Nuge and Yakupov at the WJC's

[Lay Z Boy GM]

But raking up points against Germany and Slovakia doesn't mean nearly as much as winning an elimination game. Don't get me wrong, Nuge wasn't awful at any point in the tournament, and yes one guy can only do so much, but he just wasn't able to come up with anything when it mattered most. As the captain, most offensively gifted player (he is a playmaker, but he is also a goal scorer, especially at the Jr level), he is expected to lead the offense.



Subban wasn't even close to the biggest reason why they lost the game against the US. He didn't play well, pretty much like every other player on that roster. Strangely enough Canada's defense had an awful game and the whole team just couldn't get control of the puck.

Subban had two games that weren't bad in my opinion. He didn't even look good in the selection camp, pretty sure every other goalie there outplayed him. Spott picked favorites and foolishly stuck with them to the end.

 

[harpoon]

8/10 for RNH
6/10 for Yakupov

Yakupov might be the sort of player who looks like he isn't doing anything until you add up the points.

 

[Up the Irons]

RNH 9/10
Yak 6.5/10

what we learned: neither are captains. Yak clearly needs good players around him to be very effective. he has the talent and will definitely get points with his Oiler teammates, but he is very much a kid and may have a problem with being 4th fiddle. no way he is better than Hall/Ebs/RNH now, and doubtfully ever.

 

[Insta]

Wow you guys are ridiculous. Guy puts up 15 points in 6 games, +6 rating, had 3 4 point games, is named top forward and his average here is like an 8. From an offensive standpoint, he basically carried the team.

 

[Free*]

Wow you guys are ridiculous. Guy puts up 15 points in 6 games, +6 rating, had 3 4 point games, is named top forward and his average here is like an 8. From an offensive standpoint, he basically carried the team.

Yeah definitely, there isn't much more you can ask from your captain other than win. That is a big one though. If Canada beat Russia everyone would be talking about what a dominant player he was throughout the tournament.

 

[Moonlapse Vertigo]

I agree that the criticism is harsh (his inclusion in the "Most Disappointing Player at the World Juniors" thread thanks to some posters is an absolute joke) and it obviously stems from his pointless game against the Americans. Presumably he was supposed to magically fix Murphy's giveaways and show his teammates how to hit the damn net.

 

[Lay Z Boy GM]

Wow you guys are ridiculous. Guy puts up 15 points in 6 games, +6 rating, had 3 4 point games, is named top forward and his average here is like an 8. From an offensive standpoint, he basically carried the team.

I gave him a 9. Only real knock is that he didn't lead the team to a medal. If we got gold I'd give Nuge a 10 for sure.

 

[Moonlapse Vertigo]

Nugent-Hopkins was involved in 15 of Canada’s 27 goals. Pretty damn telling.

 

[Hemsky4PM]

Strange comment, he isnt' that tall but he is built. He has a low center of gravity like Crosby with a ton of strength.

AS for nuge and yaks, well yaks for a 7/10. He looked good but didn't blow me away. Nuge was a stud though, I don't know what else you could ask. He had one of the best tournaments of any individual player ever IMO. 9/10 given he wasn't great against the Americans.

Kovalchuk is 6-2, 235
Ovechkin is 6-2, 233

Yakupov is 5-11, 190

I think it's a pretty fair comment. Crosby is a C and not a good comparable.

Pavel Bure is 5-10, 192 - he's frequently used as a comparable to Nail Yakupov, in terms of size and skill set. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Everyone saying that RNH has a major blemish because of the 2nd US game are quite frankly being unfair. He was working his ass off, one of a small handful of Canadians that you could say that about that game. The only part of his game that IMO was sub par were his faceoffs after his first couple of games. It is not RNH's fault that guys like Huberdeau, Hamilton, Murphy, etc. were crap much of the tournament.

 

[Lay Z Boy GM]

Everyone saying that RNH has a major blemish because of the 2nd US game are quite frankly being unfair. He was working his ass off, one of a small handful of Canadians that you could say that about that game. The only part of his game that IMO was sub par were his faceoffs after his first couple of games. It is not RNH's fault that guys like Huberdeau, Hamilton, Murphy, etc. were crap much of the tournament.

Didn't he hit the post several times that game too? Nuge could have had 20 points with a bit of luck.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Didn't he hit the post several times that game too? Nuge could have had 20 points with a bit of luck.

He had assists on only 2 point shots IIRC. Had Murphy or Hamilton gotten their shat together he'd have a lot more points.

 

[Krigaren*]

How do we rate their performances on their respective teams?

Nuge led his team and the tournament in scoring, and Yakupov stepped up and led Russia to a victory in their most important game on home ice, both being named player of the game for each team.

