Post-Game Talk: Pens 4, Habs 3 (OT) - A Third Period Comeback?

[Penguinzilla*]

Has anyone noticed that the Pens make simple passes difficult? Passes on the PP are in player's skates or bouncing around. Players seem to assume that they can give Sid a pass anywhere and he'll be able to handle it. Even basic passes in the neutral zone are all over the place. If they could just clean it up and make some crisp passes, they'd probably score more.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

It boggles my mind that with a forward corps like we have, for the first time in Sid and Geno's tenure here, we're seeing Dupuis and/or Kunitz still duct-taped to Sid's wing.

I think it's even ****ing crazier that people are defending the decision to have Dupuis in the top-6.

 

[The Greatest 101]

Thought Duper was better than Bennett.

 

[radapex]

It boggles my mind that with a forward corps like we have, for the first time in Sid and Geno's tenure here, we're seeing Dupuis and/or Kunitz still duct-taped to Sid's wing.

I think it's even ****ing crazier that people are defending the decision to have Dupuis in the top-6.

My only defense of having Dupuis in the top 6 is that the alternatives are basically Kunitz, Plotnikov, or Cullen unless Hornqvist or Bennett can switch. I have no desire to see Sprong be forced into a top 6 LW role when he hasn't played the position in a few years.

I had originally considered/wanted Bonino to get a shot there, but he's been so effective at 3C I just can't see any reason to move him to wing (aside from the odd shift to take draws for Malkin).

 

[SidDidNothingWrong]

Markov and Gonchar was the first pairing for November and December. That meant they replaced SUBBAN.

Gonchar was acquired on veteran's day last year. Twist the point however you want. Gonchar was acquired to replace Subban on the first power play, which he did for the majority of November and December. MTLPENFAN.

Great players have bad runs. Much like Crosby and Letang are right now. Denying the fact that Letang was a better player up until his injury than Subban last year is ridiculous.

Since the 2010-11 season Letang when healthy has been in every Norris discussion. You can have your argument whatever it is, but the fact is given the NHL audience that votes on awards as well as does articles on the player's tribune, Letang is a top ten defenseman in the league.

Say whatever you want. People that don't just post on a message board and think they know what they are talking about have voted this player into the top ten Norris votes in the last five years.

Here is a breakdown in case you forgot.

2010-11

Lidstrom
Weber
Chara
Visnovsky
Yandle
Letang

2011-12
Karlsson
Weber
Chara
Pietranglo
Lidstrom
Girardi
Campbell
Suter
Letang

2012-13
Subban
Suter
Letang

2013-14
Letang was out the majority of the season

2014-15
Karlsson
Doughty
Subban
Weber
Josi
Giordano
Keith
Letang

You want to go by PPG?

Letang is top ten.

You want to go by playoff PPG?

Letang is number 6.

Your bias is ridiculous. Letang is in the upper echelon of top ten defensemen in the league. Not to mention he has done it in terrible systems with partners like Eaton, Orpik, and Scuderi. He had Martin for one season and had the best of his career. Put him with Markov or Josi and he is top three in the league easily.

Please tell me more about your eye test and how it makes Letang less of a player, because I really need to hear another Montreal fan defending Subban.

For how bad Letang is on the power play he is only behind eight other players in power play points since 2010-11. The player that played the least in the top eight is Shattenkirk and he missed 55 less game than Letang. Subban has played 92 more games than Letang in the last five years and has only 17 more points on the power play.

Want to take it to points? Letang is at 213 in 289 games since 2010-11. Subban is at 241 in 381 games.

Letang is an offensive powerhouse. He's got the defensive chops to back it up, especially when he is paired with someone that suits his game. Maybe one day when he is gone you'll appreciate it. I wish he was traded so we could see him come back and bite our team in the ass for trading him away.

This is savage. 100 percent agree. People always take the last time they saw a player and extrapolate ad infinitum. Do you know how many of my friends who are Rags fans and watch 2 Penguins games a year tell me "discoveries," or points about Sid? Apparently if a player has a slump, he is ****.

 

[SidDidNothingWrong]

Has anyone noticed that the Pens make simple passes difficult? Passes on the PP are in player's skates or bouncing around. Players seem to assume that they can give Sid a pass anywhere and he'll be able to handle it. Even basic passes in the neutral zone are all over the place. If they could just clean it up and make some crisp passes, they'd probably score more.

To be honest though I see that everywhere on every team. There just isn't a lot of time and space left in North American hockey, I don't think.

 

[Pancakes]

Tbh I really don't think Dupuis has looked too bad there. And the alternatives right now are:

Hornqvist - can't play LW
Kunitz - god no
Fehr - I'd be willing to give him another shot, but he didn't exactly look good in the (brief) time he got there.
Perron - I'd like to see this again as him and Sid had some chemistry at times last year but right now it's tough to break up that Geno line
Kessel - probably could play LW but belongs on the right, and looks good w Geno


It's not an easy problem to solve.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I hate that those are the only options management likely sees too. Sprong just isn't going to get a chance with MJ.

 

[Pancakes]

I hate that those are the only options management likely sees too. Sprong just isn't going to get a chance with MJ.

Completely forgot about Sprong but the obvious problem with him is he'd have to learn a new position and it's a bit much to ask an 18 year old kid to jump right in with Sidney Crosby.

I'd be willing to give it a try of course but I can see why MJ would be leery of it.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

You think Dupuis is better? I don't.

We have one legit top 6 winger on the LW depth chart. And Perron hasnt exactly torn it up. There's absolutely room to move Fehr up with 87 and 71.

Not like it matters though. Sid will play with #9 til the end of time.

"Eh." That's how I feel comparing the two honestly.

