RRP, I don't know when your birthday is, but consider this an early birthday present: http://thehockeywriters.com/brooks-orpik-decline/.
At long last, someone in the hockey media went there.
At long last, someone in the hockey media went there.
Mike Colligan: The Quiet Decline of Brooks Orpik
- Thread starter KIRK
- Start date
Some highlights for the fans at home . . .
* All of the players listed in that section have their flaws, but the “assured†position of Orpik and Martin on the Board was hard to believe coming from a group of the best hockey minds USA has to offer.
That is…until you consider the makeup of that group.
* What the USA group failed to notice — or the Penguins brass refused to admit — is that Brooks Orpik isn’t what he used to be.
In fact, he hasn’t been for the past 12 months.
* The most glaring weakness for Orpik over the past year has been his backward skating ability — certainly an important skill for a defenseman. Not only have teams such as Toronto, Boston, and the New York Islanders attacked this with cross-ice breakout passes to streaking wingers on Orpik’s side of the ice, but Orpik himself seems to know that he doesn’t stand a chance against Phil Kessel streaking down the right wing towards him.
To compensate, he either 1) steps up too aggressively for a hit, only to allow an odd-man rush, or 2) backs all the way into the goalie, giving talented forwards room to make plays
* Orpik, 33, still ranks among the league leaders in hits, but this stat can be misleading for defensemen . . . A game with 60 hits doesn’t necessarily mean you played well. It means you finished your checks well as you chased the puck around the ice.
* In an ideal world, Shero would trade Orpik in the coming weeks and capture a significant return before losing him for nothing over the summer. But by all accounts Orpik is a leadership presence in the locker room and brings an element of physicality that is needed right now on a small Penguins team.
And this one could've been written by MTLPensFan . . .
* The bigger ice surface also lends itself to a more patient style of hockey. In the offensive zone, there’s room to beat a defenseman like Orpik if you can draw him away from the net and out into the vast perimeter.
Maybe Bylsma just parks Orpik in front of the net like he does with the Penguins? If so, good luck to Martin or the defensive partner who has to cover from corner to corner against a cycling line of Alex Ovechkin, Evgeni Malkin, and Pavel Datsyuk.
These Olympics have the potential to be the worst possible situation for Orpik.
* All of the players listed in that section have their flaws, but the “assured†position of Orpik and Martin on the Board was hard to believe coming from a group of the best hockey minds USA has to offer.
That is…until you consider the makeup of that group.
* What the USA group failed to notice — or the Penguins brass refused to admit — is that Brooks Orpik isn’t what he used to be.
In fact, he hasn’t been for the past 12 months.
* The most glaring weakness for Orpik over the past year has been his backward skating ability — certainly an important skill for a defenseman. Not only have teams such as Toronto, Boston, and the New York Islanders attacked this with cross-ice breakout passes to streaking wingers on Orpik’s side of the ice, but Orpik himself seems to know that he doesn’t stand a chance against Phil Kessel streaking down the right wing towards him.
To compensate, he either 1) steps up too aggressively for a hit, only to allow an odd-man rush, or 2) backs all the way into the goalie, giving talented forwards room to make plays
* Orpik, 33, still ranks among the league leaders in hits, but this stat can be misleading for defensemen . . . A game with 60 hits doesn’t necessarily mean you played well. It means you finished your checks well as you chased the puck around the ice.
* In an ideal world, Shero would trade Orpik in the coming weeks and capture a significant return before losing him for nothing over the summer. But by all accounts Orpik is a leadership presence in the locker room and brings an element of physicality that is needed right now on a small Penguins team.
And this one could've been written by MTLPensFan . . .
* The bigger ice surface also lends itself to a more patient style of hockey. In the offensive zone, there’s room to beat a defenseman like Orpik if you can draw him away from the net and out into the vast perimeter.
Maybe Bylsma just parks Orpik in front of the net like he does with the Penguins? If so, good luck to Martin or the defensive partner who has to cover from corner to corner against a cycling line of Alex Ovechkin, Evgeni Malkin, and Pavel Datsyuk.