Almost a perfect outcome from am Oilers perspective. How did our other guys do as well? Musil and zharkov?

How can the bronze medal be the most important game? I would think the semi finals would be due to the fact that they could still go for gold.
And isnt that what winning is all about?

This is a time when +/- is a good stat. RNH at +6 wasn't responsible for a lot of goals against. If he had played more the outcome may have been different.

No are you joking? +- is not a good stat in the worlds, junior or senior.
You have players raking tons of points against teams like switzerland, latvia, germany, finland...
likd RNH who had 5points against germany, remove them and against semi discent competition he is +1.. remove the 2points against punchingbag slovakia (even thou canada didnt show up for this game either) he is suddenly -1 when facing good wjc competition..

It was really similar when MPS had tons of points in the wc a few years ago.. people thought he was the next jesus christ but what most failed to mention was 95% off his points came from group play against countries like switzerland.

Everyone saying that RNH has a major blemish because of the 2nd US game are quite frankly being unfair. He was working his ass off, one of a small handful of Canadians that you could say that about that game. The only part of his game that IMO was sub par were his faceoffs after his first couple of games. It is not RNH's fault that guys like Huberdeau, Hamilton, Murphy, etc. were crap much of the tournament.

I wouldnt blame RNH for the canadian fiasko. However he wasnt outstanding or anything like that. Sure one could tell he is a great player however it wasnt like the opposition trembled in fear whenever he got the puck...

Also i think everyone worked hard in that game, its just a mather off US coming out guns shooting like there was no tomorow. But RNH being an oiler i think one automaticly notices him a bit more as an oiler fan.

With that said, i give RNH a 6.5/10, how anyone can go beyond that is beyond me.
First time in tons of years that Canada do not get a medal, finishes the tournament loosing to archrivals America and Russia..
No, no way is he getting more than that even thou that might be a top score for any Canadian player.

Yaku gets 3 ****storms out of 10. Dude was poison for his team at times even thou showing glimpses of greatness is hardly enough against juniors. Id rather discuss the failings of yaku than how "dominant" RNH was.. as an oiler fan am alot more worried about that. But yea one tournament doesnt make a player, just expected him to be a bit further developed from what i saw.

 

[CupofOil]

I agree that the criticism is harsh (his inclusion in the "Most Disappointing Player at the World Juniors" thread thanks to some posters is an absolute joke) and it obviously stems from his pointless game against the Americans. Presumably he was supposed to magically fix Murphy's giveaways and show his teammates how to hit the damn net.

Are you ****ing serious? The posters that named RNH in that thread deserved to be banned, that's how trollish that is.
I really hope that the Oilers start winning sooner than later to shut these insufferable twits up.

 

[TheBusDriver]

Nuge 9 - Had an amazing tourney. Could've won gold had the team not fallen apart vs USA

Yak 7 - Had a hard time early on but still put up points. Got better as he went along. Finished very strong.

 

[Fourier]

No are you joking? +- is not a good stat in the worlds, junior or senior.
You have players raking tons of points against teams like switzerland, latvia, germany, finland...
likd RNH who had 5points against germany, remove them and against semi discent competition he is +1.. remove the 2points against punchingbag slovakia (even thou canada didnt show up for this game either) he is suddenly -1 when facing good wjc competition..

It was really similar when MPS had tons of points in the wc a few years ago.. people thought he was the next jesus christ but what most failed to mention was 95% off his points came from group play against countries like switzerland.

There were 4 games in this tournament that in essence really counted. The round robin games with the US and Russia, the semis, and the bronze medal game.

US round robin- Canada scores 2 goals with the first being a beauty by RNH. He generated a lot of chances and was not on the ice for any goals against.

Russia round robin- Drouin was named the player of the game but RNH was the star. He had a goal and two assits. Was on the ice for the 4th Canadian goal, was solid defensively and was physical. And again, he was not on the ice for the Russian goal.

US semis- He had three shots on goal. He hit two goal posts. Was absolutely robbed by Gibson after a great little move in close and set up his linemates several times. He was definitely off in period 1 but overall was still fairly dangerous. He was also not on the ice for any of the American goals.

Russia- Bronze medal game. He had a goal and 3 assists and was by far the best player on the ice. Again he was not on the ice for any goals against.

So while you can try and manipulate the +/- stuff the reality is that in these four games he had 3 goals and 8 points. Canada scored all of 12 goals in those 4 games.
So RNH was directly involved in 2/3 of them. And while they gave up 13 goals he was not on the ice for a single one of those goals.

