Mikko Koivu [Mod Warning Post #955]

[plock]

I would still expect my third line center to put up more than the 20 points Koivu's on pace for. So I don't see how that solves anything.

I seriously doubt Koivu nosedives all season.I'd expect him to put up 50+ points.It's not just about moving Koivu (his NMC makes it difficult to move him) but making a move that improves the team.

 

[Sarge58]

The bottom line is we can't score or win games lately and as a team everyone has sucked so no one should be immune from criticism including Mikko.

Just like everyone else on the team he hasn't exactly been lighting it up. I may be in the minority, but from what I've seen he's been one of few that's brought it every game. To say he should be moved to the third or fourth line is to me ridiculous. Also, I've seen the typical "trade Mikko" when things are not going so good, but for who? who's out there that's as good or better than he is and willing to take on his contract. I'd be totally against a trade where we move him for two or three lessor players.

I'm as frustrated as anyone, but lets not make poor decisions based on a four game losing streak that can easily be nipped in the bud with the return of Parise and Spurge. That and a win against Buffalo could be more than enough to kick start our own winning streak.

 

[rynryn]

Well it probably wouldn't be Koivu alone but Koivu + a prospect.At this point I think we have too many prospects trying to fill roles they are not yet ready for.Everybody wants to move Zucker,Nino and Haula up into the top 6 but the truth is when they have been in that position they have failed to produce,Coyle and Granlund have also not produced enough this season to justify top 6 status.And it would not be jettisoning the player(s) for nothing but getting a significant return a player with term on his contract who is better than Koivu.
Is there anyone out there who fits that description?

if a team is going to take Koivu and a young prospect for an upgrade to koivu it isn't likely going to be a significant upgrade OR it'll be a player on an expiring contract that isn't expected to be re-signed for one reason or the other. Not exactly a catch or worth giving up Koivu and what i would assume would be a good prospect given the low opinion here of koivu. you can't on one hand say we'd get a significant return while simultaneously saying Koivu isn't worth keeping on. none of our prospects would warrant enough interest to make taking on a multi year expensive contract for a downhill sliding player in exchange for a significantly better player.

I don't see how this is remotely possible if all the GMs in the league feel the same way about Koivu as those who want to get rid of him.

 

[plock]

if a team is going to take Koivu and a young prospect for an upgrade to koivu it isn't likely going to be a significant upgrade OR it'll be a player on an expiring contract that isn't expected to be re-signed for one reason or the other. Not exactly a catch or worth giving up Koivu and what i would assume would be a good prospect given the low opinion here of koivu. you can't on one hand say we'd get a significant return while simultaneously saying Koivu isn't worth keeping on. none of our prospects would warrant enough interest to make taking on a multi year expensive contract for a downhill sliding player in exchange for a significantly better player.

I don't see how this is remotely possible if all the GMs in the league feel the same way about Koivu as those who want to get rid of him.

The biggest obstacle in trading Koivu is his NMC he would basically dictate where he would be willing to go making it more difficult for Fletcher.Because of this I don't think it will happen.I do think there are teams that would be interested in Koivu and would benefit from his veteran experience,faceoff skills,solid 2 way play,high hockey iq and good passing playmaking ability.I think it's premature to declare this the beginning of the end of his career after 15 games so far.

 

[Gaps]

I think the discussions concerning trading Koivu have been way more due to payroll/cap concerns than performance-based. In the worst case scenario, yes, the Wild may have to (try to) unload an expensive veteran and I assume this is the context in which Koivu's name has been brought up. It's possible the cap increase from this season to 2015-16 will be nonexistent.

However, the fact still is that they gave him full power over whether he goes or not and where he goes. Therefore he would be hard to move even if they chose to do that. IMO Pominville is more likely to be traded than Koivu, he only holds a modified NTC and his contract is cheaper. Not that I'm in a hurry to get rid of either one.

 

[Jarick]

Trading Koivu right not is neither realistic nor prudent.

There's three kinds of teams that we could trade with:

1. A playoff contender. He'd make a great 2nd or 3rd line center behind an elite center. Washington would be a great fit for example. Backstrom would be your elite scorer and Koivu would be the elite defender.

But what do playoff contenders give up for big pieces? They aren't moving big pieces, because that takes away from the team and their momentum. They tend to give up picks and prospects.

Do we want picks and prospects right now? No. We have picks and prospects. We have young players. We need producers now. We aren't planning on making a run in 2-3 years. We're trying to make a run now.

2. A young up and coming team that needs vets. Like Edmonton or Colorado. They aren't going to move potentially elite young players like Yakupov or O'Reilly or whoever for a player on the wrong side of 30. Again, you're going to get marginal players, picks, or prospects.

3. A 1-for-1 trade with another team that is struggling. Maybe Joe Thornton from San Jose? Keith Yandle from Phoenix? I mean, I'd take Thornton over Koivu but I think the Wild would have to add significantly.

 

[plock]

Trading Koivu right not is neither realistic nor prudent.

There's three kinds of teams that we could trade with:

1. A playoff contender. He'd make a great 2nd or 3rd line center behind an elite center. Washington would be a great fit for example. Backstrom would be your elite scorer and Koivu would be the elite defender.

But what do playoff contenders give up for big pieces? They aren't moving big pieces, because that takes away from the team and their momentum. They tend to give up picks and prospects.