These Olympics have the potential to be the worst possible situation for Orpik.
Screw the Olympics, he's hurting the Pens on a nightly basis. But good to know we aren't all crazy here, and an actual hockey writer saw what we saw...
wheelz87
LGP
Is good to see somebody out there sees what most of this boards sees. Sees.
Everytime I watch him play I just shake my head. I don't understand what in the world he could be thinking half the time he has the puck. He ALWAYS makes the wrong decision. He NEVER keeps the puck in the zone. His shot is an embarassment. He is supposedly some god in front of the net on the PK, but I regularly see him getting manhandled. His physicality is so overrated. You would think he's some bruiser who guys fear.. I don't think so. Every once in a while he goes out, throws a couple hits, and everybody is supposed to be happy? Well that doesn't cut it for me. He is my personal weak link on D. I seriously think we would lose NOTHING with him out and Bortuzzo in. Bortuzzo pinching on our GWG tonight anyone? Like hell that happens with Orpik on the ice.
Oh yea, we would lose that 4 million dollar contract for one that is nearly 4 times less.
Everytime I watch him play I just shake my head. I don't understand what in the world he could be thinking half the time he has the puck. He ALWAYS makes the wrong decision. He NEVER keeps the puck in the zone. His shot is an embarassment. He is supposedly some god in front of the net on the PK, but I regularly see him getting manhandled. His physicality is so overrated. You would think he's some bruiser who guys fear.. I don't think so. Every once in a while he goes out, throws a couple hits, and everybody is supposed to be happy? Well that doesn't cut it for me. He is my personal weak link on D. I seriously think we would lose NOTHING with him out and Bortuzzo in. Bortuzzo pinching on our GWG tonight anyone? Like hell that happens with Orpik on the ice.
Oh yea, we would lose that 4 million dollar contract for one that is nearly 4 times less.
We would GAIN now with Despres in and paired with Martin and him out.
I know Nisky has had a few off games, but one thing he and Maatta are is an asset to offensive zone possession, which is something this team, without any real skilled one on one guys save Sid and Geno and maybe JJ if he's totally on or hard core board guys, really could use. You saw it a lot tonight.
Then, you saw how Orpik was a one man cycle killer multiple times tonight. Take him out, pair Despres with Martin, you get a second pairing that can give you what the Maatta-Nisky pairing gives you. Plus, Despres actually might take someone out in front of the net BEFORE a whistle.
As for Colligan's article, good on him for having the stones to say the obvious. I wonder if guys like Madden will have the stones to interview him, because that articles pictures alone were worth a thousand words.
1. You suck, coach.
2. You're very likely not wrong, coach.
Tender Rip
Wears long pants
Really, TR, is that all you have to say? After all of the cringing, the cries for someone who writes for a living about Pens hockey finally to write about that truth, is that all the celebration you can muster?
No appropriate smilie like
or 
or 
?No clever YouTube like ?
Not even a 'I told you' for the bunnies?
Just a HURRAH and nothing more?
What's scary is that we all can see this decline but the coaches can't. We can only hope Ray Shero sees it too and that he lets Orpik walk in UFA but I wouldn't be surprised to see Shero re-sign him either.
I try to figure what Orpik does well these days. I dread the puck going back to the point to him because the puck dies on his stick constantly. That's always been a problem but these days he isn't even particularly good defensively or physically. He runs himself out of position to make small hits or just wonders out of position in general. He doesn't want to fight so maybe that's why he's careful about the hits. I love how Bortuzzo plays. He doesn't care. He'll drill your ass with a monster hit and drop the gloves and try to beat your ass if you have a problem with it.
I try to figure what Orpik does well these days. I dread the puck going back to the point to him because the puck dies on his stick constantly. That's always been a problem but these days he isn't even particularly good defensively or physically. He runs himself out of position to make small hits or just wonders out of position in general. He doesn't want to fight so maybe that's why he's careful about the hits. I love how Bortuzzo plays. He doesn't care. He'll drill your ass with a monster hit and drop the gloves and try to beat your ass if you have a problem with it.
