Nathan Mackinnon

[The Abusement Park]

Are you serious? Wow. Has he come back? I can't watch the game.

He's back on the ice. Took a slapper to the wrist/hand area, so hopefully it was just a stinger.

 

[Stealth JD]

He's just not an elite player. He'll be a solid NHL forward...but the 1st overall expectations of stardom aren't a given for every player. Like 2006, 2011 & 2012, it just wasn't a great year for picking first.

 

[Cassano]

Great player, but on the level of RNH level forward than Tavares/Hall/Stamkos level.

Not even on the same realm as Matthews, Eichel and McDavid. Avs tanked the wrong years.

 

[Jarey Curry]

What's going on with Nathan Mackinnon, and why does it seem like he's not taking his place among the very elite in the NHL?

Every year since his rookie playoff scoring frenzy he seems to have fallen short of expectations. This year he looked fantastic at the World Cup, but the production in Colorado once again looks subpar. Is he playing well and the numbers aren't a true reflection? Is it the Roy/Sakic dysfunction? Is he just overrated? What's the scoop?

I don't know whats going on but both mac and dutchy played superb with the same or higher caliber players and they became the strongest pieces in their respective lines. Colorado lacks certainty of their playing position and move both around, and also lack the players who'd have a clear chemistry andor talent to perform their "out of this world" plays

 

[Cousin Eddie]

He's making things happen shift after shift but just lacking a lot of confidence now. Same can be said for Rantanen. They're pushing the play forward and spending the entire game in the Ozone but the pucks just aren't going in.

He'll figure it out.

 

[Drij]

Because he sucks.

 

[Makar Goes Fast]

he's no monahan but we can really only blame his parents for that

 

[Sam Spade]

he's playing great


on hf advanced stats >>>>>> actual point production


1. advanced stats
2. age
3. production

He's paid to put up points. So no he is not "playing great".

If he was a fourth line grinder his advanced stats would be pertinent to this discussion.

Barkov was right there for the taking........

 

[Cousin Eddie]

He's paid to put up points. So no he is not "playing great".

If he was a fourth line grinder his advanced stats would be pertinent to this discussion.

Barkov was right there for the taking........

He actually is playing great.

And not that this discussion should have anything to do with who else was drafted that year but you're arguing production and then you bring up Barkov? MAckinnon has more points in less games than Barkov this year. He has far better career production than Barkov too.

 

[Sam Spade]

He actually is playing great.

And not that this discussion should have anything to do with who else was drafted that year but you're arguing production and then you bring up Barkov? MAckinnon has more points in less games than Barkov this year. He has far better career production than Barkov too.

Far better? Rookie season sure, the next two, not so much.

MacKinnon has never finished a season as a plus possession player, Barkov has twice and probably will again this season. Barkov is a much better all around player. We will see who ends up with better offensive numbers when their careers are over. My money is on Barkov

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Far better? Rookie season sure, the next two, not so much.

MacKinnon has never finished a season as a plus possession player, Barkov has twice and probably will again this season. Barkov is a much better all around player. We will see who ends up with better offensive numbers when their careers are over. My money is on Barkov

You might be right, but that's a future discussion. You just used production to say Mackinnon isn't playing good and then followed it up by saying they should have taken Barkov. I responded to that by showing you their production.

This season:
Mackinnon: 7pts in 12 games. That's 0.583PPG which gives a rate of 48 points per 82 games
Barkov: 6ts in 13 games. That's 0.462PPG which gives a rate of 38 points per 82 games.

Small sample size. Both horrible. But Mackinnon is more productive this year.

Career:
Mack: 160 points in 230 games. That's 0.696PPG which gives a rate of 57 points per 82 games
Barkov: 125 points in 204 games. That's 0.613PPG which gives a rate of 50 points per 82 games.

As I said, Mackinnon is more productive both this year and career.

 

[tony d]

I thought he was going to be a good 1 and that Roy was holding him back. Still early days yet but looks like Roy might not be MacKinnon's downfall.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I thought he was going to be a good 1 and that Roy was holding him back. Still early days yet but looks like Roy might not be MacKinnon's downfall.

