OT: Penn Station renovation and what it means for Madison Square Garden

[sbjnyc]

The Queens Blvd ridership is low, because you have three additional trains running on the line. Seats on E and F express trains during the morning rush are pretty much gone when the trains leave Jamaica Center / 179th St. A lot of ridership on Queens Blvd trains originates from bus transfers. That is why the QB local trains, which begin in Forest Hills, do not get much ridership when compared to the expresses. The M-train providing 6th Avenue service directly from the QB local prevents a lot of transfers at Queens Plaza compared to when the G ran to Forest Hills.

The Brooklyn M is amusing. I love watching riders transfer at Delancy / Essex St. Riders will come in over the bridge on a Nassau St train, and get off at Essex St. There will be a chain of straphangers positioned at various points along the stairs from the upper level to the lower level where the F stops. And you'll see people wait to see which train comes first... The F or the M, and then you'll see the swarm of people move to that platform to get on the 6th Ave train.

The M is usually a shorter train (eight 60 ft cars), and has great ridership. I recall reading that a lot of gentrifiers were ecstatic when they were given a 1-seat ride to midtown with the re-opening of the Chrystie St connection from the Broadway (Brooklyn) subway.

I live in Forest Hills and occasionally take the subway to work and while the R trains aren't as crowded as the E/F, they fill up before Manhattan. M train not as much. I also used to work in Union Square and would occasionally take the M and transfer to the L. That was excrutiating.

 

[GordonGecko]

He called it, "The train to Macy's basement". It was going to be a separate tunnel and track / platform system to the north of the current station. It would NOT have continued north and east, but would have provided a dedicated facility for NJT trains..

There was money to start it, but no where near enough to finish it.

Yes it was the train to nowhere, they didn't have a real plan for where to land the tracks. There's a general lack of unified vision for the train complex at Penn. And yes NJ would have been on the hook and I don't blame Christie for cancelling the project but then again he hasn't exactly done anything to get a proper solution built. The Port Authority is basically a giant slush fund for the governors of NY/NJ who pillage from massive tolls on the Hudson crossing and don't re-allocate the funds properly.

 

[dstoffa]

Yes it was the train to nowhere, they didn't have a real plan for where to land the tracks. There's a general lack of unified vision for the train complex at Penn. And yes NJ would have been on the hook and I don't blame Christie for cancelling the project but then again he hasn't exactly done anything to get a proper solution built. The Port Authority is basically a giant slush fund for the governors of NY/NJ who pillage from massive tolls on the Hudson crossing and don't re-allocate the funds properly.

I know the PA funds the PATH, but I have no idea what portion of a typical PA toll funds mass transit (PATH).

What I do know, is that when the toll across an East River Bridge was $2.00, only $0.35 went to the bridges / tunnels, and $1.65 went to fund mass transit in some way.. Not sure if that ration still holds true.

 

[sbjnyc]

I know the PA funds the PATH, but I have no idea what portion of a typical PA toll funds mass transit (PATH).

What I do know, is that when the toll across an East River Bridge was $2.00, only $0.35 went to the bridges / tunnels, and $1.65 went to fund mass transit in some way.. Not sure if that ration still holds true.

That was probably how they allocated the bond offering based on estimated ridership but each toll goes towards the interest on those bonds. Actual breakdown will depend on how many tolls are actually paid.