Speculation: Offseason coaching thread: Should they stay or should they go?

[Malkinstheman]

It shouldnt but we all know that the last couple weeks has bought Sullivan time. Until atleast halfway through next season.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I'd rather have something tangible to actually watch games for. It was SOMETHING. Hanging your hat on the likes of this do-nothing ownership group and the nutless wonder GM who probably isn't even allowed to maybe possibly any-day-now fire the head coach after many, many years of the team punting on perfectly acceptable and downright necessary times to do so is a fool's errand.

They were never gonna do it. They made their mind up on that years ago. Besides this team is so soaked in it's own ego that signing an extension years in advance only to terminate it before it even kicked in would constitute admitting to a mistake. And that's not how we do things in Pittsburgh.

Let me dream, you old bastard. (Fairly certain we're similarly aged)

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Let me dream, you old bastard. (Fairly certain we're similarly aged)

I'm old af. I HOPE you have a few years on me for your sake,

I sneezed too hard (scream-sneeze -- you start doing it when you hit ~35 -- any old dude will confirm) a few days ago and I think I cracked a rib.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I'm old af. I HOPE you have a few years on me for your sake,

I sneezed too hard (scream-sneeze -- you start doing it when you hit ~35 -- any old dude will confirm) a few days ago and I think I cracked a rib.

Nobody loves to bag on Jeff Carter for being ancient quite like guys who are actually his age (like me)

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Nobody loves to bag on Jeff Carter for being ancient quite like guys who are actually his age (like me)

His super-upright, shuffling skating stride is one I'd know anywhere.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

His super-upright, shuffling skating stride is one I'd know anywhere.

f***in' slept wrong and my neck's gonna be jacked up for 3 weeks. smh

 

[DesertedPenguin]

It should be scorched earth but it will just be Reirden and possibly Velluccci both letting their contracts expire.

I’m sure the 4th set of assistant coaches surely will not make Sullivan look like an idiot.

I think they should clean house, but I love how the narrative keeps stretching to exaggerate the number of assistants Sullivan has had.

He's had one complete change of assistants.

Tocchet and Martin were his assistants when he came on, with Gonchar helping part time. Tocchet left for a head coaching job, at which point they promoted Gonchar full-time and added Recchi.

Gonchar, Recchi, and Martin stayed until they were all fired in 2020. It's been Reirden and Vellucci since, with Hennes being promoted from skills coach to assistant in 2022.

 

[molon labe]

I think they should clean house, but I love how the narrative keeps stretching to exaggerate the number of assistants Sullivan has had.

He's had one complete change of assistants.

Tocchet and Martin were his assistants when he came on, with Gonchar helping part time. Tocchet left for a head coaching job, at which point they promoted Gonchar full-time and added Recchi.

Gonchar, Recchi, and Martin stayed until they were all fired in 2020. It's been Reirden and Vellucci since, with Hennes being promoted from skills coach to assistant in 2022.

I mean - wasn't my comment but even in your own estimation that's 3 sets...so the comment about his 4th set would hold true.

It's the roster turnover and his own hand in that roster that gets me the most. The only thing close is his usage of the roster but I've never been high (or even warm) on ANY of his personnel choices.

 

[SomeDude]

I think they should clean house, but I love how the narrative keeps stretching to exaggerate the number of assistants Sullivan has had.

He's had one complete change of assistants.

Tocchet and Martin were his assistants when he came on, with Gonchar helping part time. Tocchet left for a head coaching job, at which point they promoted Gonchar full-time and added Recchi.

Gonchar, Recchi, and Martin stayed until they were all fired in 2020. It's been Reirden and Vellucci since, with Hennes being promoted from skills coach to assistant in 2022.

So if they get him new assistants next year, that would be his 4th set…just like I said.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'd buy the "they've tried replacing Sullivan's assistants multiple times" argument more if the Penguins assistants they were firing actually went on to be good elsewhere. But that hasn't happened at all, I know Recchi was let go and he was a miserable failure with his next team after the Penguins.

The problem is that this team sucks at finding good assistant coaches, so replacing Recchi with Rierden isn't going to make a difference.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

DP is me with the reflexive defensive mechanisms. But his is attuned to some lame-ass NHL coach who has long overstayed his welcome while mine is at least for a HOFer who is still productive at nearly 40.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

@Zirakzigil should have added a 5th option to the poll:

-Sullivan stays and Sidney the Kidney goes

Because that's what's happening if that f***ing idiot is back next season. I'm either going to take the year off watching hockey or I'll just boxscore watch to see Sid and Geno climb the all time rankings.