As far as Sid playing with Dupuis for all time, that's pretty much exactly what everyone said about Kunitz on that line. My response was "It could easily change" and I got screamed at, namely by some high and mighty posters frothing at the mouth who shall remain nameless. Whaddya know? After awhile Kunitz gets bumped down.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Like I laboriously illustrated to someone else: He's 30 years old. He's not a top 6 player. All the evidence points this way. He's not special all of a sudden because he's wearing your favorite team's jersey.

We shall call him Dupehr in a few years.

 

[Saints11]

My only defense of having Dupuis in the top 6 is that the alternatives are basically Kunitz, Plotnikov, or Cullen unless Hornqvist or Bennett can switch. I have no desire to see Sprong be forced into a top 6 LW role when he hasn't played the position in a few years.

I had originally considered/wanted Bonino to get a shot there, but he's been so effective at 3C I just can't see any reason to move him to wing (aside from the odd shift to take draws for Malkin).

I agree Bonino has played well at 3C, however, it is a position that Fehr has also excelled in. Putting Bonino on Sid's left could be ideal as he is more of a possession guy than Dupuis, who is more dump and chase.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

When has Fehr played with 2 quality playmakers like BB and Sid? All I'm saying is that it's worth a shot because the line has a solid dynamic. I'm not saying Fehr is the ideal left wing or anything like that.

Is it wrong to think that Dupuis isn't essential to the top line? Fehr is slower than prime Dupuis but larger, more physical, has comparable skill, and is just as good on the boards. If K-C-D was at the very least a very productive regular season line in 2010 is it crazy to think that F-C-B could be a very productive regular season line in 2015?

But I guess they should just stay the course with the way the goals have been coming in bunches. You can't mess with a lineup that's a consistent threat to put up more than one goal per game.

 

[HMPens]

Markov and Gonchar was the first pairing for November and December. That meant they replaced SUBBAN.

Gonchar was acquired on veteran's day last year. Twist the point however you want. Gonchar was acquired to replace Subban on the first power play, which he did for the majority of November and December. MTLPENFAN.

Great players have bad runs. Much like Crosby and Letang are right now. Denying the fact that Letang was a better player up until his injury than Subban last year is ridiculous.

Since the 2010-11 season Letang when healthy has been in every Norris discussion. You can have your argument whatever it is, but the fact is given the NHL audience that votes on awards as well as does articles on the player's tribune, Letang is a top ten defenseman in the league.

Say whatever you want. People that don't just post on a message board and think they know what they are talking about have voted this player into the top ten Norris votes in the last five years.

Here is a breakdown in case you forgot.

2010-11

Lidstrom
Weber
Chara
Visnovsky
Yandle
Letang

2011-12
Karlsson
Weber
Chara
Pietranglo
Lidstrom
Girardi
Campbell
Suter
Letang

2012-13
Subban
Suter
Letang

2013-14
Letang was out the majority of the season

2014-15
Karlsson
Doughty
Subban
Weber
Josi
Giordano
Keith
Letang

You want to go by PPG?

Letang is top ten.

You want to go by playoff PPG?

Letang is number 6.

Your bias is ridiculous. Letang is in the upper echelon of top ten defensemen in the league. Not to mention he has done it in terrible systems with partners like Eaton, Orpik, and Scuderi. He had Martin for one season and had the best of his career. Put him with Markov or Josi and he is top three in the league easily.

Please tell me more about your eye test and how it makes Letang less of a player, because I really need to hear another Montreal fan defending Subban.

For how bad Letang is on the power play he is only behind eight other players in power play points since 2010-11. The player that played the least in the top eight is Shattenkirk and he missed 55 less game than Letang. Subban has played 92 more games than Letang in the last five years and has only 17 more points on the power play.

Want to take it to points? Letang is at 213 in 289 games since 2010-11. Subban is at 241 in 381 games.

Letang is an offensive powerhouse. He's got the defensive chops to back it up, especially when he is paired with someone that suits his game. Maybe one day when he is gone you'll appreciate it. I wish he was traded so we could see him come back and bite our team in the ass for trading him away.

Excellent and well thought out, researched post!!! It confirms exactly what I feel and the value that Letang has with this team. Every top defenseman in the league has a very good partner that supports him, something Letang has only had for one season in Martin. I wonder how Subban would do carrying around a 5/6 defenseman on his top line.

 

[The Greatest 101]

^John Carlson is carrying Orpik though.Just saying.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

When has Fehr played with 2 quality playmakers like BB and Sid? All I'm saying is that it's worth a shot because the line has a solid dynamic. I'm not saying Fehr is the ideal left wing or anything like that.

Is it wrong to think that Dupuis isn't essential to the top line? Fehr is slower than prime Dupuis but larger, more physical, has comparable skill, and is just as good on the boards. If K-C-D was at the very least a very productive regular season line in 2010 is it crazy to think that F-C-B could be a very productive regular season line in 2015?

But I guess they should just stay the course with the way the goals have been coming in bunches. You can't mess with a lineup that's a consistent threat to put up more than one goal per game.

He's certainly not essential, I just don't think Fehr is any special answer either.

 

[Asuna]

aw darn

 

[theicebox]

aw darn

Are we talking career ending stuff right here?

 

[Pancakes]

Scuds is going to play through that illness and be even worse than normal

 

[cajal]

Scuds is going to play through that illness and be even worse than normal

And he'll be a hero for it.

 

[Asuna]

what are we ever going to do without defensive extraordinaire and super leader, rob scuderi???

 

[Headshot77]

Yeah, a mental illness.

 

[systemsgo]

Scuds is going to play through that illness and be even worse than normal

what a warrior

 

[Black Label]

I see Scuderi got that month old egg salad that I sent him.

 

[DegenX]