If you weren't a fan of Roy you likely were a system/stats person. If you're a system/stats person you should be able to see that Nathan Mackinnon is a mutant in the way he's driving the play. Stats say he's going to break out. Stats aren't always correct, but if they are in this situation he's going to catch fire in a big way.

 

[Aceboogie]

RNH and Mackinnon have identical career PPGs with Mackinnon 4 years in. RNH actually had higher career ppg at same point in career. The 2 are only separated by 100 games. So I dont think Mackinnon is an RNH/Johnston level of 1st overall versus Hall/Stamkos/KaneTavares/Ekblad. 4 years in their careers the 4 forwards were ppg (or very near) players. Its very rare to see a forward make massive jumps in points in 4th season and after. So id say hell be around a 55-60 point forward. Which is still really good. Just not the PPG+ elite star people had him pegged as

 

[doubledown99]

I know Avs fans won't like this but I don't believe MacKinnon is a C. I think he's more effective at RW. I also think he needs a smart C to bring out the best in him and cover for him on the defensive side.

At the World Cup, Nuge and him were dynamite together. In Macks' rookie year (his best year) he had another smart C in Stastny.

If I was the Avs, I'd be targeting a C for Mack (Nuge would be perfect but as an Oiler fan no way I want to move Nuge). If they can get that piece I think they will maximize Mack's talents and achieve more team success. That's just my opinion and I don't watch the Avs every game so maybe I'm completely out to lunch.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I know Avs fans won't like this but I don't believe MacKinnon is a C. I think he's more effective at RW. I also think he needs a smart C to bring out the best in him and cover for him on the defensive side.

At the World Cup, Nuge and him were dynamite together. In Macks' rookie year (his best year) he had another smart C in Stastny.

If I was the Avs, I'd be targeting a C for Mack (Nuge would be perfect but as an Oiler fan no way I want to move Nuge). If they can get that piece I think they will maximize Mack's talents and achieve more team success. That's just my opinion and I don't watch the Avs every game so maybe I'm completely out to lunch.

This is exactly what many Avs fans think so you aren't upsetting us. Mack doesn't really NEED someone to cover for him defensively but the intelligence of a cerebral centre would definitely benefit him in all areas of the ice.

 

[doubledown99]

Kento, "Cerebral" is the perfect word and description for what I meant. I know the Avs have Duchene and him and Mack are effective when paired together. But IMO, a more Cerebral C (than Duchene) would be better fit for Mack and Avs.

 

[xxxx]

He's playing well. I think he will break out this season.

 

[umwoz]

I like how bring up advanced stats on HF incites riots but subjective terms like "Hockey Sense" are perfectly valid.

 

[Jonas1235]

Avs need to blow up everything. Trade anyone over 23, get new jerseys. E V E R Y T H I N G

 

[Rise from the Ashes]

He needs a player he can give-and-go with. I think this is why he works well with Duchene. Both skate very well and can make plays at a high speed. We see this with Crosby. He functions best with fast players. You see it between Scheifele and Ehlers/Wheeler. An opposite example would be the Sedins and how they use a slower, methodical approach. Likewise for Getzlaf and Perry. Find someone who can skate with Mackinnon.

 

[Five Alarm Fire]

As was said in the Barkov thread, a lot of players are struggling from that draft class.

I still think it's the deepest draft of the decade. I'm confident all of these guys will turn it around.

 

[bohlmeister]

This is exactly what many Avs fans think so you aren't upsetting us. Mack doesn't really NEED someone to cover for him defensively but the intelligence of a cerebral centre would definitely benefit him in all areas of the ice.

Landy ROR Mack

 

[Mubiki]

There's nothing wrong with him. He's a good player, he's just not elite.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

If you weren't a fan of Roy you likely were a system/stats person. If you're a system/stats person you should be able to see that Nathan Mackinnon is a mutant in the way he's driving the play. Stats say he's going to break out. Stats aren't always correct, but if they are in this situation he's going to catch fire in a big way.

Agreed with this.

Mackinnon is going to blow up imo, it's just a matter of when not if.