Leafs Management Thread: Shanahan says Maple Leafs in no rush for new GM

[Drew75]

Shanahan would have done his job. Hire good, smart people to run the Team. All he has to do now is sit back and watch the process.

I really don't think Shanny WANTS to just sit back and watch the process - he wants to drive it.

He's the defacto GM, but without the day-to-day stuff.

Previous Thread: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1898511

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[The Winter Soldier]

I really don't think Shanny WANTS to just sit back and watch the process - he wants to drive it.

He's the defacto GM, but without the day-to-day stuff.

Obviously he is doing what other President's are doing now. Burke is doing the same thing in Calgary. You hire good people to run the day to day operations. You trust them. And you do not interfere. You just sign off on things.

if you have Babcock, Futa, Burke and Hunter running things. You would be a fool to disagree with them.

 

[ULF_55]

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=768517

TORONTO -- It is traditional for teams to hire a general manager first and let him choose his coaching staff.

However, when a coaching candidate with the stature of Mike Babcock suddenly becomes available and expresses interest in coaching your team, you jump all over it.

That is what Toronto Maple Leafs president Brendan Shanahan did in hiring Babcock who coached the Detroit Red Wings the past 10 seasons.

Shanahan says Leafs in no rush to hire new GM

Now Shanahan, who will turn his attention to finding a new GM for the Maple Leafs, said he's in no hurry.

"Next will be meeting more with Mike and getting a plan," Shanahan said Thursday. "As much as Mike and I have talked, we have more to talk about. For me, I am still interested in pursuing a general manager if the general manager fits. For the immediate days, it's more about Mike getting to know our organization from top to bottom."

 

[Antropovsky]

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=768517

Seems to be pretty clear that he's waiting for someone... Gonna assume it's either brisbois in Tampa or gorton in nyc.

He keeps alluding to the right fit... The right guy, and they will be patient, but we haven't heard about them meeting with anyone.

I'm hoping the Rangers don't win the cup, because if they do, then I think it will be more likely that slather steps aside for gorton after this season.

Edit: I mean sather of course.

 

[Stephen]

Would anyone have a problem with Shanahan running the team as the actual GM? He's basically built everything around him like he was a GM, why set the table and not sit at it?

 

[Joey Hoser]

Well they're looking for something pretty specific in their search, which is a GM with NHL experience, who is also willing to be just a member of the decision making process, instead of running the whole thing.

Someone who wants to run the show just won't work with this group, and at the end of the day, they don't really NEED NHL experience in order to make things happen, so I wouldn't be surprised to see them wait for the right fit and carry on for awhile without a named-GM.

 

[Daisy Jane]

if the choices are BriseBois or Gorton, I really like the idea of BriseBois because of what he's done for Tampa in a v. short amount of time, and Norfolk is his jurisdiction and they look v. good as well.

if the choice is Futa OR BriseBois/Gorton. I think Futa would fit in better because of the CHL connection (happy thoughts here about potentially landing McCrimmon)that we already have and he would have had to work with everyone there already.

i think anyone above will be named after draft and we'll be having a Gorton 2006 situation that _____ doesn't take over until basically July 1st? this also includes Sean Burke.

Which leads me to believe that George McPhee is basically option last choice. to the point now, it would depend of McCrimmon got hired or not. ie: if McCrimmon gets hired, maybe Hunter takes over. (because McCrimmon is basically Hunter, and scouting is in good hands). if McCrimmon is not hired, then Hunter stays Director of __________ (I always forget his official title) and McPhee would be hired.

Only because, I don't think McPhee is Choice #1 because if he was, he'd be hired. Both Futa + He (McPhee) were told that Babcock was going to be hired, and both were okay with this, but McPhee could have been hired ages ago by now.

So I think it is making sure that all I's are dotted and T's are crossed:
Talk to BriseBois, Talk to Gorton, see where their heads are at.
Come back to Futa work something out, if LA slams down the door
See where McCrimmon's hiring/not hiring is at
make a decision.

as Hunter is obviously running the show right now regardless.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Would anyone have a problem with Shanahan running the team as the actual GM? He's basically built everything around him like he was a GM, why set the table and not sit at it?

(shrug) my guess is - he simply doesn't want to ? or he knows his strengths - like he gets exactly what he wants to do, but he's smart enough (and humble enough) to know he is not capable enough to do it. so he's getting people to make sure they can do what he has in mind. which i think is a v. good strength.

if he thinks he's capable and he can't get people in here, I wouldn't shed a tear. Though i know there would be some people freaking out. (but i figure he'd lean a lot on Hunter). but I think as Hunter wants the job and Shanahan doesn't, Shanahan would defer and promote Hunter full time.

 

[Bullseye]

if the choices are BriseBois or Gorton, Talk to BriseBois, Talk to Gorton, see where their heads are at.
Come back to Futa work something out, if LA slams down the door

Problem is that Detroit has set the precedent of a 3rd Rnd. draft choice as compensation for early negotiations with teams management staff.

 

[ULF_55]

Problem is that Detroit has set the precedent of a 3rd Rnd. draft choice as compensation for early negotiations with teams management staff.

