GDT: New Jersey Devils vs. Carolina Hurricanes 7:00 PM MSG+

[JimEIV]

Hopefully Jagr, Ryder, Zids can get shipped out.

Me too but I'm not convinced Jagr will allow himself to be traded or that Ryder as any value.

Crappy situation at best.

 

[njdevil26]

Me too but I'm not convinced Jagr will allow himself to be traded or that Ryder as any value.

Crappy situation at best.

It certainly is a crappy situation. I can't see why anyone would want Ryder at this point. Jagr certainly controls where he goes. I can't see him going to a team he does not hand select. Zids is the most tradeable.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

The team is not as far away as people think...this season was pretty much inevitable with a young defense and a slew of old decrepit forwards.

But this defense will be very good and we're watching them pay their dues right now. Next year Larsson is in year 5, Merrill and Gelinas year 3, Severson year 2...that seasoning will go a long way...

A good portion of today's forwards won't be here next year and while it looks bleak right now, 2 solid forwards added to Henrique, Zajac, Cammalleri would completely revamp the top 6...and as it stands right now their is a good possibility that we might be looking at an NHL ready draft pick in this years draft. You add a legit top line forward to the mix from the draft and the entire complexion of the forward group changes, it also affords lesser prospects to step in with better players, less pressure and more limited roles. All of a sudden your top 6 looks completely different... a high pick, Henrique, Cammalleri, Zajac and you have a group that you can supplement with a Boucher like player or and even an older player like Elias...that is not even adding anything... add a decent young forward + a high pick and you have a different team. That isn't far away or out of the realm of possibility.

Exactly. If Lou makes the right moves, this team can be solid next year. Playoffs? Way too early to tell. But definitely not as bad as some are expecting.

 

[Better Call Sal]

It certainly is a crappy situation. I can't see why anyone would want Ryder at this point. Jagr certainly controls where he goes. I can't see him going to a team he does not hand select. Zids is the most tradeable.

I can see someone betting on Ryder just being in a bad situation here and being capable of rebounding. He would be a perfect guy to trade at the deadline to a team desperate for a proven scorer.

Zids definitely has value as well, I agree.

 

[Cowbell232]

I'm not only referring to the people on this message board/other internet outlets. And I don't mean to suggest that those people could put them in the red.

But you're far more likely to get their attention by not buying tickets than you are by posting on the internet. This isn't a fanbase where people are lined up to take your place should you choose to stop attending games. You know that.

While this fanbase may not knock socks off at the box office/gates, it's "loyal" in the sense that people are content with continuing to pay for something they're not happy with. And I've been just as guilty in the past. I went to 18 games in 2010-11. As a freshman in college. If that's not dumb I don't know what is.

Possibly you could get their attention in this manner, I don't disagree on that point. But I think with the way they are courting corporate profiles they simply won't spend the time at a high enough level to "fix it" and will simply have discounted STs and other emotional triggers (bonuses, team events, free junk, etc) to retain the causal fan base. The new ownership is a business first and foremost, a marked shift from years past.

It's clear in pro sports that when a team stinks and provides little offense/entertainment/hope for their fans, that attendance and tv viewership declines.

3 goals in a 4 game home stand is not going to generate many repeat ticket buyers or motivate the casual fan to must see Devils hockey in person.

The Devils hockey product stinks right now.
The Devils hockey team is under hockey ops.

As I said, I still enjoy going to games, hanging with friends/family, food/drink, hope to see change and good fortune on the ice even with the odds stacked against that.

You made yourself clear that you do not enjoy attending games.
That's fine, it's not for everyone.

But, for fans who typically enjoy attending games the on ice product has put a damper on doing so lately, to casuals to even to some of the most diehards.

There is only so much DAE can do to enhance the fan experience with such a substandard on-ice hockey entertainment value for their consumers.

And I'm also not referring to fans on HFBoards or other social media.

I'm talking about our overall fanbase and to the people in and around NJ who attend games via groups or folks with disposable income looking for a night of entertainment.

How far can attendance fall? Is it enough to make anyone in the Devils mgmt side care about the on-ice product? Almost certainly not. Ticket sales are a drop in the bucket compared to what they are trying to do. And they don't care one iota about viewership - MSG does, the NJD get paid the same either way until the contract expires. And even then, MSG and the NJD don't care unless advertisers care, and they don't since MSG advertisers (I assume at least) gets lumped in NJD/NYK/NYR/NYI/BUF/etc...

