OHL hazing

[rangersblues]

What happened to Daniel Carcillo. This is shocking. And Branch did nothing .

Ex-NHLer Carcillo recalls alleged OHL beating with sawed-off goalie stick

Click to read more...

 

[Otto]

What happened to Daniel Carcillo. This is shocking. And Branch did nothing .

Ex-NHLer Carcillo recalls alleged OHL beating with sawed-off goalie stick

Ummm...

Branch was not available for comment on Monday, but a spokesperson from the league said that Branch brought the issue to the attention of Sarnia's ownership and management groups and began initiating harsh fines and penalties for teams that were caught hazing players.
"As acknowledged by Daniel Carcillo in several of his online posts, the OHL did react to the concerns he raised during his rookie season," the OHL said in an official statement issued to The Canadian Press.

 

[rangersblues]

Ummm...

Branch was not available for comment on Monday, but a spokesperson from the league said that Branch brought the issue to the attention of Sarnia's ownership and management groups and began initiating harsh fines and penalties for teams that were caught hazing players.
"As acknowledged by Daniel Carcillo in several of his online posts, the OHL did react to the concerns he raised during his rookie season," the OHL said in an official statement issued to The Canadian Press.

That is not consistent with the Sarnia coach Jeff Perry's comment. Someone is covering their a$$.

"Certainly it's something that, at the time, we were unaware of. It's nothing that the Sarnia Sting or the management group or the coaching staff would support or condone if those allegations were true," said Perry. "Hard to make a formal comment, other than, obviously it's affected Dan, who I think is a great young man, gone on to have a terrific career."

 

[Otto]

That is not consistent with the Sarnia coach Jeff Perry's comment. Someone is covering their a$$.

"Certainly it's something that, at the time, we were unaware of. It's nothing that the Sarnia Sting or the management group or the coaching staff would support or condone if those allegations were true," said Perry. "Hard to make a formal comment, other than, obviously it's affected Dan, who I think is a great young man, gone on to have a terrific career."

Considering Carcillo himself acknowledged that the OHL reacted to his concerns I would say that if someone is covering their ass, it's Perry. Judging by the comments in the Sting forum about him and his abrupt exit from the Sting it's not surprising

 

[Ferda11]

Wouldn't surprise me at all if Perry sat back and did nothing about it.

 

[Tarantula]

Wouldn't surprise me at all if Perry sat back and did nothing about it.

They had to know what was going on in the bus at the very least.......

 

[BigHitter67]

The hazing that has historically taken place in jr hockey dressing rooms would unfortunately make the stuff coming out of St Ms look like childs play. Good news ...it’s mostley been cleaned up in recent years . Hazing is more or less good natured now.. load buses etc

 

[GBFP]

He also described a "shower train" where rookies were forced to sit on the floor in the shower as veterans urinated or spit chewing tobacco on or near them, sometimes throwing shaving cream at them as well.
​

I think the peeing on and spitting on is the issue. "Sometimes throwing shaving cream at them as well" seems like it's really burying the lede unless "shaving cream" is a code word for semen or something.

I never understood this culture. Never will. But then I never played team sports, let alone at any highly competitive level.

All teams did it, no organization is innocent. Perpetrators were likely victims themselves. I can't believe Branch is still around though - he was around during all of this and didn't do enough fast enough. Heads should have rolled and ownership should have got the death penalty. Police should have been called upon first complaint.

 

[OHLTG]

I get the concept of initiation, in mild, non-physical forms, as lots of places do it. When you're getting into the stuff they're describing in junior hockey, though, it's beyond acceptable. I wonder how many older players do this just because they had it done to them and they think they have to pass it on? (as opposed to actually wanting to do it)

 

[tony d]

Some of the stories out there about hazing are terrible. Glad to see they've been curbed over the past few yrs. . I enjoy good natured ribbing but not when a person is getting hurt.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

He also described a "shower train" where rookies were forced to sit on the floor in the shower as veterans urinated or spit chewing tobacco on or near them, sometimes throwing shaving cream at them as well.
​

I think the peeing on and spitting on is the issue. "Sometimes throwing shaving cream at them as well" seems like it's really burying the lede unless "shaving cream" is a code word for semen or something.

I never understood this culture. Never will. But then I never played team sports, let alone at any highly competitive level.

All teams did it, no organization is innocent. Perpetrators were likely victims themselves. I can't believe Branch is still around though - he was around during all of this and didn't do enough fast enough. Heads should have rolled and ownership should have got the death penalty. Police should have been called upon first complaint.

I agree with you on Branch but blame the board of governors who continue to support him. He works for the interests of the 20 teams if they like the job he's doing he won't be going anywhere.

 

[EvenSteven]

I agree with you on Branch but blame the board of governors who continue to support him. He works for the interests of the 20 teams if they like the job he's doing he won't be going anywhere.

