Speculation: Luongo Trade Discussions Thread II - All ‎

[67Cup]

http://canucksarmy.com/2013/1/18/gi...cks-have-asked-for-too-much-in-a-luongo-trade

Gillis is a clown. Have fun losing edler because nobody wants to give you anything for an overpaid player. It shows this guy is completely out of touch if he thinks the leafs have puppets in the media.

The interesting thing is that Gillis is accusing the Toronto media of what is frequently true of the Vancouver Media (and of Jason Botchford in particular, ironically) namely that they are easily manipulated by the home team.

That Gillis appears on the Canucks home station, 1040, to speak to the cheerleading Jason Botchford, to accuse Toronto media of being manipulated by the local team, is deserving of an irony alert of near Chernobyl proportions.

Note: I live in Vancouver.

Click to read more...

 

[BlueBaron]

http://canucksarmy.com/2013/1/18/gi...cks-have-asked-for-too-much-in-a-luongo-trade

Gillis is a clown. Have fun losing edler because nobody wants to give you anything for an overpaid player. It shows this guy is completely out of touch if he thinks the leafs have puppets in the media.

Wow. Seems like he is losing his cool .

 

[stanleyorbust]

Must be in a nice position to be in, having a recent Olympic gold medalist and Hart trophy finalist sitting around as an extra.

While Leafs goalies combined don't have 100 games NHL experience. This is what they call a bluff alright.

Not sure who is going to get the last laugh here though, because if Leafs stumble out of the gate the price for Luongo will go up even higher.

True statement, however...

If Loungo's price tag is so reasonable how come one of the other 28 teams in this league have not traded for him?

The problem is Gillis conveniently forgets the length of the contract he signed. If Loungo was signed to a non cap circumventing contract.. the trade return would be huge. But only so many teams:

a) need goal-tending help,
b) think they can compete in the next 3 to 5 years (ie trade for aging goaltender),
c) afford the cap hit AFTER Loungo hits. Ie take on a bad contract.

I think a good comparable is Heatley, except he was younger. Big contract, limited destinations. His return was a young 2nd liner with bad knees, serviceable player with bad Cap hit (Cheechoo) and a 2nd round pick.

Personally I don't want the Leafs to trade for him... but a fair return is someone like Mac, Connolly and a 2nd.

 

[Confucius]

I am, and I like how we're positioned in that regard, wink wink nudge nudge.

I was simply suggesting that Vancouver is not in a bad position having an asset of Luongo's value to be bargaining with.

I'm surprised how many people think Lungo and his contract have value. Luongo does, his contract more than negates it. Similar to how we took Lombardi's contract, Nashville gave us Franson. So it was worth Franson for Nashville to save on what they owed Lombardi. Is Gardiner worth a 2nd? Now what if I tell you Gardiner is making 12 million a year for the next 8 years. All of a sudden Gardiner is worth ZIP. to another team. It's like yeah and what else are you going to do for us to take that contract.

 

[Darylman]

Luongo has started notoriously slow for, what, 5 or 6 years now? Should be hilarious if he is relegated to backup duties and posts subpar stats out of the gate.

Whatever strengths Gillis might have as a GM, this is probably the worst thing he could have possibly done. He sounds like a petulant child and the odds of his gamble working are not as high as them not.

 

[Deebo]

Gillis signed this guy to an anchor of a contract and now he is whining that no one wants to give up significant value for him.

Yes, Mike, its the Toronto media's fault that you gave him that deal.

 

[Mess]

True statement, however...

If Loungo's price tag is so reasonable how come one of the other 28 teams in this league have not traded for him?

The problem is Gillis conveniently forgets the length of the contract he signed. If Loungo was signed to a non cap circumventing contract.. the trade return would be huge. But only so many teams:

a) need goal-tending help,
b) think they can compete in the next 3 to 5 years (ie trade for aging goaltender),
c) afford the cap hit AFTER Loungo hits. Ie take on a bad contract.

Personally I don't want the Leafs to trade for him... but a fair return is someone like Mac, Connolly and a 2nd.

Personally I don't want the Leafs to trade for him either and his contract not his play is a main reason behind that.

However I tend to agree with Gillis thinking here.. Personally in a shortened season and with where he Canucks are as Cup contenders, the thought of having Luongo as their own insurance policy isn't a bad thing. IMO

When asked to address the possibility that the team was looking for too much in return for Luongo, Gillis fired back. "Fair value is different for every team that you speak to because they have different players, they have different concerns and different contractual issues that play into what they have available that you might want," said Gillis.