-----

I'd even go so far as to speculate that the CBA provisions for revenue sharing make the ownership REALLY not care about ticket sales since they have to give so much of that back to the league after certain expenses... But if the Prudential Center is selling a lot of ad space or other corporate level stuff, it doesn't touch the rev. sharing. It's a giant loophole for NHL teams that share ownership with a building or vice versa.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I don't think they can be solid next year, I'm sorry...the way they've played this year has shown me nothing of the sort.

 

[Devils Dominion]

Hopefully Jagr, Ryder, Zids can get shipped out.

Yes, yes and yes.

I'll take anything for Ryder, even a 7th rounder.
Zids can get a 3rd rounder IMO.
I think Jagr can get us a 2nd rounder or a 3rd rounder and a prospect.

If Jags can catch fire in the next few months he may even land us a 1st rounder by a contending team out West.
(Of course he would have to approve it.)

All 3 can help a true contending team that already has a deep lineup.

 

[JimEIV]

I don't think they can be solid next year, I'm sorry...the way they've played this year has shown me nothing of the sort.

Why would you judge next years team by this year?

Next year Schneider will have a season as starter under his belt, Hopefully Kinkaid proves to be a viable backup, the young defense won't be as young and half the forwards most likely will gone.

Regardless of success, next years team will be significantly different

 

[Traitor Zach]

The team is not as far away as people think...this season was pretty much inevitable with a young defense and a slew of old decrepit forwards.

But this defense will be very good and we're watching them pay their dues right now. Next year Larsson is in year 5, Merrill and Gelinas year 3, Severson year 2...that seasoning will go a long way...

A good portion of today's forwards won't be here next year and while it looks bleak right now, 2 solid forwards added to Henrique, Zajac, Cammalleri would completely revamp the top 6...and as it stands right now their is a good possibility that we might be looking at an NHL ready draft pick in this years draft. You add a legit top line forward to the mix from the draft and the entire complexion of the forward group changes, it also affords lesser prospects to step in with better players, less pressure and more limited roles. All of a sudden your top 6 looks completely different... a high pick, Henrique, Cammalleri, Zajac and you have a group that you can supplement with a Boucher like player or and even an older player like Elias...that is not even adding anything... add a decent young forward + a high pick and you have a different team. That isn't far away or out of the realm of possibility.

I think there is the potential to be a better team next year, but I don't see us as a playoff contender next year even if things

Zajac is essentially a black hole offensively right now. Henrique is back to streakiness. I think the key is to find out how to lift all the boats in the water so to speak. How many pieces are needed. What kind of pieces. How much time is needed to overhaul a bit. I don't think Henrique or Zajac are down for the count at all obviously, but there is such a dearth of talent and depth up front, it's affecting guys who should obviously be better.

I'm not so sure we can depend on an 18-19 yr old to come in and be a game-changer.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Why would you judge next years team by this year?

Next year Schneider will have a season as starter under his belt, Hopefully Kinkaid proves to be a viable backup, the young defense won't be as young and half the forwards most likely will gone.

Regardless of success, next years team will be significantly different

whats going to change next year? even if in the best possible scenario, we get Connor McDavid or Jack Eichel.

I still don't think think we're going to be able to score goals. sure, some of the forwards will be gone, but who replaces them? the free agent class is VERY underwhelming. the only guys who we have that are even close to NHL ready are Boucher and Matteau and I highly doubt either will light the world on fire

 

[Cowbell232]

You also have to hope (and kinf of assume) that next year the injuries are not cause as much of an impact as they have this year in addition to the possible coaching and personnel changes.

 

[JimEIV]

whats going to change next year? even if in the best possible scenario, we get Connor McDavid or Jack Eichel.

I still don't think think we're going to be able to score goals. sure, some of the forwards will be gone, but who replaces them? the free agent class is VERY underwhelming.

Oh, I won't allow myself to think about McDavid or Eichel but I think you are underestimating the impact those two guys are going to have for whoever gets them next season.

A McDavid would change our team overnight, you're looking at a once in a decade player I believe.

 

[Traitor Zach]

If the Isles can add Leddy, Boychuk, Grabovski, Kulemin, Halak in one offseason, I would hope that Lou could put some effort into bringing in some forwards.

I mean realistically, aside from maybe, maybe a veteran Dman like Oduya, it's really only the forwards that need to be retooled/overhauled.

I also think the time has come for the 4th line to be cycled out. Time to bring in some new guys there.

 

[njdevil26]

I still think he has to trade a d-man.
I would be all for signing Oduya by the way. Can't go into next season with FIVE youngsters back there.

