OHL Trades 2016-17 Season Thread

[scokan]

FWIW in the salary cap era the stanley cup winners last year only had 8 players on its roster that were drafted by them, the rest were brought in thru FA and trades. just goes to show when building a championship caliber team that you can only draft so much before you must bring in the missing pieces.

 

[rangersblues]

You make some excellent points SFC. If memory serves me correct the Quebec league, in the midst of a Memorial Cup drought, was one of the first to build a "super team" by trading away future draft picks for current stars en masse. I recall thinking at the time it seemed like a league conspiracy to stack one team. Teams from other leagues picked up on this, seized the opportunity and we are where we are today. I wouldn't say that teams conspire today but I believe that's where the "super team" concept began. It definitely takes the Cinderella story out of the equation for the most part which I believe isn't good for the CHL as a whole.

I don't recall the details of that particular trade that alarmed me initially. I don't even recall if that team was successful winning the Memorial Cup, although the Q has won their share since that drought was snapped.

 

[aresknights]

SCF, thank you for the well thought out post.
Probly a topic that does deserve its own thread.
A venting place for anti London lol and some great ideas n good discussion would take place.

 

[rangersblues]

SCF, thank you for the well thought out post.
Probly a topic that does deserve its own thread.
A venting place for anti London lol and some great ideas n good discussion would take place.

I would hope that thread wouldn't degenerate into that. You're right - it would be some interesting discussion.

 

[member 71782]

There are a number of ways to improve this league, OHL/CHL and I think the first thing is to put all 3 leagues under the same set of rules for everything from drafting age, trade rules, length of schedule etc.

Next would be their respective drafts.

With the OHL doing a supplemental draft this year for midget major aged kids I would like to see the main draft reduced to 10 rounds. This would increase the value of draft picks, forcing teams to improve their scouting and focus more on kids that will likely show up. Also having a 2 round supplemental draft for 17 year olds and older the main draft should become a 16 year old draft only.

The Import draft should be reduced to a single round, allow goaltenders again.

Draft picks from the main draft, including 1rsts and the import draft would be tradeable, the picks from the supplemental draft would not be tradeable.

Trading non reporting 1rst round players must include the acquiring teams own 1rst round pick the following year thus eliminating the need for compensatory picks from the league. This should also help level the playing field for where kids will report if they are declared non reporting as it limits their destinations on what teams are available to trade for them based on who has their own 1rst rounders available. Only non reporting 1rst rounders can be traded prior to the start of the season and the trades can be expanded to include other players/picks.

Rights to any other non reporting players cannot be traded until after the first season.

All first year players that have reported should be available for trade at the same time as first round players currently are. Give them equal treatment and opportunity for increased playing time as well as for teams acquiring younger players more chances to increase their youth if they are rebuilding.

Move the draft back until 2 weeks after the Memorial Cup, open up trades again 1 week prior to the draft and allow players to be traded including during the draft.

Place a 3 or 4 year limit on how far out draft picks can be traded. It is getting ridiculous when you see draft picks moved that are 10 years out. This will start forcing teams to make more hockey trades that benefit both teams.

Allow teams to carry 3 import players even though you are reducing the import draft to a single round.

Change the OA eligibility requirements from one year in the league to two years in the CHL to be eligible as an OA.

Increase the stipend given to players based on number of years played in the league.

Improve the standard education package and if possible allow for the ability for players to negotiate a better education package.

Eliminate the restrictions on the number of "gold" level education packages.

 

[aresknights]

I would hope that thread wouldn't degenerate into that. You're right - it would be some interesting discussion.

It would a little (and I get it) but hopefully the posters with some good insight (on either side) would take over.
Very interesting read the last few over on the Rangers board. As a group of posters, Ranger fans, probly the most insightful on HF ohl site.

 

[OhSheila]

Excellent Post SFC

SFC that is a well thought out and well written post.

I struggle with players being moved, especially when their education is affected. It may even be more attractive to incoming players and families to know trades are limited.