Blame the board of governors for keeping Branch in the position he's in as a reward for covering up this sort of stuff and not exposing this black mark on the league.

Also blame Branch for not having the balls to expose this stuff publicly when he likely had a very good idea that it continued to go on after he first was made aware of the issue.

Anything to keep the job.

Let's see if Bob McCown has him on PrimeTime Sports to talk about the issue. Branch is quick to go on the show, and they are quick to have him on the show, so he can be celebrated, as he has been in the past, when it comes to heralding his strong stance against fighting, his heavy suspensions for various infractions, etc etc.

They should get him on the show and ask him the tough questions for a change. Like have him explain the obvious piss poor job he did following up the 2003 issue in Sarnia. Ask him if he thinks any of the hazing over the years in the OHL is any different than what's gone on recently at St Mikes.

 

[BigHitter67]

The coaches are the ones who should be under the magnifying glass in all this. They had choice to either 1.turn a blind eye or 2. ensure it didn’t happen under their watch. Unfortunately my rookie season coach -as did many- took the former approach which of course resulted in inmates running the asylum. The stuff he ignored...!!?? ...in hindsight are mind boggling but 30 yrs ago degrading hazing rituals were generally accepted as the price of playing major junior hockey in Canada . That said, I also played for a (legendary) jr coach who ran a tight ship and would have none of that crap. He unfortunately seems to have been an anomaly for the time period.

 

[Otto]

Blame the board of governors for keeping Branch in the position he's in as a reward for covering up this sort of stuff and not exposing this black mark on the league.

Also blame Branch for not having the balls to expose this stuff publicly when he likely had a very good idea that it continued to go on after he first was made aware of the issue.

Anything to keep the job.

Let's see if Bob McCown has him on PrimeTime Sports to talk about the issue. Branch is quick to go on the show, and they are quick to have him on the show, so he can be celebrated, as he has been in the past, when it comes to heralding his strong stance against fighting, his heavy suspensions for various infractions, etc etc.

They should get him on the show and ask him the tough questions for a change. Like have him explain the obvious piss poor job he did following up the 2003 issue in Sarnia. Ask him if he thinks any of the hazing over the years in the OHL is any different than what's gone on recently at St Mikes.

Why would Branch, or the head of any company for that matter go running to the media regarding an internal matter?

 

[EvenSteven]

Why would Branch, or the head of any company for that matter go running to the media regarding an internal matter?

Good point.

 

[rangersblues]

Ummm...

Branch was not available for comment on Monday, but a spokesperson from the league said that Branch brought the issue to the attention of Sarnia's ownership and management groups and began initiating harsh fines and penalties for teams that were caught hazing players.
"As acknowledged by Daniel Carcillo in several of his online posts, the OHL did react to the concerns he raised during his rookie season," the OHL said in an official statement issued to The Canadian Press.

Ummmm what is Branch apologizing for. Branch went to Sarnia and investigated and was told nothing serious had happened. Unacceptable!

Branch obviously didn't do a very good investigation. His biggest interest was not letting it get out. I do have to give him credit for putting policy in place that seems to have helped. But even he admits he failed those players. Worse thing is those players are obviously scarred by the issue. For the life of me, I can not believe outside investigation was not called in. I still believe one should be done now.

'We had failed Dan and the other players': OHL commissioner calls abuse allegations 'sickening'

 

[Otto]

Ummmm what is Branch apologizing for. Branch went to Sarnia and investigated and was told nothing serious had happened. Unacceptable!

Branch obviously didn't do a very good investigation. His biggest interest was not letting it get out. I do have to give him credit for putting policy in place that seems to have helped. But even he admits he failed those players. Worse thing is those players are obviously scarred by the issue. For the life of me, I can not believe outside investigation was not called in. I still believe one should be done now.

'We had failed Dan and the other players': OHL commissioner calls abuse allegations 'sickening'

What's unacceptable? The fact that he investigated or the fact that he was told nothing serious had happened?
I made the comment previously, why would Branch, in his role of Commissioner want the story to get out? Again, you would find in most cases in business that internal issues would not be released to the public, unless criminal charges were laid. In this case the players elected to not press charges.

The unanswered question is, did the hazing stop in Sarnia once Branch spoke with management? We know it didn't stop league wide because we had the fiasco in Windsor. But the result was that changes were made. Like it or not, Branch played a huge role in that, thanks to Carcillo for bringing it forward.

This is reassuring:
Others in the hockey community seem to echo Branch's sentiments that hazing is a by-product of an old hockey culture that no longer exists.
"I think there needs to be an understanding that things have changed greatly," says Eric Wellwood, the coach of the OHL's Flint Firebirds.
"Through my experience in the OHL, from the time I was a 16-year-old back in 2006 until being now a head coach in the league, they've eliminated all these bad, bad things that surround the league — in particular, hazing. And in the end, I think that the OHL deserve credit and not to be smeared with a story that may be true but that happened a long time ago."

