Salary Cap: Pens 2024 Summer Thread: "Thus, knocking us out of these superior numbers when we emerge! Mr. President, we must not allow a non-playoff bound gap!"

[Gurglesons]

You're literally just proving my point.

Every team has a Bryan Rust.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Who was more of an anchor this season: Bryan Rust or Jeff Carter?

 

[Empoleon8771]

I find it genuinely funny that my post of "Rust never gets the credit he deserves from fans on here, they will always find a way to downplay his abilities" is getting the responses that prove my exact point about how this place does that to Rust.

"Replaceable 2nd liner", "every team has Rust"...wow it's almost like my original point was that this place disrespects Rust by constantly downplaying his abilities, and those posts are literally just confirming my point.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

We'll all be sorry when Rust retires or is traded. Shame on us.

It's the off-season, so that means a bored Emp's gonna dig in his heels and post a manic myriad of sarcastic posts heavily arguing for an opinion that he'll eventually talk himself out of believing by the end.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Oh my goodness. I literally didn't even come in here today with an ounce of hate or resentment for the guy and if anything thought he had a good year and out of the three suspects (he, Raks and Smith) I would be happiest to keep him. Bagging on Bryan Rust wasn't at all the objective here. I think this shows something but maybe not what you want it to haha

Anyway... this has made me actually want to get back to work. So... thanks? Good heavens.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I for real despise Reilly Smith as a Penguin though. f*** that guy, he should be traded immediately and I don't give the slightest shit what the return is.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I for real despise Reilly Smith as a Penguin though. f*** that guy, he should be traded immediately and I don't give the slightest shit what the return is.

Now this is something we can all agree on

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I find it genuinely funny that my post of "Rust never gets the credit he deserves from fans on here, they will always find a way to downplay his abilities" is getting the responses that prove my exact point about how this place does that to Rust.

"Replaceable 2nd liner", "every team has Rust"...wow it's almost like my original point was that this place disrespects Rust by constantly downplaying his abilities, and those posts are literally just confirming my point.

I tend to agree, and I have been guilty of disrespecting him too. I now know that he is not going anywhere, so I don't even bother worrying about that any longer. Besides, I love how the top line performed down the stretch when O'Connor joined the line. I absolutely love that line because it allows us to add more talent on the other lines.

The problem is IF we do re-sign Guentzel, that line will be no more because of Sullivan. And that would be a shame. Or, if Dubas signs any big-name forward, Sullivan will break up that line. And to me, the key to turning things around is keeping that line intact, and adding more pieces to the other lines.

This is one of the biggest issues with Sullivan. If Crosby's line is not broken, he will always want to fix it anyway.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I tend to agree, and I have been guilty of disrespecting him too. I now know that he is not going anywhere, so I don't even bother worrying about that any longer. Besides, I love how the top line performed down the stretch when O'Connor joined the line. I absolutely love that line because it allows us to add more talent on the other lines.

The problem is IF we do re-sign Guentzel, that line will be no more because of Sullivan. And that would be a shame. Or, if Dubas signs any big-name forward, Sullivan will break up that line. And to me, the key to turning things around is keeping that line intact, and adding more pieces to the other lines.

This is one of the biggest issues with Sullivan. If Crosby's line is not broken, he will always want to fix it anyway.

Sullivan being here is a huge reason why I don't want to re-sign Guentzel. You know Guentzel will just go back to the old role he was in before he was traded, and we all know that role wasn't good enough for the team.

I'm not sure I'm comfortable with O'Connor on L1, but I know I'm not comfortable with paying Guentzel $9 million a year to go back to playing with Crosby and Rust on L1.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Sullivan being here is a huge reason why I don't want to re-sign Guentzel. You know Guentzel will just go back to the old role he was in before he was traded, and we all know that role wasn't good enough for the team.

I'm not sure I'm comfortable with O'Connor on L1, but I know I'm not comfortable with paying Guentzel $9 million a year to go back to playing with Crosby and Rust on L1.

I hear you. For me it is about the forward collective. Having that speed and that size and defensive acumen (O'Connor) allows for better line distribution. And maybe even a great acquisition to play with Malkin. Imagine that. Giving the second banana something special for the first time ever.