The rules dictate the way teams operate. The Knights have led they way in knowing that under the current rules draft picks are the currency needed in today's OHL. They trade their assets at their peak and get the best return for them. When they want to add to their team they have the assets needed to obtain them.

Erie and Windsor have depleted their drafts picks severely. From 2017 to 2022 Erie has no 2nd round picks and only one 3rd round pick in 2019. From 2017 to 2026 the Spitfires do not have a 2nd round pick. They don't have a 3rd round pick from 2017 to 2022. Right now, teams that don't have their own or extra draft picks can't compete come trade deadline. It will be tough for Windsor and Erie to build their teams back up after this season.

If rule changes are put in place to restrict trading, teams will need to upgrade their scouting and player development. The importance will be on your scouting, drafting, recruiting, coaching and development. Players won't have their education disrupted as much. That's not a bad thing.

 

[ohloutsider]

There are a number of ways to improve this league, OHL/CHL and I think the first thing is to put all 3 leagues under the same set of rules for everything from drafting age, trade rules, length of schedule etc.

Next would be their respective drafts.

With the OHL doing a supplemental draft this year for midget major aged kids I would like to see the main draft reduced to 10 rounds. This would increase the value of draft picks, forcing teams to improve their scouting and focus more on kids that will likely show up. Also having a 2 round supplemental draft for 17 year olds and older the main draft should become a 16 year old draft only.

The Import draft should be reduced to a single round, allow goaltenders again.

Draft picks from the main draft, including 1rsts and the import draft would be tradeable, the picks from the supplemental draft would not be tradeable.

Trading non reporting 1rst round players must include the acquiring teams own 1rst round pick the following year thus eliminating the need for compensatory picks from the league. This should also help level the playing field for where kids will report if they are declared non reporting as it limits their destinations on what teams are available to trade for them based on who has their own 1rst rounders available. Only non reporting 1rst rounders can be traded prior to the start of the season and the trades can be expanded to include other players/picks.

Rights to any other non reporting players cannot be traded until after the first season.

All first year players that have reported should be available for trade at the same time as first round players currently are. Give them equal treatment and opportunity for increased playing time as well as for teams acquiring younger players more chances to increase their youth if they are rebuilding.

Move the draft back until 2 weeks after the Memorial Cup, open up trades again 1 week prior to the draft and allow players to be traded including during the draft.

Place a 3 or 4 year limit on how far out draft picks can be traded. It is getting ridiculous when you see draft picks moved that are 10 years out. This will start forcing teams to make more hockey trades that benefit both teams.

Allow teams to carry 3 import players even though you are reducing the import draft to a single round.

Change the OA eligibility requirements from one year in the league to two years in the CHL to be eligible as an OA.

Increase the stipend given to players based on number of years played in the league.

Improve the standard education package and if possible allow for the ability for players to negotiate a better education package.

Eliminate the restrictions on the number of "gold" level education packages.

A lot of good ideas and I think the kids and their education should be an important part of how teams are allowed to operate - but like everything else the league has to look at how changes impact different markets. Teams with smaller budgets will not be in a position to offer more gold packages. The big budget teams would again have an advantage. League has to somehow look at these rules and how it impacts all 20 teams.
Do agree that all 3 leagues need to operate under the same set of rules.

 

[rangersblues]

It would a little (and I get it) but hopefully the posters with some good insight (on either side) would take over.
Very interesting read the last few over on the Rangers board. As a group of posters, Ranger fans, probly the most insightful on HF ohl site.

A lot of built up frustration boiling over. I would imagine things are settled for the time being but ...

Every team has their share of knowledgeable fans. Just that some fan bases are bigger than others. I also think "insightfulness" (some would call it whining) comes out more during tough times. It's not all rah rah and back slapping like it gets sometimes when you're winning.