"The notion that we were asking for too much was floated in the Toronto media by a team that was extremely interested in acquiring Roberto and were using every means possible to try and force us to do something that we didn't think was right. That's nothing new in this business and it's not the type of pressure that I'm going to succumb too."

When asked if a potential deal with Toronto is "dead" as some have reported, Gillis noted that things can change.
"I don't care, there's a lot of stuff that's going to happen in the first two weeks of this season," Gillis remarked.

"If you start giving all-star players away, you'll be at the bottom of this league in a real hurry. So we have two really good goalies, I don't know what's going to happen with other teams - players might not play well, there may be injuries that they have at that position which may change the landscape. But as it sits today, we need to get something in return that is going to help our team and we're not in the business of just helping other teams.

Full Story: http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=413886

So unless he gets assets that can help his team, as opposed to simply dumping a contract for other teams spare parts, I would also tend to think holding on to Luo is in their best interest.

 

[Fogelhund]

Gillis certainly sounds upset here.

So what, everybody else thinks he is asking too much? If he is comfortable with his asking price, why get upset?

But as posted above, there are 28 other teams in the league, and according to Gillis a number of them were interested in Luongo... yet none of these teams thought the asking price was something they could afford either. hmmmmm

An interesting note.... Luongo plays with Vancouver for the year, that tacks another $1.4 million in penalty they'll have to count on their cap, when he does retire, prorated by the number of years he retires early.

He can stamp his feet all he wants, but it looks like we are going with what we've got, no matter how they perform. It isn't as if there aren't UFA goalies sitting around without contract, if we get in a pinch. It seems Nonis has made up his mind, and I'm good with that. I do think that there will be issues in Vancouver this year due to the distractions.

 

[Fogelhund]

So unless he gets assets that can help his team, as opposed to simply dumping a contract for other teams spare parts, I would also tend to think holding on to Luo is in their best interest.

They are missing two thirds of their second line, for at least a quarter of this season... somehow we couldn't provide them any solutions there?

Though, all they need to do is get to the playoffs, and perhaps their current injuries will solve themselves.

 

[M A K A V E L I*]

You guys don't need Luongo. By the time you come even close to being a top tier team, Luongo will be close to retiring. Reimer and Scrivens can drive the 18 wheeler just fine.

 

[Mess]

He can stamp his feet all he wants, but it looks like we are going with what we've got, no matter how they perform. It isn't as if there aren't UFA goalies sitting around without contract, if we get in a pinch. It seems Nonis has made up his mind, and I'm good with that. I do think that there will be issues in Vancouver this year due to the distractions.

If Schneider gets hurt or struggles then Gillis is going to be getting the last laugh by having the best solution to address that right under his own nose and under contract, and keep his team in the Stanley Cup race.

"I'm comfortable with both these guys starting the season here and I'll be comfortable if we finish the season with them," stated Gillis. "If something happens and comes our way that allows us to improve, then we're going to do it. And it's all subject to Roberto wanting to go to that city. So, it is a little bit more complicated than people like to think but we feel very comfortable with where we sit today with our goalies."

Roberto did win 31 games for his team last season, while Reimer and Scrivens won 18 combined. Its Vancouver that is holding the best hand here having the player after all.

 

[Confucius]

Luongo will be 34 before this season is done. If Luongo was a UFA, how many teams would sign him to a 10 year 53 million dollar deal (If it were still within the rules) my thoughts are nobody and it wouldn't have cost them a single player since he was a U F A

 

[New Liskeard]

But as it sits today, we need to get something in return that is going to help our team and we're not in the business of just helping other teams.

Apparently this was quoted from Gillis, which is beyond contradictory. Glad to hear Vancouver is not in the market of helping other teams out. Neither are the Leafs. Why should the Leafs take 60 million dollars off the cannucks hands, with a NTC and an goalie who is getting older. And give assets up as well? Seems gillis has been in the sauce something feirce!

 

[M A K A V E L I*]

They are missing two thirds of their second line, for at least a quarter of this season... somehow we couldn't provide them any solutions there?

Though, all they need to do is get to the playoffs, and perhaps their current injuries will solve themselves.

Booth isn't exactly a scoring machine and Kesler is skating and probably close to returning soon. Anyways, the Canucks can win the NW with a 1 line team because of solid goaltending + defense.

