Management Thread VIII

[Jimbo57]

My biggest pet peeve is people saying that the canucks drafting is above average or top 10 or top 5 or bottom 5 or whatever when it's clear that they haven't spent any time assessing the other 30 teams.

You can't just eat one hamburger in your life and declare it a top 5 burger in the world. Makes no sense.

You mean kinda like how people keep bringing up guys like Vey and Gagner without realizing that most of the other 30+ teams have their own versions of similar acquisitions.

 

[4Twenty]

You mean kinda like how people keep bringing up guys like Vey and Gagner without realizing that most of the other 30+ teams have their own versions of similar acquisitions.

Do you have anything to provide to the discussion?

 

[Jimbo57]

Do you have anything to provide to the discussion?

I just did.

Its not my fault you cant connect the dots.

 

[4Twenty]

I just did.

Its not my fault you cant connect the dots.

Right, inventing things that aren't occurring and changing the subject. Classic tactic.

 

[Jimbo57]

Right, inventing things that aren't occurring and changing the subject. Classic tactic.

Let me slow this down for you since you seem to be having a problem

Melvin said the GM's track record cant be judged in a vacuum when it comes to drafting, his record should be relevant to other teams.
I just pointed out that the same can be said for the GMs player acquisitions.

If you cant understand that its not my fault.

And btw, you were lecturing people the other day on using the ignore feature. If this is too advanced for you, take your own advice.

 

[4Twenty]

I just perused the last 10 pages of this thread, didn't see Linden Vey mentioned once.

How that relates to vanwest ranking a team top 5 in drafting then running away when people ask for him to explain his ranking I'll never know.

 

[TruKnyte]

What I want to see from this management group now is how they are planning to manage their cap space and assets with their young, cheap talent (i.e. Pettersson and Hughes) needing new contracts in the near future. That will determine whether this team will actually continue to improve or find themselves in a similar situation as the Jets today.

 

[Hit the post]

What I want to see from this management group now is how they are planning to manage their cap space and assets with their young, cheap talent (i.e. Pettersson and Hughes) needing new contracts in the near future. That will determine whether this team will actually continue to improve or find themselves in a similar situation as the Jets today.

I actually think the three stooges would perform better with little cap room. Less of a chance of handing out another 6 million dollar man contract.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

What I want to see from this management group now is how they are planning to manage their cap space and assets with their young, cheap talent (i.e. Pettersson and Hughes) needing new contracts in the near future. That will determine whether this team will actually continue to improve or find themselves in a similar situation as the Jets today.

Benning sounds confident that with the expiring contracts it won't be a problem..but we shall see?...

I dont see them becoming like the Jets (the Winnipeg factor?)..although ,they could certainly fall into the 'top heavy' salary category where they can pay their stars leaving them little room to ice impact players throughout the whole lineup.

Its at this point you have to start graduating players from Utica.

 

[Diamonddog01]

Its at this point you have to start graduating players from Utica.

Yes, getting rid of dead weight and graduating players from Utica (or other leagues) will be key. Can players like Lind, Bailey, Juolevi or Rafferty be depth contributors next season or the season after that? Will players like Hoglander and Podkolzin be good enough to make the team in 2 years?

 

[Hit the post]

Yes, getting rid of dead weight and graduating players from Utica (or other leagues) will be key. Can players like Lind, Bailey, Juolevi or Rafferty be depth contributors next season or the season after that? Will players like Hoglander and Podkolzin be good enough to make the team in 2 years?

We've had dead weight like Jason Garrison (removed in a really deft move by Benning) but all that happens is that free'd up cap space is replaced by someone just as bad (or worse).

 

[WetcoastOrca]

We've had dead weight like Jason Garrison (removed in a really deft move by Benning) but all that happens is that free'd up cap space is replaced by someone just as bad (or worse).

Yes. And that’s been a problem. I actually think he’s done better with his recent moves now that he’s up against the cap. I’m not confident that more cap space will necessarily equate to building a better team.
It’s the same way he’s operated when getting draft picks back. He’s turned around and traded them for marginal players even though drafting is the one thing he’s decent at . I sometimes like to imagine where this team could be had we traded assets for draft picks back when a rebuild was obviously needed. But that is just too depressing.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

What I want to see from this management group now is how they are planning to manage their cap space and assets with their young, cheap talent (i.e. Pettersson and Hughes) needing new contracts in the near future. That will determine whether this team will actually continue to improve or find themselves in a similar situation as the Jets today.

We have plenty if not most of bad contracts expiring in 2 or 3 years.

Its very possible that the cap goes up, or we can even entertain signing Hughes and Ep40 to bridge deals.

The cap is an overblown problem

There will also always be bottom feeder teams that can be a cap dumping graveyard like Arizona used to be. Apparently Anaheim is the new Arizona now.


One thing that i'm not sure has been mentioned,

Ray Ferarro was on 1040 the other and he mentioned that Eriksson will be paid a massive bonus on July 1st. After that, he is only owed 5million in real money. He of course carriers 6mil cap hit for 2 more years.
However, Ferraro said that if the Canucks sent Eriksson to the AHL next year that there is nooooooo way that Eriksson will report and ride the AHL busses ( no flights in AHL) for a "mere" 5million bux. He says that Eriksson has made over 50 million in his career and is very much involved in the restaurant business in Europe as Eriksson owns a few.

This makes total sense to me.

I can see management playing hardball with Eriksson as clearly they didnt get what they paid for during the front end of his contract.

I can also see Eriksson just calling it a career and taking his family to back to Europe over moving them to Utica and riding the bus to Syracuse or Hershey etc.....especially not for 5 million

 

[kanuck87]

You mean kinda like how people keep bringing up guys like Vey and Gagner without realizing that most of the other 30+ teams have their own versions of similar acquisitions.

