NHL European teams (could be coming)
- Thread starter LadyStanley
- Start date
End on a Hinote
Registered Abuser
I remember in 2008 people were saying the same thing would happen within 10 years. Not holding my breath.
cheswick
Non-registered User
mouser
Business of Hockey
It's inevitable the sun will eventually become a red giant and envelope the inner planets.
It's not inevitable the NHL will eventually have European teams.
It's not inevitable the NHL will eventually have European teams.
KHL has teams in Bratislava and Vladivostok, and it's 5k miles between them, almost as much, as between Bratislava and Vancouver.
I'd say SKA would be an interesting option. The team will get 20k+ arena soon, and any entrance fee is nothing for Gazprom...
Jumptheshark
Rebooting myself
the date that was suggested over here was 2030 at the earliest-the discussion I saw said part of the problem would be would it be expansion teams or existing teams--the feeling some have that it would be better for existing teams with a built in fan base to join the NHL as fan bases are more loyal to team then to leagues
the big question is would any Russian teams be included or would it be just Western European teams
there is a big difference financially between NHL and European teams and any European team would need an owner or owners with deep pockets.
And trades could become interesting
Say Vancouver trades player X to say either Stockholm or Helsinki--said player is married with kids and does not want to be that far away from his kids for 8 months of the year?
although it would be interesting to see east coast fans complain about travel for a change and start time of games
the big question is would any Russian teams be included or would it be just Western European teams
there is a big difference financially between NHL and European teams and any European team would need an owner or owners with deep pockets.
And trades could become interesting
Say Vancouver trades player X to say either Stockholm or Helsinki--said player is married with kids and does not want to be that far away from his kids for 8 months of the year?
although it would be interesting to see east coast fans complain about travel for a change and start time of games
CANADIENSFAN90
Registered User
Chris Maclean @chrmacl
Replying to @PierreVLeBrun @LeafsLunch1050
ridiculous idea, just awful. why not put a team on the moon next?
Given the NHL's penchant for hockey in desert environs Mars would be the more likely choice to "grow the game."
I could see European NHL teams only playing NHL teams in the east.
Replying to @PierreVLeBrun @LeafsLunch1050
ridiculous idea, just awful. why not put a team on the moon next?
Given the NHL's penchant for hockey in desert environs Mars would be the more likely choice to "grow the game."
I could see European NHL teams only playing NHL teams in the east.
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cbcwpg
Registered User
Maybe, and maybe only if they reduce the number of games on the schedule.
The Jets just played 2 games in Finland and to allow for "acclimation" to time differences etc. they were given a week off before and a week off after. Which now means they have a compressed schedule to get in their other 80 games. How is this going to work if teams are heading over to Europe 2, 3, or 4 times a season.
And how about the Europe teams? Are they going to come over to N.A. for an extended road trip where they play every team over a 2 month period?
The NHL...
The Jets just played 2 games in Finland and to allow for "acclimation" to time differences etc. they were given a week off before and a week off after. Which now means they have a compressed schedule to get in their other 80 games. How is this going to work if teams are heading over to Europe 2, 3, or 4 times a season.
And how about the Europe teams? Are they going to come over to N.A. for an extended road trip where they play every team over a 2 month period?
The NHL...
LadyStanley
Registered User
LeBrun expands this idea. (Paywall)
Are you forgetting polar flight routes? It might actually be faster to fly to Vancouver than Tampa.
cbcwpg
Registered User
Correct... simple google maps... as the crow flies it's :
Helsinki to Tampa : 13hours 40minutes
Helsinki to Vancouver : 13hours
Never going to happen. I have been hearing people say this about NA pro leagues for at least 20 years and it is no closer to happening today than it was then. Whether it is baseball teams in Japan, NBA teams around the World, NFL in Europe. It is not happening. Only place it might happen is the NFL going to Europe (London) simply because England does not already have their own pro football league.
The cultures are just too different. Just like a relegation/promotion system like they use in Europe would never fly here in the pro sports.
The cultures are just too different. Just like a relegation/promotion system like they use in Europe would never fly here in the pro sports.
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Using current fan bases, how many European teams could consistently fill up an 18-20K seat arena every night? When I saw Slavia Praha play in the 02 arena in 2009, it MIGHT have been 10% full for a game against Kladno. When I saw Sparta Praha play in 2013, it was in a tiny arena. Would fans of Kladno, Plzen, start supporting Sparta if they were in the NHL? Would they forego the team they grew up with to root for Sparta in the NHL? Same for teams in the large(est) cities in other countries.
Selling out 2 games as a novelty is much different than getting a team to sell out 41 games over the course of a season. Winter Classic sold out Citi Field last year. However, if the Rangers decided to play all of their games outdoors, it wouldn't last long.
No Fun Shogun
34-38-61-10-13-15
The only way that this could work would be if there was an entire third (and fourth) conference over there that was treated independently from a scheduling perspective until the final round of the playoffs where the European champs faced off against the North American champs. In other words, adding a freaking fifth round to the playoffs? That sounds like an awful idea.
Maybe in the very distant future when flying across the Atlantic in an hour or two is a conceivable possibility, I could see this work. But we're not remotely close to that as a possibility.
Maybe in the very distant future when flying across the Atlantic in an hour or two is a conceivable possibility, I could see this work. But we're not remotely close to that as a possibility.
I see it's time for the semi-annual "NHL expanding to Europe" thread.
I'm not going to say never, because never is a long time, but this is decades away from happening.
Since I'm lazy I'll just re-post what I said in another thread about the topic.
I'm not going to say never, because never is a long time, but this is decades away from happening.