I don't know if O'Connor can keep it up, but that line deserves to start out together. Plus it follows the Dubas narrative of going with younger players in important positions.

That really is the key, and the only way we get back to the playoffs imo.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Regardless of whether or not we kneel before the shrine of Bryan Rust each night (sorry, I can't help it ), this team needs to find some serious scoring punch if they want to avoid continuing the steady and steep downward trajectory of recent seasons.

They're a length Sid injury away from a real ugly tumble imo. They needed another Jake-caliber scorer in addition to Jake last summer, now they have to find two. Not optimistic.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I guess to rehash the Guentzel discussion a bit, let's say a rock hits Sullivan in the head and he's suddenly willing to run with this top-6:

Guentzel-Crosby-O'Connor
Bunting-Malkin-Rust

This would involve Dubas trading both Rakell and Smith and using most of those savings to pay Guentzel. Is this something people would be fine with them doing? I'm not sold on O'Connor as a fit on L1, nor am I sure he can play RW consistently, but Guentzel is more than good enough of a LW for that line for me to be fine with them going super light on RW with Guentzel and Crosby.

I can't even begin to imagine how Dubas would be able to pull this off, though. Smith is probably movable with only having 1 year left on his deal plus him not having a terrible year, but Rakell's term is going to make that a really difficult sell. If you can dump Smith for nothing and trade Rakell for an expensive 3rd liner, that may give you the money to do this, but it's still iffy.

It's a moot point because you know it would be Guentzel-Crosby-Rust and Bunting-Malkin-Rakell if the Penguins brought back Guentzel. But just for this hypothetical, I'm curious for whether people would be more okay with bringing him back.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I guess to rehash the Guentzel discussion a bit, let's say a rock hits Sullivan in the head and he's suddenly willing to run with this top-6:

Guentzel-Crosby-O'Connor
Bunting-Malkin-Rust

This would involve Dubas trading both Rakell and Smith and using most of those savings to pay Guentzel. Is this something people would be fine with them doing? I'm not sold on O'Connor as a fit on L1, nor am I sure he can play RW consistently, but Guentzel is more than good enough of a LW for that line for me to be fine with them going super light on RW with Guentzel and Crosby.

I can't even begin to imagine how Dubas would be able to pull this off, though. Smith is probably movable with only having 1 year left on his deal plus him not having a terrible year, but Rakell's term is going to make that a really difficult sell. If you can dump Smith for nothing and trade Rakell for an expensive 3rd liner, that may give you the money to do this, but it's still iffy.

It's a moot point because you know it would be Guentzel-Crosby-Rust and Bunting-Malkin-Rakell if the Penguins brought back Guentzel. But just for this hypothetical, I'm curious for whether people would be more okay with bringing him back.

I would do that in a heartbeat. That would allow them to do what Sully wants: 2 Top heavy scoring lines.

If you're gonna have your bottom 2 lines play defense all the time, then just get a bunch of WBS guys and let those lines have decent C's like Lars Eller, etc and call it a day.

This insistence on bringing in top dollar bottom 6ers is dumb and a waste of cap resources.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I would do that in a heartbeat. That would allow them to do what Sully wants: 2 Top heavy scoring lines.

If you're gonna have your bottom 2 lines play defense all the time, then just get a bunch of WBS guys and let those lines have decent C's like Lars Eller, etc and call it a day.

This insistence on bringing in top dollar bottom 6ers is dumb and a waste of cap resources.

I mean, they missed the playoffs in large part last year due to not getting enough production from their bottom-6. They need to spend money on their bottom-6 to make it better because they don't have players in WBS worth a damn that can play those regular minutes.

 

[Gurglesons]

I find it genuinely funny that my post of "Rust never gets the credit he deserves from fans on here, they will always find a way to downplay his abilities" is getting the responses that prove my exact point about how this place does that to Rust.

"Replaceable 2nd liner", "every team has Rust"...wow it's almost like my original point was that this place disrespects Rust by constantly downplaying his abilities, and those posts are literally just confirming my point.

Every team has a Bryan Rust.

Place any of Rakell and Smith in the usage he gets or got after Jake left for 30-40 games and they produce exactly the same.