Actually, it wasn't the Wings it was league who set the rules. BOG voted this in last year.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Problem is that Detroit has set the precedent of a 3rd Rnd. draft choice as compensation for early negotiations with teams management staff.

that is not a problem

it has been reported that Tampa/Rangers aren't allowing communications because they are playing
Futa + Shanahan have.

it's automatic when there is a deal.

so again. probably no decision to be made until Shanahan talks to those two. 1 after they get eliminated, 1 after they are eliminated/win the cup.


I bet you we won't know anything until the cup is awarded at least, unless something insane happens.

 

[DutchLeafsfan]

Problem is that Detroit has set the precedent of a 3rd Rnd. draft choice as compensation for early negotiations with teams management staff.

My understanding regarding the situation is that Detroit/Babcock was a special case. Normally, hiring of personnel for President/GM/Head Coach is bound by specific rules. (a 2nd during season, a 3rd after the season, with offseason starting after the team has been eliminated for a coach, and after the draft for an executive)

What the Wings essentially did was the same as trading an impending free agent to another team to give them the inside track on signing that player. Normally had he left Detroit after expiration of his contract, Babcock would not have cost any compensation. Based on conversations, the Wings concluded that there was a considerable likelihood he would leave; rather than trying to use the remaining time on his contract to convince him to stay, they allowed teams to talk to him during the window, provided they signed the compensation contract. (As well as a gesture of appreciation to Babcock) Because of the interest they knew Babcock would draw, they managed to receive compensation as if he were a coach under contract during the offseason. (This contract possibly also to prevent any wink-wink-nudge-nudge trickery resulting in him being signed after contract expiration)

If the Leafs are going after Futa, there's basically two options. Either the Kings could just refuse to let him go and let him talk to us (I reckon there's quite a lot of personnel which has either clauses or agreements with their teams that if they can make a promotion, the teams will not stand in their way. Aside from situations such as Gorton's, where it seems the team sees him as the heir apparent in the not too distant future.), or we sign him and send the prescribed compensation to the Kings. (another 3rd rounder)

 

[TheOtherSide]

Shanahan wants to be the GM, but it is better to have someone else as the GM so he can have a scapegoat to axe when things go downhill.

 

[Durkin67]

I really don't think Shanny WANTS to just sit back and watch the process - he wants to drive it.

He's the defacto GM, but without the day-to-day stuff.

Previous Thread: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1898511

I think he, along with Babcock, wants Hunter to grow into the role.

 

[rojac]

My understanding regarding the situation is that Detroit/Babcock was a special case. Normally, hiring of personnel for President/GM/Head Coach is bound by specific rules. (a 2nd during season, a 3rd after the season, with offseason starting after the team has been eliminated for a coach, and after the draft for an executive)

What the Wings essentially did was the same as trading an impending free agent to another team to give them the inside track on signing that player. Normally had he left Detroit after expiration of his contract, Babcock would not have cost any compensation. Based on conversations, the Wings concluded that there was a considerable likelihood he would leave; rather than trying to use the remaining time on his contract to convince him to stay, they allowed teams to talk to him during the window, provided they signed the compensation contract. (As well as a gesture of appreciation to Babcock) Because of the interest they knew Babcock would draw, they managed to receive compensation as if he were a coach under contract during the offseason. (This contract possibly also to prevent any wink-wink-nudge-nudge trickery resulting in him being signed after contract expiration)

If the Leafs are going after Futa, there's basically two options. Either the Kings could just refuse to let him go and let him talk to us (I reckon there's quite a lot of personnel which has either clauses or agreements with their teams that if they can make a promotion, the teams will not stand in their way. Aside from situations such as Gorton's, where it seems the team sees him as the heir apparent in the not too distant future.), or we sign him and send the prescribed compensation to the Kings. (another 3rd rounder)

The Leafs would still need LA's permission to talk to Futa. If they do and the Leafs sign him, the Leafs need to give them a 2nd if they sign him before the draft or a third if they do it after.

 

[Daisy Jane]

The Leafs would still need LA's permission to talk to Futa. If they do and the Leafs sign him, the Leafs need to give them a 2nd if they sign him before the draft or a third if they do it after.

rojac, i think they have permission. Dreger and others have been saying that Shanahan + Futa have been speaking in Prague etc. (and Futa was told that Shanahan was going to be hiring their coach before whomever, ie: Babcock or Boucher). and Futa (and McPhee) was told they were okay with that decision.

 

[theIceWookie]

Would anyone have a problem with Shanahan running the team as the actual GM? He's basically built everything around him like he was a GM, why set the table and not sit at it?

I just don't think it's going to happen. Shanny's talent is building a management team, not the moves that that team will make. I'd suspect he won't actually be involved in the building of the team, but rather he'll build the team that builds it, if that makes sense.

He showed working for the NHL that he can build a very effective management team.

 

[hockeywiz542]

According to Larry Brooks of the New York Post, NHL policy in which draft-pick compensation now can be attached to the hiring of coaches and front office personnel after they’ve been fired with term remaining on their contracts is a disgrace — immoral, or close to it, as labor relations go.