 

[TooManyHumans]

Other than money, why would they not fire Sullivan? People can argue that we could do worse, but that simply isn't true. You cannot do worse in the NHL than being the best team to not make the playoffs. That is the worst possible position in the NHL, where you either want to be competing for Cups or bottoming out. Limping along as the best non-playoff team gets you nowhere at all.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

So if they get him new assistants next year, that would be his 4th set…just like I said.

Changing one coach (Tocchet to Recchi) isn't a new set.

It's semantics, but it just always strikes me as odd.

DP is me with the reflexive defensive mechanisms. But his is attuned to some lame-ass NHL coach who has long overstayed his welcome while mine is at least for a HOFer who is still productive at nearly 40.

I've said they should clean house and bring in a fresh voice. All for that.

But I also think that Sullivan is this weird Boogeyman for some people, the cause of everything wrong with this team, when it's likely more complex than that and there are multiple people responsible.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Other than money, why would they not fire Sullivan? People can argue that we could do worse, but that simply isn't true. You cannot do worse in the NHL than being the best team to not make the playoffs. That is the worst possible position in the NHL, where you either want to be competing for Cups or bottoming out. Limping along as the best non-playoff team gets you nowhere at all.

Ownership is a fan of him apparently.

 

[orby]

Sully is safe, like it or not...but at minimum I think they'll can Rierden.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

DP is me with the reflexive defensive mechanisms. But his is attuned to some lame-ass NHL coach who has long overstayed his welcome while mine is at least for a HOFer who is still productive at nearly 40.

It's a coin toss whether you're gonna defend Geno's honor with some scathing sarcasm or you're gonna rip into him for being a mummified corpse on skates. Nobody loves and hates Geno quite like you do.

 

[Zirakzigil]

We should pry Gonchar away from the Canucks and let him coach the PP.

 

[SomeDude]

We should pry Gonchar away from the Canucks and let him coach the PP.

Doesn’t he work remotely from Dallas somehow?

 

[Zirakzigil]

Doesn’t he work remotely from Dallas somehow?

No idea. Just know hes the defensemen development coach for the Nucks.

 

[Extra Texture]

With an unbiased assessment, this should be a slam dunk. They should all be fired, and any poll should be unanimous. But we follow a team where ownership consider the coach as the franchise's most important asset. Now Dubas is probably #2, given how ownership fanboyed out for him last summer.

I shudder to think what would've happened if FSG were around for Dan Bylsma. After that documentary made him look like a "genius", those gullible assholes would've traded Geno and Letang before sacking that guy. We would've been Chiarelli-era Edmonton, trading future HoFers for "tough" spare parts.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Other than money, why would they not fire Sullivan? People can argue that we could do worse, but that simply isn't true. You cannot do worse in the NHL than being the best team to not make the playoffs. That is the worst possible position in the NHL, where you either want to be competing for Cups or bottoming out. Limping along as the best non-playoff team gets you nowhere at all.

Arrogance. With a hefty side of ignorance from the absentee fanboy ownership group.

I've said they should clean house and bring in a fresh voice. All for that.

But I also think that Sullivan is this weird Boogeyman for some people, the cause of everything wrong with this team, when it's likely more complex than that and there are multiple people responsible.

I'm mostly just giving you a hard time. But yes anyone who doesn't understand that even with as big a roadblock as the coach has made himself the last few years this is hardly some single-pronged issue, here is fooling themselves. But it would go a long way towards helping.

It's a coin toss whether you're gonna defend Geno's honor with some scathing sarcasm or you're gonna rip into him for being a mummified corpse on skates. Nobody loves and hates Geno quite like you do.

Lotta years of reverse-jinxing. But I mean... yeah. Malkin has been one of the most entertaining players I've ever watched. He also has moments where you are like "WTF was that dumb shit, bud?" Thankfully even in his dotage he's the kind of player that typically makes up for those moments usually in the same game.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The reason they won't fire Sullivan is that they're delusional about both him and the state of the team. They still view their contending window to be open and they think they need a "top tier coach" to do that.

If the Penguins were actually committed to rebuilding, I think that Sullivan would be far more likely to be fired. But as long as Crosby is here, I genuinely doubt Sullivan gets fired.

 

[Pancakes]

All the fsg people were at the game last night. Last year there were firings after they all showed up.

I think maybe some assistants get canned but I doubt Sully does.

 

[ThosePuckingPenguins]

All the fsg people were at the game last night. Last year there were firings after they all showed up.

I think maybe some assistants get canned but I doubt Sully does.

Think I read somewhere they have someone at every game. Though I guess there is some increased importance if it was more than one of them.