 

[OhSheila]

Yep

RangersBlues and I have differing opinions, but RangersBlues has my respect and we share a mutual love for the Rangers. We'd probably fight over who is getting the last Bracco T-shirt at Rangers Authentics though

 

[rangersblues]

RangersBlues and I have differing opinions, but RangersBlues has my respect and we share a mutual love for the Rangers. We'd probably fight over who is getting the last Bracco T-shirt at Rangers Authentics though

That's a great way of summing things up OS. I think all families disagree from time to time. There may be a lot of differing opinions but that's what makes it fun.

We might be fighting over the last shirt at that lol.

 

[Buttsy]

I would hope that thread wouldn't degenerate into that. You're right - it would be some interesting discussion.

Great topic but in fairness it will be a mud slinging thread quickly. London draws the most ridiculous posts out of people seen by man. I appreciate for the most part this discusssion has reasonable hockey folks looking to address perhaps a league wide problem. But it will plummet quickly once the haters find it. Until then though some solid ideas keep them coming I'm learning!

 

[Ward Cornell]

We might at that lol.

as a poster said on another Ranger board...Bracco hoodies are only available now in "fleeced".

 

[Buttsy]

We might at that lol.

We all got a "game worn" for sale down here in London. No, no it's real ....

 

[aresknights]

There are a number of ways to improve this league, OHL/CHL and I think the first thing is to put all 3 leagues under the same set of rules for everything from drafting age, trade rules, length of schedule etc.

Next would be their respective drafts.

With the OHL doing a supplemental draft this year for midget major aged kids I would like to see the main draft reduced to 10 rounds. This would increase the value of draft picks, forcing teams to improve their scouting and focus more on kids that will likely show up. Also having a 2 round supplemental draft for 17 year olds and older the main draft should become a 16 year old draft only.

The Import draft should be reduced to a single round, allow goaltenders again.

Draft picks from the main draft, including 1rsts and the import draft would be tradeable, the picks from the supplemental draft would not be tradeable.

Trading non reporting 1rst round players must include the acquiring teams own 1rst round pick the following year thus eliminating the need for compensatory picks from the league. This should also help level the playing field for where kids will report if they are declared non reporting as it limits their destinations on what teams are available to trade for them based on who has their own 1rst rounders available. Only non reporting 1rst rounders can be traded prior to the start of the season and the trades can be expanded to include other players/picks.

Rights to any other non reporting players cannot be traded until after the first season.

All first year players that have reported should be available for trade at the same time as first round players currently are. Give them equal treatment and opportunity for increased playing time as well as for teams acquiring younger players more chances to increase their youth if they are rebuilding.

Move the draft back until 2 weeks after the Memorial Cup, open up trades again 1 week prior to the draft and allow players to be traded including during the draft.

Place a 3 or 4 year limit on how far out draft picks can be traded. It is getting ridiculous when you see draft picks moved that are 10 years out. This will start forcing teams to make more hockey trades that benefit both teams.

Allow teams to carry 3 import players even though you are reducing the import draft to a single round.

Change the OA eligibility requirements from one year in the league to two years in the CHL to be eligible as an OA.

Increase the stipend given to players based on number of years played in the league.

Improve the standard education package and if possible allow for the ability for players to negotiate a better education package.

Eliminate the restrictions on the number of "gold" level education packages.

TY and some great ideas here.

 

[Ward Cornell]

A lot of good ideas and I think the kids and their education should be an important part of how teams are allowed to operate - but like everything else the league has to look at how changes impact different markets. Teams with smaller budgets will not be in a position to offer more gold packages. The big budget teams would again have an advantage. League has to somehow look at these rules and how it impacts all 20 teams.
Do agree that all 3 leagues need to operate under the same set of rules.

To help out the small market teams, set the standard gold packages at a certain number, but a "have team" can go over the limit must also give the OHL 1x or 2x the value of the gold pack which then can be distributed to a "have not". This is similar to the NBA and their "Luxury Tax" in which a team can go over the salary cap.
How you define the "have-nots" is another discussion!

