and saying "we gotta assess... again!" for the last like seven years without actually doing much of anything. Or at least anything that ended up making any kind of dent.

It's like fighting over who your favorite member of O-Town was or something. They all suck.