I wouldnt blame RNH for the canadian fiasko. However he wasnt outstanding or anything like that. Sure one could tell he is a great player however it wasnt like the opposition trembled in fear whenever he got the puck...

He was absolutely outstanding. I've watched almost every Team Canada Junior game for well over the last decade and I'd say that he had one of the best tournaments I have seen from a Canadian. He was clearly the best forward in the tournament and it was not even close.

Of course the opposition was not trembling in fear. I have never seen anyone outside of possibly a 16 year old Gretzky, or possibly Forsberg, for whom that might be the case. Moreover, it is not RNH's style. His game is way too subtle for that.


Again, I am not really sure what more people wanted him to do. He carried himself wonderfully throughout the tournament. While I am sure he is disappointed with the result, he can be very proud of his effort.

 

[Suxnet]

Nuge: 9 - I would have given Nuge a 10 if he was consistently >=50% in faceoffs.
Yak: 7 - Wasn't very good but he was playing in a crappy system and still led RUS in points.

 

[DisgruntledGoat*]

reminds my of Joe Thornton in that way.
the same player during reg. season, that carries over into playoffs...everyone else amps it up a notch or 2, but he remains consistantly the same player. not bad in any respect...but leaves you wanting more in big games.
It's a good thing we have Hall, and Eberle though, so that responsibilty won't fall on the Nuges shoulders for Edmonton.

I recall Joe Sakic being a pretty low-key, quiet guy too. He did OK in big games.

Little early to be writing off RNH's leadership and clutch abilities. It was ONE game, and he was still clearly the best player on his team.

 

[booyakasha]

I recall Joe Sakic being a pretty low-key, quiet guy too. He did OK in big games.

Little early to be writing off RNH's leadership and clutch abilities. It was ONE game, and he was still clearly the best player on his team.

He was like that in junior as well.
And if you read my post, I acknowledged he was not only the best player on his team, but of the tournament.
why are Oilers fans so defensive when somebody mentions the slightestknock on a player?

and its hardly a knock at all...

 

[Spawn]

No are you joking? +- is not a good stat in the worlds, junior or senior.
You have players raking tons of points against teams like switzerland, latvia, germany, finland...
likd RNH who had 5points against germany, remove them and against semi discent competition he is +1.. remove the 2points against punchingbag slovakia (even thou canada didnt show up for this game either) he is suddenly -1 when facing good wjc competition...

He wasn't a minus player in any of the games he played in. Not sure how you are coming up with your -1 against good competition, but I imagine that you are factoring in PP points which don't count for +/-.

RNH was on ice for 1 goal against in the entire tournament. That was in the first game against Germany.

 

[DisgruntledGoat*]

He was like that in junior as well.
And if you read my post, I acknowledged he was not only the best player on his team, but of the tournament.
why are Oilers fans so defensive when somebody mentions the slightestknock on a player?

and its hardly a knock at all...

No one was being defensive until this post right here.

To say, 'yeah, he cant raise his game... Good thing we have Eberle and Hall' is, at best, a questionable comment. Especially given the limited sample size you're drawing such a broad, unsubstantiated conclusion from.

My post had less to do with 'defending' an Edmonton player than pointing out how faulty your logic is.

 

[Xelebes]

Nugent-Hopkins was involved in 15 of Canada’s 27 goals. Pretty damn telling.

Gretzky-Lemieux-Bure numbers, for sure. He had higher ratios than Gretzky (17 of 36 - 47.2% in 1978) and Lindros (17 of 40 - 42.5% in 1990.)

 

[McGoMcD]

Kovalchuk is 6-2, 235
Ovechkin is 6-2, 233

Yakupov is 5-11, 190

I think it's a pretty fair comment. Crosby is a C and not a good comparable.

Pavel Bure is 5-10, 192 - he's frequently used as a comparable to Nail Yakupov, in terms of size and skill set. Nothing wrong with that.

Sure, but you said he will never be as good as AO or Kovy, I know he isn't as big, but I am just saying he isnt' week. I am not comparing him to Crosby as a player, just saying he is strong on the puck like Crosby. Height and weight doesn't matter so much as strength. I see what your saying, but, just don't think it will hinder Yakupov that much.

 

[McGoMcD]

Gretzky-Lemieux-Bure numbers, for sure. He had higher ratios than Gretzky (17 of 36 - 47.2% in 1978) and Lindros (17 of 40 - 42.5% in 1990.)

Wow, that's pretty sick.

 

[Moonlapse Vertigo]

Gretzky-Lemieux-Bure numbers, for sure. He had higher ratios than Gretzky (17 of 36 - 47.2% in 1978) and Lindros (17 of 40 - 42.5% in 1990.)

Thanks for the numbers. RNH's production was downright dominant.