Greene-Severson
Oduya-Larsson
Merrill-Gelinas

 

[JimEIV]

I still think he has to trade a d-man.
I would be all for signing Oduya by the way. Can't go into next season with FIVE youngsters back there.

Greene-Severson
Oduya-Larsson
Merrill-Gelinas

Year 5 for Larsson
Year 3 for Merrill and Gelinas

The youngster moniker is dead after this season for those guys.

 

[Camille the Eel]

I'd even go so far as to speculate that the CBA provisions for revenue sharing make the ownership REALLY not care about ticket sales since they have to give so much of that back to the league after certain expenses... But if the Prudential Center is selling a lot of ad space or other corporate level stuff, it doesn't touch the rev. sharing. It's a giant loophole for NHL teams that share ownership with a building or vice versa.

Concessions at the Prudential Center are also a factor in profiting off the arena - I would speculate that at least - but I don't know if ownership rents the spaces to the vendors at a flat rate (and so attendance basically does not matter) or gets a % of sales (and in that case attendance does). Also - regarding your point on the "giant loophole" - the arena probably has its own books separate from the team, and how that figures book keeping wise (depreciation stuff like that) might allow for a lot of other little gamings of the profits.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Year 5 for Larsson
Year 3 for Merrill and Gelinas

The youngster moniker is dead after this season for those guys.

Larsson needs to be playing way more minutes than he is. This is bordering on unacceptable.

 

[JK3]

I just can't take a glass half full approach with this team when that glass is full of feces. I'd like to be optimistic but nothing indicates that anything will change, I won't get fooled again.

 

[Burner Account]

The players are one thing. But I probably won't even think about being optimistic until we have a new decision maker (coach, GM).

 

[njdevil26]

Year 5 for Larsson
Year 3 for Merrill and Gelinas

The youngster moniker is dead after this season for those guys.

Crazy to think it's year 5 for Larsson. I think Merrill is more "advanced" at this point. I think Larsson needs to be verbally "given" a spot in the lineup. Let him play regularly and see what happens.

You notice how over-used Ryder was last night. Coincidence that it comes right after he asks for more ice time in the media? DeBoer can't be so selective and he needs to give other players the opportunities like this. Maybe he was protecting Larsson because he was out for a while... but the ice time last night was comical.

 

[Cowbell232]

Concessions at the Prudential Center are also a factor in profiting off the arena - I would speculate that at least - but I don't know if ownership rents the spaces to the vendors at a flat rate (and so attendance basically does not matter) or gets a % of sales (and in that case attendance does). Also - regarding your point on the "giant loophole" - the arena probably has its own books separate from the team, and how that figures book keeping wise (depreciation stuff like that) might allow for a lot of other little gamings of the profits.

The arena DEFINITELY has different books... I mean, that's kind of the understatement of the year right there... And it's not gaming, it's corporate culture. Of course you're going to do everything you can to maximize revenue and profit.

There's zero chance concessions are "flat rate". In addition, corporate tickets spend more than casual fans. By a long shot. And also buy higher margin items too.

Attendance itself doesn't matter. It's the type of attendance.

 

[Burner Account]

Corporate is king.

Probably one of the biggest factors in the Isles' move to Brooklyn: Nassau has no suites. Missing out on tons of money. Brooklyn has suites, and has a lot more potential support in the area.

Those $40,000 center ice season tickets aren't for Joe Average. They're for Joe Fortune 500.

 

[Traitor Zach]

I just can't take a glass half full approach with this team when that glass is full of feces. I'd like to be optimistic but nothing indicates that anything will change, I won't get fooled again.

I'm smelling a possible change in avatars coming soon.........

 

[Gentleman of Verona]

The arena DEFINITELY has different books... I mean, that's kind of the understatement of the year right there... And it's not gaming, it's corporate culture. Of course you're going to do everything you can to maximize revenue and profit.

There's zero chance concessions are "flat rate". In addition, corporate tickets spend more than casual fans. By a long shot. And also buy higher margin items too.

Attendance itself doesn't matter. It's the type of attendance.

Very interesting posts here about attendance, etc. It just deepens my concern that ownership truly doesn't care about the team's results, and the cascading effects down through the organization that come with this sort of "leadership".

 

[Traitor Zach]

The players are one thing. But I probably won't even think about being optimistic until we have a new decision maker (coach, GM).

The fact that this is probably a turnaround that needs a few years is a huge reason to try and identify a new GM to do it.

Lou is not going to be around here that much longer and there's a strong supporting argument to be made that he and Conte need to step aside and let some fresh perspective/approaches come into play.