Post-Game Talk: Pain - CHI 6 EDM 4 - CHI leads series 1-0

[dustrock]

The Hawks did a lot of video on the Oilers I think.

Forecheck hard and our D have trouble with moving the puck.

This is why teams like Vegas are hard for us to beat.

In 2 years having Broberg and Bouchard will make that less effective because they're better in transition but sure looked like they were targeting Larsson and Nurse to me.

 

[MaxR11]

Not sure what it is, but its just odd, but this year Drai put the team on his back, and despite McD potentially being the best player on Earth something seems off with him since Drai reached this stratosphere. What is it? Is it that Nuge works better with Drai, That several players seem to work better with Drai.

Just seems to me that suddenly Mcd is not the leader of this team and he's not quite sure what to do about that. Pregame, seconds before puck drop McD seen shouting encouragement at the bench, very livid, but looking almost angry. Proceeds to play an absolute dog of a game in one of the biggest games of his career. Being this is a 5 game series possibly the biggest.

So the thing is even though McD is completely healthy, totally rehabbed, something about the current McD isn't looking like McD. What happened to the dominance? Theres shifts where you don't even notice him, others where you notice him because of giveaways. I mean its one thing to have a pass intercepted. But to get stripped clean right behind your net with time and space to move. McD was not mentally prepared for this game. But theres a mental part of his game that hasn't been up to his standard much of the season.

I think it's poor habits that have become ingrained in his game through the years. He did not use to play with this lack of urgency and laziness/cheating so much when he first came in in the first couple of years. He was actually a decently complete player with better and more consistent effort level and battle. But over the years he got checked tighter and to continue to put up huge points he's "learned" some bad habits of cheating and laziness (to preserve energy).... fly bys to get a jump and or not have to stop and start to save energy, save energy with poor effort in battles or just lets others battle for the puck while he shuffles off and cheats to open ice, not the same energy level on defence again to save energy for offence.

Just bad habits ingrained with those super long shifts he and drai used to take. You cannot play that many 1 plus minute shifts in a game and not coast, cheat and lack effort in defensive responsibility. Unfortunately these habits can be hard to shake off and it becomes your default game.

I felt like it kind of became quite noticeable sometime during the 17-18 year (i noticed it a bit in the 16-17 season especially the playoffs but it wasn't extremely obvious) but was very noticeable in the 18-19 year. It's kind of backed up by the huge drop in plus minus even though that's his high mark in points in 18-19.

 

[Cloned]

Fair. Still think Holland has a metric crap ton of work to do before this team can be a constant playoff team. So hopefully we can take steps toward that.

He needs another legitimate top 6 winger, a 3C and another Top 4 d-man. That should be enough to make this a constant playoff team. Easier said than done though.

 

[Cloned]

Unfortunately I remembered about the Kings 82 series and this is eerily reminiscent. A Kings team that really wasnt that good but had one thing going for it, they could score and play in a track meet.

Similarly, today, the Oilers were made to look like a club that needs directional arrows to know where they go in own zone. But they do know, and it was straight up puck chasing panic time.

In anycase McDrai and Nuge don't have that kind of time. The legends Oilers team got those playoff experiences quickly under their belt. This group is well into their NHL careers and don't have time to figure it out. The win bubble closed quickly in hockey, finite amount of time. Toews and Kane had cups already at our stars age.

Fair point with your last paragraph.

A unfortunate result of Chiarelli's tenure.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

He needs another legitimate top 6 winger, a 3C and another Top 4 d-man. That should be enough to make this a constant playoff team. Easier said than done though.

Edmonton won't really have the opportunity to improve its roster until Neal's contract is off the table.

 

[CycloneSweep]

He needs another legitimate top 6 winger, a 3C and another Top 4 d-man. That should be enough to make this a constant playoff team. Easier said than done though.