Do we want picks and prospects right now? No. We have picks and prospects. We have young players. We need producers now. We aren't planning on making a run in 2-3 years. We're trying to make a run now.

2. A young up and coming team that needs vets. Like Edmonton or Colorado. They aren't going to move potentially elite young players like Yakupov or O'Reilly or whoever for a player on the wrong side of 30. Again, you're going to get marginal players, picks, or prospects.

3. A 1-for-1 trade with another team that is struggling. Maybe Joe Thornton from San Jose? Keith Yandle from Phoenix? I mean, I'd take Thornton over Koivu but I think the Wild would have to add significantly.

Thornton and Koivu would both have to waive NMCs,I'm not saying it's impossible but...yeah probably nope.

 

[Generic User]

Trading Koivu right not is neither realistic nor prudent.

There's three kinds of teams that we could trade with:

1. A playoff contender. He'd make a great 2nd or 3rd line center behind an elite center. Washington would be a great fit for example. Backstrom would be your elite scorer and Koivu would be the elite defender.

But what do playoff contenders give up for big pieces? They aren't moving big pieces, because that takes away from the team and their momentum. They tend to give up picks and prospects.

Do we want picks and prospects right now? No. We have picks and prospects. We have young players. We need producers now. We aren't planning on making a run in 2-3 years. We're trying to make a run now.

2. A young up and coming team that needs vets. Like Edmonton or Colorado. They aren't going to move potentially elite young players like Yakupov or O'Reilly or whoever for a player on the wrong side of 30. Again, you're going to get marginal players, picks, or prospects.

3. A 1-for-1 trade with another team that is struggling. Maybe Joe Thornton from San Jose? Keith Yandle from Phoenix? I mean, I'd take Thornton over Koivu but I think the Wild would have to add significantly.

Would never happen. Koivu would never waive to go to a bad team and be right back to where the Wild were from 2008-2011.

Koivu stuck with this team through the low points and is pretty much the only one left from the last time we won the division in 2007/08 (besides Backstrom). Whether he's right or wrong, he's going to be under the impression that he helped the team get where it is today; it's "his". Right when the team is primed to make a deep playoff run, possibly go all the way, he's not even going to consider going back to where he was years ago - no matter how angry fans, coaches or management are with him.

Option 1 wouldn't happen, either. Doesn't make the team better now which are the only trades GMCF should be considering right now and the foreseeable future as far as the active roster goes.

Don't really see option 3 happening unless the stars align perfectly.. Still, I don't see any way Koivu waives under any circumstance.. Even to go to a team like the Blackhawks, Penguins, Kings, etc. This is his team.

Think we should just get used to the notion that Koivu is here to stay.

 

[thestonedkoala]

I simply don't understand the notion not to have a talk with Koivu about a possibility of a move but in the offseason. This team needs a shakeup...

 

[nickschultzfan]

There are bigger problems if a team is expecting it's two-way, workhorse center to be scoring the clutch goals. Koivu needs to produce offense badly, but so does everybody else on this team.

I blame Koivu more for his lack of knocking heads into place rather than his lack of goals.

 

[Jarick]

Yeah the second part of my point was that there are no alternatives at center.

Carter has 6 points in 13 games and 40.8% FO
Granlund has 5 points in 14 games and 44.3% FO
Brodziak has 2 points in 9 games and 50.0% FO
Haula has 1 point in 12 games and 42.7% FO

Nobody is playing well.

 

[ThatGuy22]

There are bigger problems if a team is expecting it's two-way, workhorse center to be scoring the clutch goals. Koivu needs to produce offense badly, but so does everybody else on this team.

I blame Koivu more for his lack of knocking heads into place rather than his lack of goals.

Whats almost comical, is that Koivu is finally doing what even Koivu fans like myself have complained about, and is shooting the puck. His shot rate is way up.

 

[countrygentleman]

There are bigger problems if a team is expecting it's two-way, workhorse center to be scoring the clutch goals. Koivu needs to produce offense badly, but so does everybody else on this team.

I blame Koivu more for his lack of knocking heads into place rather than his lack of goals.

Not clutch goals, we need any goals from him. And that is not an unreasonable request. He has two on the year and one assist. He is on pace for 11 goals and 6 assists. He needs to do something. This is not enough. Just help put the puck in the back of the net.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Yeah the second part of my point was that there are no alternatives at center.

Carter has 6 points in 13 games and 40.8% FO
Granlund has 5 points in 14 games and 44.3% FO
Brodziak has 2 points in 9 games and 50.0% FO
Haula has 1 point in 12 games and 42.7% FO

Nobody is playing well.

This is something that I've been saying for a while. Minnesota has one of the worst collection of centers in the NHL.

 

[behemolari]

Not clutch goals, we need any goals from him. And that is not an unreasonable request. He has two on the year and one assist. He is on pace for 11 goals and 6 assists. He needs to do something. This is not enough. Just help put the puck in the back of the net.

actually it is enough if this team makes into playoffs and does a good run, but that's a big if..

every cup-winning team seems to have a big two-way center who can shutdown opponent star players and those other guys who are acquired to score, i'm not worried about Koivu but those others

 

[behemolari]

This is something that I've been saying for a while. Minnesota has one of the worst collection of centers in the NHL.

our finnish centers have collected together 9 pts in 14 games, yeah that's a horrible fact