NHL teams can receive just two compensation draft picks over a seven-year period.

http://nypost.com/2015/05/23/babcock-brings-leafs-credibility/

For during a conference call last week with reporters, Dubas made it clear he perceives coaches within the Leafs’ organization as commodities to be traded upon for his team’s benefit.

“There’s an incentive system and a compensation system whereby if we are grooming our own coaches … from Orlando [ECHL] to the Marlies [AHL], all the way to the 29 other NHL clubs where we hope we’re developing coaches that other teams want to pay us draft picks to hire,” he said.

In other words, Dubas would have the Maple Leafs elect to use what has become an unconscionable compensation system for his team’s own advantage at the potential expense of an organizational employee presented with an opportunity with advancement … when he was granted his freedom for free.

Doesn’t get much more narrow-minded than that.

And the NHL policy in which draft-pick compensation now can be attached to the hiring of coaches and front office personnel after they’ve been fired with term remaining on their contracts is a disgrace — immoral, or close to it, as labor relations go.

Imagine firing someone then stopping them from going somewhere else unless the hiring party antes up. The rebuilding Oilers likely will be forced to surrender two draft picks — either a second- and a third-rounder, or two thirds — to hire fired Boston GM Peter Chiarelli and fired San Jose coach Todd McLellan. Two steps forward, two steps back.

Where is Jimmy Devallano now that we need him to announce that coaches and managers are just cattle on the owners’ plantations?

By the way, we’re told by a club executive that teams can receive just two compensation draft picks over a seven-year period, so Dubas probably shouldn’t lean too heavily on suppressing promotions as a foundation of the Leafs’ rebuild.

 

[LV*]

Just let Hunter be GM and bring him another assistant if he wants one, I don't wanna lose Mark Hunter to another NHL team, hes a keeper.

 

[Stats01]

Just let Hunter be GM and bring him another assistant if he wants one, I don't wanna lose Mark Hunter to another NHL team, hes a keeper.

Keep Hunter in the position he's in, and hire one of Futa/Gorton/Brisebois. Hunter doesn't need to be in a press box worrying about contracts etc. He's a brilliant brilliant scout, he finds players and like Babcock says we need to give Hunter as many picks as possible so he can find us as many players as possible.

 

[Stats01]

rojac, i think they have permission. Dreger and others have been saying that Shanahan + Futa have been speaking in Prague etc. (and Futa was told that Shanahan was going to be hiring their coach before whomever, ie: Babcock or Boucher). and Futa (and McPhee) was told they were okay with that decision.

My question is if Shanny and co. are interested why not push forward and get an offer in unless Futa isn't the first choice and they're waiting to talk to Gorton/Brisebois.

 

[Ovate]

Just let Hunter be GM and bring him another assistant if he wants one, I don't wanna lose Mark Hunter to another NHL team, hes a keeper.

Hunter just got hired, and he hasn't even been a GM yet. He might want to be one day, but it's not going to be a "Make me GM or I leave" situation for at least a few years.

 

[Menzinger]

I just don't think it's going to happen. Shanny's talent is building a management team, not the moves that that team will make. I'd suspect he won't actually be involved in the building of the team, but rather he'll build the team that builds it, if that makes sense.

He showed working for the NHL that he can build a very effective management team.

Agreed. Although I wouldn't have an issue with him as the GM I think he wants someone else to handle the day to day operational stuff while he focuses on the big picture

 

[kihei]

I think fans are all in a rush, but obviously Shanahan isn't. As far as I can tell he has not given the least signal that he is interested or even feels competent to handle the GM position, so I doubt seriously he is going to appoint himself at this late date. I'm sure he has somebody specific in mind, maybe several somebodies, and if those don't work out, I'm sure he has fallback positions on top of that. Sure it would be nice if we knew who the new GM was going to be, but there is something to be said for Shanahan being patient and getting as ideal a candidate as he can find. Everything will unfold in good time--he hasn't made a mistake yet.

 

[Daisy Jane]

My question is if Shanny and co. are interested why not push forward and get an offer in unless Futa isn't the first choice and they're waiting to talk to Gorton/Brisebois.

to me I think it is mostly Shanahan isn't the kind of person to leave stones just leaving there. (that's the feeling I am getting).. I think he would want the opportunity to talk to everyone see where their heads are at, get the lay of the land - make the SOS/Challenge "Make Toronto Better" and then make your decision out of the three.

Now - the benefit is: the Leafs are the only team that needs a general manager. I think if there was a bigger void, there might be more of a get the guy.

like I mentioned, I feel this is how it is going:

Choice Number 1: BriseBois
BriseBois is Pridham, Dubas and Hunter all combined, so having that would be great. (plus a lot of the the Tampa success right now is him in the younger ranks)

Choice Number 2: Futa.
because having connections with Hunter, Dubas (McCrimmon, please let's get him).

Gorton has a better pull than say McPhee for what he did for Boston in 108 days. (so yay!).

So if it were me it would be

BriseBois, Futa, Gorton, McPhee.

but he wants to talk to those two first to make sure they 100 percent do not want to leave.