He's also at the age where his game could easily fall off within the next year.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I respect no athlete because I am not a chump.

 

[Gurglesons]

I don't see why saying what I said is even a negative towards Bryan Rust.

He's a solid player, he's paid fairly, and he is a positive asset.

It's similar to Marcus Pettersson being annoited as this steadfast defensive mastermind who is our best defenseman by certain crowds.

Marcus Pettersson is a rudimentary # 3 / # 4 defenseman. Nothing special. Every team has him.

Even the San Jose Sharks are firing their coach before us.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

???-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Geno-???
DOC-Pono-Rakell
Puljujarvi-Eller-Puustinen

Gotta find two legit scoring line wingers imo. Like, Jake-caliber guys or better.

 

[SomeDude]

Even the San Jose Sharks are firing their coach before us.

In the likely event Quinn won’t be able to get another head coaching gig, Sully will 100% push for him to be added to his staff.

We’re gonna end up with a coaching staff of Sully, Quinn, and Keefe. Just a colossal collection of failure.

 

[orby]

???-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Geno-???
DOC-Pono-Rakell
Puljujarvi-Eller-Puustinen

Gotta find two legit scoring line wingers imo. Like, Jake-caliber guys or better.

The only guy even close to Guentzel's caliber who will be available in free agency is Sam Reinhart, and I shudder to imagine what he'll cost after the season he just had. Matt Duchene is another option, but I certainly don't think they should be looking to get older at wing.

 

[Pancakes]

I don't see why saying what I said is even a negative towards Bryan Rust.

He's a solid player, he's paid fairly, and he is a positive asset.

It's similar to Marcus Pettersson being annoited as this steadfast defensive mastermind who is our best defenseman by certain crowds.

Marcus Pettersson is a rudimentary # 3 / # 4 defenseman. Nothing special. Every team has him.

Even the San Jose Sharks are firing their coach before us.

You can't just trade every single Rust or Mp and expect to not be a garbage heap though.

You might say oh you trade Rust and get a first and then use the cap space to sign Jake or Debrusk or whoever but it's not that simple. Those guys have to want to sign here.

That's my issue with people who want to firesale every asset that's not Sid that we have.

 

[Gurglesons]

In the likely event Quinn won’t be able to get another head coaching gig, Sully will 100% push for him to be added to his staff.

We’re gonna end up with a coaching staff of Sully, Quinn, and Keefe. Just a colossal collection of failure.

Already made that comment in the coaching thread lol

You can't just trade every single Rust or Mp and expect to not be a garbage heap though.

You might say oh you trade Rust and get a first and then use the cap space to sign Jake or Debrusk or whoever but it's not that simple. Those guys have to want to sign here.

That's my issue with people who want to firesale every asset that's not Sid that we have.

Kyle Dubas' messaging is to mimic the LA Kings and New York Rangers model and be competitive, but get younger.

The successful way to do that is by dealing your valuable assets for picks and prospects and then using the cap space opened up to acquire youth.

Vegas and Boston have shown this format. You go into the season with cap space and use the trade deadline to make big swings.

 

[SomeDude]

That's my issue with people who want to firesale every asset that's not Sid that we have.

Well, that would be the quickest way to assemble good enough prospects to hopefully be a contender again.

It’s all about if you want to watch a middling team for another 5 years just for them to go into full sell mode (assuming we have anything worth selling at that point) or rip the band-aid off quick.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

The only guy even close to Guentzel's caliber who will be available in free agency is Sam Reinhart, and I shudder to imagine what he'll cost after the season he just had. Matt Duchene is another option, but I certainly don't think they should be looking to get older at wing.

Yeah, this team's gonna have to super overpay anybody to lure 'em to this sinking ship.

In short; not stoked. This team's just gonna be worse, because nothing's gonna change (Sullivan, power play) and they can't/won't find the additions needed to alter their course.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I mean, they missed the playoffs in large part last year due to not getting enough production from their bottom-6. They need to spend money on their bottom-6 to make it better because they don't have players in WBS worth a damn that can play those regular minutes.

They missed the playoffs bc their PP was shitty and they couldn't hold leads. The bottom 6 was way down the list of reasons for their season ended up like this.