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JimmyTwoTimes
Registered User
- Apr 13, 2010
- 19,958
- 5,281
You know, I put the thread up here, thinking, wow, what a great discussion this will be. But, now, I'm not so sure. Colligan just absolutely nails it, in a Dorothy pulling the curtain away to expose the wizard of oz for what he truly is kind of way. It's all there . . . the exposure of the significance of the hits, the exposure of his weaknesses, everything.
And, yeah, it's scary that the coaches see him as an asset. Shero too. Scarier still to think even that it's conceivable that they could resign him.
Well, when the Pens organization is deaf on the subject . . .
Another reason why I'm so torn up about us taking Pouliot over Trouba. I think Trouba's upside is that of Orpik's physicality/toughness/size with immeasurably better offensive ability.
Orpik's decline wouldn't even be a thing if we had Maatta and Trouba excelling in the lineup right now.
But, hindsight is 20/20 and all that.
Orpik's decline wouldn't even be a thing if we had Maatta and Trouba excelling in the lineup right now.
But, hindsight is 20/20 and all that.
Do you guys think Shero just really values that Orpik is a lifelong Pen to the detriment of the team? That is like the only reason I could see a re-sign.
Maybe putting him on Team USA is a way of thanking him for his service and he is getting traded right after
Maybe putting him on Team USA is a way of thanking him for his service and he is getting traded right after
Do you guys think Shero just really values that Orpik is a lifelong Pen to the detriment of the team? That is like the only reason I could see a re-sign.
Maybe putting him on Team USA is a way of thanking him for his service and he is getting traded right after
The former seems A LOT more likely of a scenario to me than the latter.
If I was a betting man, I'd put good money down on Orpik being re-signed to a retirement deal. I'd go so far as to say I'd be shocked if he wasn't.
How can the Pens brass possibly think that Orpik deserves another contract? It's about time Mario clears house, get rid of Shero and Bylsma and bring in some new members for the country club.
I had a hard time getting past the assistant captain thing.
The absolute lack of evidence and/or data, other than a fairly decent description of a defensive system where all the slower skaters of a pairing have similar responsibilities, didn't convince me that Orpik is declining (from his previous blinding speed?). So are Scuderi, Bortuzzo, and probably Despres declining? He always had positioning issues when chasing a big hit. I also don't think Orpik was ever particularly good with the puck on his stick; neither is or was Scuderi.
I have no doubt that Orpik is declining in play, but I didn't find this article all that convincing.
The absolute lack of evidence and/or data, other than a fairly decent description of a defensive system where all the slower skaters of a pairing have similar responsibilities, didn't convince me that Orpik is declining (from his previous blinding speed?). So are Scuderi, Bortuzzo, and probably Despres declining? He always had positioning issues when chasing a big hit. I also don't think Orpik was ever particularly good with the puck on his stick; neither is or was Scuderi.
I have no doubt that Orpik is declining in play, but I didn't find this article all that convincing.
Winger for Hire
Praise Beebo
Yea, I really don't see any team losing their mind and going to $6mil. I don't think any team is that desperate for someone like Orpik in his current state.
So you know he's declining but this article didn't convince you that he's declining?
You're right about him getting out of positioning when going for hits and being terribad with the puck on his stick. One big problem I see is that his physicality no longer makes up for his weaknesses. The big hits are fewer and the mistakes more frequent.
Greeneye
Registered User
Why can't Colligan be the Pens beat writer? He's infinitely better than Rossi or Yohe. He's one of the few Pittsburgh media people who aren't completely brainwashed. Awesome article.
I have to say, he looked especially ****-tastic last night. Pucks at his feet without him doing anything with them, waving at those he did try to play, not hitting anything. God I hope the team sees this and sends him packing while he still has some value.