We don't need a top 4 dman. We need a top pairing dman, full stop. We don't have one. We don't have any prospects that are on trend to be there either. Our defensive statistically is bottom 5 in the league. We need massive improvements defensively.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Edmonton won't really have the opportunity to improve its roster until Neal's contract is off the table.

Then we might as well start selling cause the help isn't coming internally either. This team has a couple massive massive holes.

 

[Cloned]

Edmonton won't really have the opportunity to improve its roster until Neal's contract is off the table.

Probably, but Holland has worked magic before.

 

[Cloned]

We don't need a top 4 dman. We need a top pairing dman, full stop. We don't have one. We don't have any prospects that are on trend to be there either. Our defensive statistically is bottom 5 in the league. We need massive improvements defensively.

Nurse - Bear
Klefbom - X

is probably good enough to be a constant playoff team. Top end contender, probably not, but if one of Broberg or Bouchard can be as good as prime Letang, it might be enough.

 

[FlameChampion]

Usually I can tell which player on the ice is 97 without seeing the number.

For 90% of the game today I honestly couldn't even tell when he was on the ice 5v5.

I know it's a poor Edmonton/sports fan tradition to tag on the superstars but we know it's up to 97 & 29 to deliver us from evil.

So let me spread the blame around:

Kassian has been poor since he signed the extension. Thought he was supposed to be a catalyst in the playoffs. He was terrible

Bottom 6 was pretty barfy although Archibald and Neal were pretty decent.

AA is a snoozefest and I'd rather have Benson in TBH. Athanasiou will be in Europe in 2 years.

Can't have Kassian, Neal, Chiasson, Sheahan and Khaira. Toooooooo slooooooow.

Funny thing today - you know who would have actually helped? Mike Green.

What do you do with the D? Russell was actually our best D-man.

You really going to bench Klefbom or Nurse for Jones?

Put in Jones wrong side for Benning?

I think they need to go back to RNH - Drai - Yama. That line has chemistry and was dominant.

I think they just need to put McDavid with whoever and hope that they have a positive impact. Its too late in the season to try and find him linemates that he has chemistry with, when he doesnt seem to have chemistry with anyone.

I am not sure why they are not playing Nygard - Sheahan - Archibald. That line was pretty good and had chemistry.

I know Khaira was good on the PK. Neal and Chiasson are good on the PP. I just feel like having them all play doesnt work for the team 5 on 5. I guess if they are playing on the fourth line, it doesnt really matter all that much though. Contracts aside, I dont think those guys are losing us games playing on the fourth line.

I think for the defense, I am not sure what you can really do there. I think you have to just hope they bounce back. I think Jones is better than Russell, but if Russell was one of our better dman today than /shrug.

 

[snipes]

Benning and Russell were our only D who didn’t get caved on the fancy stats. Larsson and Nurse in particular got destroyed hovering in the 30% range.

Benning and Russell were the only D men with positive possession stats at 58% and 59%.

Our bottom 6 forwards actually had pretty good possession stats, Neal, AA, and Chiasson were above 60%. The top 6 however, yikes. Horrible. McDavid, Nuge, and Kassian in particular were destroyed.

The possession numbers seem to match the eye test from what I saw in the first half of the game.

 

[snipes]

Delete

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

Probably, but Holland has worked magic before.

Hopefully he can work some more magic and get rid of Neal too.

Neal is easily our worst 5 on 5 forward.

 

[CycloneSweep]

Nurse - Bear
Klefbom - X

is probably good enough to be a constant playoff team. Top end contender, probably not, but if one of Broberg or Bouchard can be as good as prime Letang, it might be enough.

Nurse and Bear are not a top NHL pairing, not on a good team. Replacing Larsson with a 2nd pairing defender isn't enough to massively improve our defense. Broberg and Bouchard turning into prime Letang would be a godsend but it's a damn long shot.

We are a bottom 5 team defensively. We need to completely rebuild our defense starting with a true top pairing guy.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Fair point with your last paragraph.