Having more kids with gold packages is overall good for the players, league and the image of the league. Let
alone making it easier to get players signed.

 

[member 71782]

A lot of good ideas and I think the kids and their education should be an important part of how teams are allowed to operate - but like everything else the league has to look at how changes impact different markets. Teams with smaller budgets will not be in a position to offer more gold packages. The big budget teams would again have an advantage. League has to somehow look at these rules and how it impacts all 20 teams.
Do agree that all 3 leagues need to operate under the same set of rules.

Ine way to limit the costs of education packages is make each team responsible for the costs when they have the player on their respective teams.

If Windsor signs a player to a better education package then trades that player to Peterborough after 3 seasons Windsor should be on the hook for the costs of 3 seasons worth of the education package thus ensuring smaller market teams don't get stuck with the full cost of a package they didn't negotiate.

Eliminating the restrictions on gold level packages allows all teams equal footing when trying to bring in higher level talent. If a team has drafted well, has high end players that want to report but are stuck on an education package because they are at their limit with gold packages then they have to either move a player or not bring someone in.

I know it is a salary cap of sorts but if you want the best talent in the league as well as parity of some sort you have to remove some of the restrictions.

On the surface this seems to favour teams like London, Windsor etc but combined with teams paying for the education package for the time that player is with a certain team any team trying to acquire that player a couple of seasons later will get the high end player without the full costs of the education package.

As we've seen, education packages have come into play in deals in the past and teams have had to find ways to move players to acquire others due to the number of gold packages or increase picks to get a team to keep the package.

The league I believe manages the finances for the education packages so it would be a little bit of extra accounting but nothing major to track it.

One other thing to the 3 leagues playing by the same rules would be to consolidate all the different groups, rules, discipline etc under the CHL and each league have their own commissioner as they do now but someone else should be at the head of the CHL unlike today where Branch heads both the CHL and the OHL.

 

[rangersblues]

There are a number of ways to improve this league, OHL/CHL and I think the first thing is to put all 3 leagues under the same set of rules for everything from drafting age, trade rules, length of schedule etc.

Next would be their respective drafts.

With the OHL doing a supplemental draft this year for midget major aged kids I would like to see the main draft reduced to 10 rounds. This would increase the value of draft picks, forcing teams to improve their scouting and focus more on kids that will likely show up. Also having a 2 round supplemental draft for 17 year olds and older the main draft should become a 16 year old draft only.

The Import draft should be reduced to a single round, allow goaltenders again.

Draft picks from the main draft, including 1rsts and the import draft would be tradeable, the picks from the supplemental draft would not be tradeable.

Trading non reporting 1rst round players must include the acquiring teams own 1rst round pick the following year thus eliminating the need for compensatory picks from the league. This should also help level the playing field for where kids will report if they are declared non reporting as it limits their destinations on what teams are available to trade for them based on who has their own 1rst rounders available. Only non reporting 1rst rounders can be traded prior to the start of the season and the trades can be expanded to include other players/picks.

Rights to any other non reporting players cannot be traded until after the first season.

All first year players that have reported should be available for trade at the same time as first round players currently are. Give them equal treatment and opportunity for increased playing time as well as for teams acquiring younger players more chances to increase their youth if they are rebuilding.

Move the draft back until 2 weeks after the Memorial Cup, open up trades again 1 week prior to the draft and allow players to be traded including during the draft.

Place a 3 or 4 year limit on how far out draft picks can be traded. It is getting ridiculous when you see draft picks moved that are 10 years out. This will start forcing teams to make more hockey trades that benefit both teams.

Allow teams to carry 3 import players even though you are reducing the import draft to a single round.

Change the OA eligibility requirements from one year in the league to two years in the CHL to be eligible as an OA.

Increase the stipend given to players based on number of years played in the league.

Improve the standard education package and if possible allow for the ability for players to negotiate a better education package.

Eliminate the restrictions on the number of "gold" level education packages.