Benning bad moves isn’t isolated to just Vey and Gagner, nor are these close to being the worst ones in his tenure.

You’re disputing an argument that virtually no one is making. No one thinks he’s a subpar GM just because of those two moves.

 

[Diamonddog01]

We've had dead weight like Jason Garrison (removed in a really deft move by Benning) but all that happens is that free'd up cap space is replaced by someone just as bad (or worse).

This is true. Now we need to remove dead weight in order to free up cap space for good young players, I'm very curious to see how it plays out this summer.

 

[Jimbo57]

Benning bad moves isn’t isolated to just Vey and Gagner, nor are these close to being the worst ones in his tenure.

You’re disputing an argument that virtually no one is making. No one thinks he’s a subpar GM just because of those two moves.

i said guys like Vey and Gagner, using them as an example.

A poster said that Benning ranks quite high when it comes to drafting. The counter point was made that his record should be compared to what other teams have done, you just cant proclaim that he ranks high.

I think the same reasoning should work with his player acquisitions. Many posters in here seem to be comparing his player moves to what a perfect record would look like with the luxury of doing it in retrospect most of the time. Instead they should be comparing his record to those of other teams.

Most teams in the Canucks' trajectory go through over paying place holders and trading post first rounders for filler players.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

I wasnt around HF when Gillis traded 25th OA, Grabner and Bernier for Ballard but id imagine he got crucified for it if Benning is still being criticized for trading for trading away 2nd rnd picks, 3rd round picks, jared mccann , gustav forsling, etc.... Especially when Ballard was often a healthy scratch

 

[VancouverJagger]

We have plenty if not most of bad contracts expiring in 2 or 3 years.

Its very possible that the cap goes up, or we can even entertain signing Hughes and Ep40 to bridge deals.

The cap is an overblown problem

There will also always be bottom feeder teams that can be a cap dumping graveyard like Arizona used to be. Apparently Anaheim is the new Arizona now.


One thing that i'm not sure has been mentioned,

Ray Ferarro was on 1040 the other and he mentioned that Eriksson will be paid a massive bonus on July 1st. After that, he is only owed 5million in real money. He of course carriers 6mil cap hit for 2 more years.
However, Ferraro said that if the Canucks sent Eriksson to the AHL next year that there is nooooooo way that Eriksson will report and ride the AHL busses ( no flights in AHL) for a "mere" 5million bux. He says that Eriksson has made over 50 million in his career and is very much involved in the restaurant business in Europe as Eriksson owns a few.

This makes total sense to me.

I can see management playing hardball with Eriksson as clearly they didnt get what they paid for during the front end of his contract.

I can also see Eriksson just calling it a career and taking his family to back to Europe over moving them to Utica and riding the bus to Syracuse or Hershey etc.....especially not for 5 million

While your hypothesis makes sense when has our management played hardball with a player in this type of fashion? It doesn't appear to be in the DNA of our franchise to do something like that. We are kind of like Swedish players........generally extremely polite and low key not looking to rock the boat. I have a hard time thinking we will do this (even though it makes sense).

 

[FreeMcdavid]

While your hypothesis makes sense when has our management played hardball with a player in this type of fashion? It doesn't appear to be in the DNA of our franchise to do something like that. We are kind of like Swedish players........generally extremely polite and low key not looking to rock the boat. I have a hard time thinking we will do this (even though it makes sense).

We've shown that the owner has a deep pocket and has no problem having bad salaries in the AHL.

I also have a suspicion that a decline was something understood between management and Eriksson as to why the contract was heavily front loaded. Maybe its been in Eriksson's and Management's plan to not

I see this contract to the very end. I just think the decline happened way sooner than anyone expected for Erikksson. I think everyone forgets that Eriksson was coming off a 30 goal season when he signed here as a UFA.

 

[DL44]

I wasnt around HF when Gillis traded 25th OA, Grabner and Bernier for Ballard but id imagine he got crucified for it if Benning is still being criticized for trading for trading away 2nd rnd picks, 3rd round picks, jared mccann , gustav forsling, etc.... Especially when Ballard was often a healthy scratch

Eerily similar looking trades, with similar results... same trading partner as well.
Gudbranson for a 1st, McCann who Florida quickly gave up on.
Ballard for a 1st, Grabner who Florida quickly gave up on.

 

[vanuck]

The plot thickens

Because of course. We aren't allowed to have nice things, after all.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

I actually think the three stooges would perform better with little cap room. Less of a chance of handing out another 6 million dollar man contract.

Some intriguing Free Agents in 2022 when we have cleared some bad contracts! (Eriksson , Beagle , Sutter)

Seth Jones
Bergeron
Klingberg
Malkin
Forsberg
Hamphus Lindholm
Subban
Zibenejad
Gaudreau
Morgan Rielly
Coutourier
Giordano
Letang


Benning is going to shopping!

 

[FreeMcdavid]

Because of course. We aren't allowed to have nice things, after all.

Relax, its just media trying to drum up conversation because theres nothing else to talk about during the all star break week. Dont fall for it.

 

[FreeMcdavid]

Eerily similar looking trades, with similar results... same trading partner as well.
Gudbranson for a 1st, McCann who Florida quickly gave up on.
Ballard for a 1st, Grabner who Florida quickly gave up on.

There must have been some major blowback thought especially with that 25th overall pick Gillis traded away because Kuznetsov was drafted by the Caps with the 26th pick

 

[rypper]

There must have been some major blowback thought especially with that 25th overall pick Gillis traded away because Kuznetsov was drafted by the Caps with the 26th pick

Gillis was never going to draft Kuznetsov anyway so it's a moot point.