 

[Morbo]

"I'm comfortable with both these guys starting the season here and I'll be comfortable if we finish the season with them," stated Gillis.

Okay, then I guess you're also comfortable dumping him for nothing or waiving him when the cap goes down. Because the offers ain't getting any better.

 

[Drmckool]

Okay, then I guess you're also comfortable dumping him for nothing or waiving him when the cap goes down. Because the offers ain't getting any better.

I'm quite excited to see what will happen when no one wants him and Vancouver gets into serious cap trouble. Maybe Gillis should try Tallon again.

 

[stanleyorbust]

Personally I don't want the Leafs to trade for him either and his contract not his play is a main reason behind that.

However I tend to agree with Gillis thinking here.. Personally in a shortened season and with where he Canucks are as Cup contenders, the thought of having Luongo as their own insurance policy isn't a bad thing. IMO



So unless he gets assets that can help his team, as opposed to simply dumping a contract for other teams spare parts, I would also tend to think holding on to Luo is in their best interest.

Best interest for this year and next maybe.. but I think Loungo's contract is a ticking time bomb. His trade value will keep declining to the point where they have to buy him out. Old Burkie was right about these contracts... he might have lost his job for being a loudmouth jacka** but he had a point.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

http://canucksarmy.com/2013/1/18/gi...cks-have-asked-for-too-much-in-a-luongo-trade

Gillis is a clown. Have fun losing edler because nobody wants to give you anything for an overpaid player. It shows this guy is completely out of touch if he thinks the leafs have puppets in the media.

Kudos to the writer for being objective. "I don't care". Sounds to me like Gillis' temperature is raising through the roof. He can keep both his goalies if thats what he wants but what happens if its his team that's ******** the bed, not potential trade suitors. Could very well be a possibility. That Canucks lineup looks really bad with all it's injuries. The D and goaltending are going to have to step it up big time because it doesn't look like they're going to score many goals (outside the Sedin Sisters).

 

[go_leafs_go02]

https://twitter.com/strombone1/status/292364142197760000

Can't wait!!! “@NHL: #Canucks fans, are you ready to see Cory Schneider as No. 1 in net? #hockeyisback”

 

[Confucius]

Okay, then I guess you're also comfortable dumping him for nothing or waiving him when the cap goes down. Because the offers ain't getting any better.

Exactly and how many 10's of millions would that cost them?

 

[Fogelhund]

Roberto did win 31 games for his team last season, while Reimer and Scrivens won 18 combined. Its Vancouver that is holding the best hand here having the player after all.

There is a lot that go wrong for Vancouver here.

If Schneider performs well, as hoped, and Luongo becomes a real backup, how long do you think he remains the good team player for? He already wants out. How long does his patience last? How is the team going to react if Schneider doesn't perform well? The guy is going to be constantly looking over his back. The media are always going to be asking about the situation.. this could go sideways in a hurry on them.

What happens if Markstrom plays well this year, and continues to become the player Florida wants? What happens if one of Reimer, Scrivens, or Rynnas plays well this year, and Toronto doesn't end up needing to make a trade, or trades for Bernier?

While there are some very good reasons for Vancouver to keep this tandem this season, they really NEED to get rid of one of these goalies by the start of the 2013/14 season. They have $8.9 million in cap space, to sign 11 players. There is going to come a point, where one of these two goalies is going to have to go. Vancouver has some time, but the closer it comes the start of next season, the lower their potential return gets... barring a career ending injury somewhere. If they still hold both of these goalies, come August 2013, they might almost have to give away one of them.

 

[Bomber0104]

After the great season Luongo just turned in, Gillis knows he doesn't have to do anything.

This is why he is asking for so much.

He can ask for less when Luongo actually shows some signs of statistically declining.

 

[ChuckWoods]

After what Nonis has done with this team, and seeing the direction Carlyle is going in, I don't want to see Loungo on this team unless it is a underpayment.

I was on the Loungo boat before, but Scrivens has played well in camp and Reimer is looking better day by day.

I'd like them to stick with this tandem for this short schedule and see what happens.

I can handle another losing year simply because its only 48 games.

Nonis can sort out this situation through the year and next off-season instead of making a pressing decision now because the season is set to start.

 

[Deebo]

There is no way mess would be taking the position he has if a Leaf GM not named Cliff had their team in this situation with a contract like Luongo's.

 

[ACC1224]

Ship has sailed on the Leaf interest, nothing more to discuss from the Leaf POV.