Some great ideas. The import goalie rule in particular. If the CHL wants to be the best developmental league in the world it has to have the best players at ALL positions. By banning import goalies it hasn't improved the quality of North American (in particular Canadian) goaltending. There is a systematic problem in that European's are better at developing goalies. This needs to be addressed.

 

[OMG67]

I would hope that thread wouldn't degenerate into that. You're right - it would be some interesting discussion.

Personally, I don't think it is an interesting discussion at all. The league already has rules in place to safeguard against most of what was pointed out.

There are automatic NTC's in contracts for high school players. Many of these players have invoked that clause over the last couple years.

Teams that trade draft picks well into the future participate in the new "cycle model" where the following year after going all in they then trade off other assets the following year to replenish their draft picks. We have seen Oshawa do this most recently. Their draft pick cupboard was bare after their run to the Memorial Cup a couple years ago and after two seasons of selling players at the deadline (while still being competitive), they now have more draft picks than three quarters of the league.

I think way too much has been made of this topic. The kids that decide to go the CHL route sign up for the way the CHL is run. There are no delusions. If the kids want to be more stable then play JrA and then graduate to NCAA or pony up their own cash and play CIS and not play high level competitive hockey.

I'm so tired of people whining about this topic and stating something NEEDS to be done about it. Nothing NEEDS to be done about it. Why is it that a handful of hockey fans feel it is their RIGHT to criticize how franchises choose to run their teams and do it by dangling "what's best for the players" as their means to making their point? IT is hogwash. If we really cared about the players the WHL wouldn't exist with their 10-14 game road trips, the leagues would play two games per week on weekends, there would be no out of conference games, no teams would exist unless there was a full service University in that town etc.... This topic is so garbage.

 

[tomschman]

There are a number of ways to improve this league, OHL/CHL and I think the first thing is to put all 3 leagues under the same set of rules for everything from drafting age, trade rules, length of schedule etc.

Next would be their respective drafts.

With the OHL doing a supplemental draft this year for midget major aged kids I would like to see the main draft reduced to 10 rounds. This would increase the value of draft picks, forcing teams to improve their scouting and focus more on kids that will likely show up. Also having a 2 round supplemental draft for 17 year olds and older the main draft should become a 16 year old draft only.

The Import draft should be reduced to a single round, allow goaltenders again.

Draft picks from the main draft, including 1rsts and the import draft would be tradeable, the picks from the supplemental draft would not be tradeable.

Trading non reporting 1rst round players must include the acquiring teams own 1rst round pick the following year thus eliminating the need for compensatory picks from the league. This should also help level the playing field for where kids will report if they are declared non reporting as it limits their destinations on what teams are available to trade for them based on who has their own 1rst rounders available. Only non reporting 1rst rounders can be traded prior to the start of the season and the trades can be expanded to include other players/picks.

Rights to any other non reporting players cannot be traded until after the first season.

All first year players that have reported should be available for trade at the same time as first round players currently are. Give them equal treatment and opportunity for increased playing time as well as for teams acquiring younger players more chances to increase their youth if they are rebuilding.

Move the draft back until 2 weeks after the Memorial Cup, open up trades again 1 week prior to the draft and allow players to be traded including during the draft.

Place a 3 or 4 year limit on how far out draft picks can be traded. It is getting ridiculous when you see draft picks moved that are 10 years out. This will start forcing teams to make more hockey trades that benefit both teams.

Allow teams to carry 3 import players even though you are reducing the import draft to a single round.

Change the OA eligibility requirements from one year in the league to two years in the CHL to be eligible as an OA.

Increase the stipend given to players based on number of years played in the league.

Improve the standard education package and if possible allow for the ability for players to negotiate a better education package.

Eliminate the restrictions on the number of "gold" level education packages.

Great ideas and well thought out, but would take a great deal of time before it can be implemented. The 3 or 4 year limit could not be implemented until 22 or 23 since at least 1 2026 draft pick has been traded. The draft could not be shortened until a point where no round 11 - 15 choices have been traded.