Since I'm lazy I'll just re-post what I said in another thread about the topic.
edog37
Registered User
The KHL is a joke. The NHL could set up shop in Moscow & the KHL couldn't do anything about it.
cbcwpg
Registered User
Just wondering.... how likely is it that people in Europe would pay enough for their tickets to be able to cover an $80MM U.S. cap? And leave their teams profitable?
Just asking 'cause I have no idea what people in Europe will pay / would pay on average to watch professional hockey.
Just asking 'cause I have no idea what people in Europe will pay / would pay on average to watch professional hockey.
When I went to the games in the Czech Republic (Czech League, not the NHL), I think we paid equivalent of $20 one time and about $25 the other.
Hal1971
Registered User
Quebec City being often compared to an european city, perhaps it's our best hope to land a team 
Yukon Joe
Registered User
The oligarchs who control the KHL are all firmly in Putin's back pocket. Putin himself is something of a hockey fan.
There's no way the NHL can go into Russia without having Putin's, and with him the KHL's, blessing.
Barclay Donaldson
Registered User
So many issues with the NHL adding European teams. KHL tried it and very little of it stuck, with teams like Medvescak, Lev Praha, Lev Poprad, and Donbass all falling over and the attempts to get teams in Sweden, Germany, Paris, Italy, and London all failing. Part of it is the European mentality where fans and teams prefer domestic play, with continental competition reserved for Champions League type cups, along with promotion and relegation. So no owners would be interested, especially after seeing the KHL failure in every place except for Jokerit.
But let's ignore that and say you found people willing to throw away money in the idea. If you worry about Canes and Panthers attendance, the highest record by far is SC Bern in Switzerland, who have rebuked constant KHL offers to stay in the NLA. The next closest is SKA and Minsk who are a shade under 12,000 which would be good for second to last in the NHL. Once you get out of the top 10, it's AHL-level attendances. And generally, European teams have very cheap tickets in comparison to the NHL. So they're not going to be bringing in enough money to compete, even in a salary cap system.
But let's ignore that again and say that all didn't matter. There's no NBC type TV deal in place for any of these teams to bring in the big bucks, hence why most prefer to limit their expenses and stay in their competitive domestic leagues. Even in the KHL, arguably the best European league, it wasn't too long ago players were taping money to their gear because they couldn't leave it in the locker room in the potato sack it was given to them in. A lot of KHL teams still have serious Russian mob ties and are suspected fronts for money laundering since they are making money amidst abysmal attendance. Jet fuel is not cheap either, and even if they only come over once or twice, it would have to take a major upgrade in technology in order to convince any Euro team to join the NHL, regardless of whether the NHL wants to go there or not.
But let's ignore that and say you found people willing to throw away money in the idea. If you worry about Canes and Panthers attendance, the highest record by far is SC Bern in Switzerland, who have rebuked constant KHL offers to stay in the NLA. The next closest is SKA and Minsk who are a shade under 12,000 which would be good for second to last in the NHL. Once you get out of the top 10, it's AHL-level attendances. And generally, European teams have very cheap tickets in comparison to the NHL. So they're not going to be bringing in enough money to compete, even in a salary cap system.
But let's ignore that again and say that all didn't matter. There's no NBC type TV deal in place for any of these teams to bring in the big bucks, hence why most prefer to limit their expenses and stay in their competitive domestic leagues. Even in the KHL, arguably the best European league, it wasn't too long ago players were taping money to their gear because they couldn't leave it in the locker room in the potato sack it was given to them in. A lot of KHL teams still have serious Russian mob ties and are suspected fronts for money laundering since they are making money amidst abysmal attendance. Jet fuel is not cheap either, and even if they only come over once or twice, it would have to take a major upgrade in technology in order to convince any Euro team to join the NHL, regardless of whether the NHL wants to go there or not.
alko
Registered User
NoQuitInNewMexico
Registered User
I think the upside of bringing UK and German teams in is about the same as expansion to Houston, bringing the Thrashers back or even the current situation with the Coyotes, where you get used to dealing with problems to have a spot on the map you want, and everything else is a huge mess. Maybe Switzerland is doable too.
Prague would have a tough time with the economics of it, and the Scandinavian clubs are like 100 years old, used to playing against each other and not really that big individually. The KHL is still a national political project and even if I can see the soft power benefits of having world-famous Americans and Canadians in St. Petersburg on a huge stage talking about how great it is, SKA is owned by Gazprom.
ed: "same upside" is unfair, getting the sport to take off in Western Europe would be a gamechanger and a London team that's followed like a national team could get as "big" as the Leafs, Habs, Rangers, Bruins etc. There's also a real advantage to doing it quickly, at least in the UK, and beating the NFL to the punch, same way getting to Vegas ahead of the other American leagues should help that franchise long-term. But it's the same kind of calculation as nontraditional American markets, with a whoooole lot more risk
Prague would have a tough time with the economics of it, and the Scandinavian clubs are like 100 years old, used to playing against each other and not really that big individually. The KHL is still a national political project and even if I can see the soft power benefits of having world-famous Americans and Canadians in St. Petersburg on a huge stage talking about how great it is, SKA is owned by Gazprom.
ed: "same upside" is unfair, getting the sport to take off in Western Europe would be a gamechanger and a London team that's followed like a national team could get as "big" as the Leafs, Habs, Rangers, Bruins etc. There's also a real advantage to doing it quickly, at least in the UK, and beating the NFL to the punch, same way getting to Vegas ahead of the other American leagues should help that franchise long-term. But it's the same kind of calculation as nontraditional American markets, with a whoooole lot more risk
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