 

[rangersblues]

What's unacceptable? The fact that he investigated or the fact that he was told nothing serious had happened?
I made the comment previously, why would Branch, in his role of Commissioner want the story to get out? Again, you would find in most cases in business that internal issues would not be released to the public, unless criminal charges were laid. In this case the players elected to not press charges.

The unanswered question is, did the hazing stop in Sarnia once Branch spoke with management? We know it didn't stop league wide because we had the fiasco in Windsor. But the result was that changes were made. Like it or not, Branch played a huge role in that, thanks to Carcillo for bringing it forward.

This is reassuring:
Others in the hockey community seem to echo Branch's sentiments that hazing is a by-product of an old hockey culture that no longer exists.
"I think there needs to be an understanding that things have changed greatly," says Eric Wellwood, the coach of the OHL's Flint Firebirds.
"Through my experience in the OHL, from the time I was a 16-year-old back in 2006 until being now a head coach in the league, they've eliminated all these bad, bad things that surround the league — in particular, hazing. And in the end, I think that the OHL deserve credit and not to be smeared with a story that may be true but that happened a long time ago."

Police to murder suspect - "Did you see anything ".

Murder suspect - "Nothing happened here. "

Police - "Ok. Sorry for bothering you. Have a good day. "

You're right. I see your point now.

 

[Otto]

Police to murder suspect - "Did you see anything ".

Murder suspect - "Nothing happened here. "

Police - "Ok. Sorry for bothering you. Have a good day. "

You're right. I see your point now.

Except Branch isn't the police.... really all he would have got into was a he said, he said situation...

Now.. if the players had decided to press charges then it would have been a different story.
I get it, you want to blame someone, and Branch is the fun one to go after... but in this case he's not the bad guy... this lies solely on Sting management

 

[4 Bobby ORR]

Sanctions should have been placed on the Sarnia situation. I understand the whole initiation thing but this is over the edge. There is no way teens (anyone in fact) should be abused this way.
Branch just waited for the Windsor incident to act on it. If I recall correctly, rumblings were that Branch wanted Riolo out as the owner. Seems like Windsor is Branch's whipping boy.

 

[EvenSteven]

What's unacceptable? The fact that he investigated or the fact that he was told nothing serious had happened?
I made the comment previously, why would Branch, in his role of Commissioner want the story to get out? Again, you would find in most cases in business that internal issues would not be released to the public, unless criminal charges were laid. In this case the players elected to not press charges.

The unanswered question is, did the hazing stop in Sarnia once Branch spoke with management? We know it didn't stop league wide because we had the fiasco in Windsor. But the result was that changes were made. Like it or not, Branch played a huge role in that, thanks to Carcillo for bringing it forward.

This is reassuring:
Others in the hockey community seem to echo Branch's sentiments that hazing is a by-product of an old hockey culture that no longer exists.
"I think there needs to be an understanding that things have changed greatly," says Eric Wellwood, the coach of the OHL's Flint Firebirds.
"Through my experience in the OHL, from the time I was a 16-year-old back in 2006 until being now a head coach in the league, they've eliminated all these bad, bad things that surround the league — in particular, hazing. And in the end, I think that the OHL deserve credit and not to be smeared with a story that may be true but that happened a long time ago."

I thought that your unanswered question was answered. Didn't Carcillo say that it went on after his going to Branch on the issue?

 

[Otto]

I thought that your unanswered question was answered. Didn't Carcillo say that it went on after his going to Branch on the issue?

Did he? I didn't read that

This is the only thing I've read... please post if there is more
"As acknowledged by Daniel Carcillo in several of his online posts, the OHL did react to the concerns he raised during his rookie season," the OHL said in an official statement issued to The Canadian Press.

 

[EvenSteven]

I thought I heard Carcillo say in an interview I heard on the radio where he said he was hazed as a rookie. Then I heard him saying about how he is sitting in his stall a year later and watching other kids having to go through it too.

I may have heard it wrong though. Maybe it was Ryan Munce who said it.

 

[Otto]

I thought I heard Carcillo say in an interview I heard on the radio where he said he was hazed as a rookie. Then I heard him saying about how he is sitting in his stall a year later and watching other kids having to go through it too.

I may have heard it wrong though. Maybe it was Ryan Munce who said it.

Here's an interview with Munce
Ryan Munce describes 'constant abuse' from older players in his rookie year with Sarnia Sting | CBC Sports

 

[4 Bobby ORR]

'We had failed Dan and the other players': OHL commissioner calls abuse allegations 'sickening' | CBC Sports

Branch says Carcillo contacted him directly during that season about what was going on in Sarnia. He visited the team to investigate, but was told by management and the coaching staff that no serious incidents had occurred.

There is no excuse for Branch's lack of actions. An accusation is made- you investigate.....sweep, sweep.