I especially like having import goaltenders being allowed back in the league.

 

[member 71782]

Great ideas and well thought out, but would take a great deal of time before it can be implemented. The 3 or 4 year limit could not be implemented until 22 or 23 since at least 1 2026 draft pick has been traded. The draft could not be shortened until a point where no round 11 - 15 choices have been traded.

I especially like having import goaltenders being allowed back in the league.

Agreed, it would take time to implement changes like this but I think in the end it would make the league more competitive, provide a better product which in turn improves the opportunities for the kids, better return for the ownership groups and a more stable and entertaining experience for the fans.

The cycles between rebuilding and going for it would be less extreme while the quality of players willing to report should increase as well as development opportunities should improve for the players.

As fans we all want to see an entertaining game when we go but when rosters are completely gutted you know you are looking at two to three seasons of lower quality games.

Ownership groups who can provide a more consistent product will see revenues, in some markets stabilize if they are in a better position to be competitive even during a rebuild.

Better revenues allow for better development opportunities as well as better compensation/education packages which makes the entire league more attractive to players.

Win - win - win for all involved IMO.

 

[Fastpace]

The league is introducing all these rules so to insure parity among it's teams, and then turn their back and allows rules for teams to build up for playoffs that takes away the very parity they were hoping to achieve in the first place.

 

[Medway Bear]

Teams that are going for it seem to trade all their high end draft picks for players then try to recoup all those draft picks the following season. Looks like shuffling the deckchairs on the Titanic to me. I believe a few years ago there was an option of having a "Player to be named later". Is that an option worth considering?

 

[RoyalCitySlicker]

Personally, I don't think it is an interesting discussion at all. The league already has rules in place to safeguard against most of what was pointed out.

There are automatic NTC's in contracts for high school players. Many of these players have invoked that clause over the last couple years.

Teams that trade draft picks well into the future participate in the new "cycle model" where the following year after going all in they then trade off other assets the following year to replenish their draft picks. We have seen Oshawa do this most recently. Their draft pick cupboard was bare after their run to the Memorial Cup a couple years ago and after two seasons of selling players at the deadline (while still being competitive), they now have more draft picks than three quarters of the league.

I think way too much has been made of this topic. The kids that decide to go the CHL route sign up for the way the CHL is run. There are no delusions. If the kids want to be more stable then play JrA and then graduate to NCAA or pony up their own cash and play CIS and not play high level competitive hockey.

I'm so tired of people whining about this topic and stating something NEEDS to be done about it. Nothing NEEDS to be done about it. Why is it that a handful of hockey fans feel it is their RIGHT to criticize how franchises choose to run their teams and do it by dangling "what's best for the players" as their means to making their point? IT is hogwash. If we really cared about the players the WHL wouldn't exist with their 10-14 game road trips, the leagues would play two games per week on weekends, there would be no out of conference games, no teams would exist unless there was a full service University in that town etc.... This topic is so garbage.

WOW. I agree with all of this, 100%. You said it much more eloquently that I ever would have, so kudos to you.

I can't wait until next year's trade deadline and all the same uninformed reporters/commentators post all their scorching hot takes like: " a 2025 pick, that kid is 8 years old...better get to a timbits game" or my favourtie "a 2025 pick, my 8 year old says he'll only report to London".

These stupid hot takes weren't funny a couple of years ago when people started using them, and they're not funny now. Know why, cause they'll all be recouped later! As pointed out above...its cyclical and the good managers will add and trade picks as the situation presents itself. It's not like teams are going to head into the draft with one pick down the road. I mean c'mon....many of these people are paid to have opinions...let's try to put a little critical thought into them, ok?

/soapbox

 

[NV]

The one thing that I've seen suggested on Twitter, that makes a lot of sense IMO, is moving the trade deadline to coincide with the end of the first semester for high school kids to limit the educational disruption.

I suppose having the way it is now works out well for the University aged players but a lot of those players tend to be... less than full time.