A unfortunate result of Chiarelli's tenure.

Even with that Tippett was able to coach through the pretty considerable deficiencies in this lineup. His schemes and attention to detail allowed scrub depth players to approach being cogs, and the season was really characterised by how much the depth contribution seemed to pick up as the season went on. So that he had the team gelling by Christmas which was astounding considering all the new faces. Now with the long break it seems back to a team that just isn't a team and guys forgetting how they learned to play with each other.

A key problem is the length of the gap of no games far exceeded any period of time in which this lineup found their chemistry.

Thus the players looking lost, lacking identity, purpose. The team started to know what it is, now forgot what it is.

 

[Ritchie Valens]

Wrong thread

 

[CycloneSweep]

Even with that Tippett was able to coach through the pretty considerable deficiencies in this lineup. His schemes and attention to detail allowed scrub depth players to approach being cogs, and the season was really characterised by how much the depth contribution seemed to pick up as the season went on. So that he had the team gelling by Christmas which was astounding considering all the new faces. Now with the long break it seems back to a team that just isn't a team and guys forgetting how they learned to play with each other.

A key problem is the length of the gap of no games far exceeded any period of time in which this lineup found their chemistry.

Thus the players looking lost, lacking identity, purpose. The team started to know what it is, now forgot what it is.

Incredible how terribly weak this team is mentally. They all have a loser mentality from the decade of shit and they finally look like they have a backbone and have it and a few months off they completely forgot. It's really sad

 

[AddyTheWrath]

I went back through the stat lines for those first five games. Smith won the first two games then Koskinen won the next two. Smith won the 5th against the Rangers.

Tippett's comment makes it sound like Smith won all five but it was shared duty until the 5th game.

Yea and Smith was pretty ass game 2. Game 3 and 4 Kosk was great.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Hopefully he can work some more magic and get rid of Neal too.

Neal is easily our worst 5 on 5 forward.

Hopefully he makes Kassian disappear.

 

[MaxR11]

We don't need a top 4 dman. We need a top pairing dman, full stop. We don't have one. We don't have any prospects that are on trend to be there either. Our defensive statistically is bottom 5 in the league. We need massive improvements defensively.

I'm not sure we necessarily need a top pairing dman. I think our defensive woes are much more because of our forwards and their inconsistent urgency and effort level and attention to details in the dzone and even on the back check. It's a bit similar to goals against not being all on the goalie and likely most of the times it has to do with how well and predictable the 5 guys in front of him are playing defensively. The dmen can also be left on islands and look bad when the fwds are playing stupid in front of them and not picking up the right reads or moving to the right spots. Most effective defence is really a 6 man unit. Teams with good habits and playing culture all know this which is why some of them can get away with no name defence or defensmen that make a name for themselves and look better than they actually are because they always play as a strong tight 5 man unit... and then sometimes they leave that team with the strong playing culture for big bucks to a team that does not have that same culture and look like cr** and people wonder why.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Incredible how terribly weak this team is mentally. They all have a loser mentality from the decade of shit and they finally look like they have a backbone and have it and a few months off they completely forgot. It's really sad

They saw Smith behind them and thought “uh oh not again”.

 

[CycloneSweep]

They saw Smith behind them and thought “uh oh not again”.

A loser mentaliry. Through and through.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

Hopefully he makes Kassian disappear.

My dad is in his 70's and Kassian is his favorite player...so your posting made me chuckle.

 

[space321]

Number 1 priority for next year is a legit top 6 winger for McDavid.

Not a grinder who can only score when the puck is spoonfed to him (ala Kassian), not a project player (Athanasiou or Puljujarvi), but a winger who knows how to score/pass for 18+ minutes per game.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

My dad is in his 70's and Kassian is his favorite player...so your posting made me chuckle.

When Kassian is on he’s great, but those games are so few and far in between. The Hawks left him alone and sure enough he vanished.