Lars Eller
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optimus2861
Registered User
If we trade Eller and leave DD on the roster, Bergevin deserves the pitchfork treatment and Therrien should be hung in effigy.
I just don't get how 16 goals and 30 points pace from the 3rd line with 0 PP time is under performing. He's right in the ball park of where he should be as a 3rd line centre. I think expectations are pretty crazy if that is considered inadequate.
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Blind Gardien
nexus of the crisis
Depends on the purpose of the trade and the return, doesn't it? DD will return nothing. Eller might return something, maybe. I could imagine trade scenarios where moving Eller and keeping DD made sense. It isn't about them head to head by any stretch.
I think it's adequate in isolation. And for his paycheque this year and next. But he's jumping to $4.25M and $4.75M in Years 3 and 4 of his new deal, and I think that is indicative of the team projecting his impact to increase. They see potential, and we also see potential, because those 30 points are not usually distributed evenly over a season, he does seem to be a very inconsistent player, and not just in terms of production either. I think that kind of inconsistency really raises the ire of some hockey observers. When you see him string together a few games where he's controlling the play and cycling and chipping in points, it gets your hopes up. And it makes the next string of games where he's invisible and uninvolved more disappointing by contrast.
Anyway, I like Eller in general, but I have mostly lost any hope that he'll ever be better than he is now. What he is now is fine. But if a team came along who still wanted to bank on his upside after seeing one his strings of more impactful games, I could see trading him, for the right return.
hockeyfan2k11
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- Jun 11, 2011
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CHaracter79
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Top playoff performer the past two years for us.
No PP time, Very few O zone Starts... Multiple winger parading his sides...
.36 PPG
If he was getting lets say.. top power play minutes, playing with the best wingers and getting very few D zone starts.. and had lets say... 0.15 PPG more... and dissappeared in the playoffs.... would we be happier?
No PP time, Very few O zone Starts... Multiple winger parading his sides...
.36 PPG
If he was getting lets say.. top power play minutes, playing with the best wingers and getting very few D zone starts.. and had lets say... 0.15 PPG more... and dissappeared in the playoffs.... would we be happier?
Smokey Thompson
Registered User
It's not under performing. It should be viewed as adequate production from a 3rd line C who's main job is to allow the top 2 lines to play easier offensive minutes while keeping his line afloat. Therrien is responsible for time / line management so he knows damn well what Eller's role is. To call him out like that is pretty stupid, not that we should expect any better from him.
As for the OP, keep telling yourself that front office thinks our scorings woes are due to our 3rd line C. A more rational opinion would be that MB realizes having Weise and Desharnais in the top 6, two guys who have scored a combined 76 goals in 525 games, is likely detrimental to the teams goal production.
Meh, sure he hasn't scored much. And we all love it if he gree into a 2nd line center. But it's starting to look like he'll be a 3rd line. Other than that, the team hasn't been playing great except for a few. Yes, Eller needs to improve. But other players on the team need to be better, including coaching.
"On sera motive"
They say they'll be motivated for the game va rangers. Wellp, that guarantees a blowout loss.
"On sera motive"
They say they'll be motivated for the game va rangers. Wellp, that guarantees a blowout loss.
It just seems like whoever is in the 3rd line centre role, be it Eller or someone else, is doomed to fail. Like I said, his production is right around what you expect from a 3rd line centre. If you want more, you need to give him the opportunity for him to do so, like PP time, ozone starts and better linemates.
However, it seems like those opportunities are with held from him on the basis of his "inconsistent production" or him "not proving he deserves it". But the problem I have with this is that when he does prove he deserves it like his point run in late november and december, or like his recent POs, or the 2012-2013 season, he doesn't get it anyway. In a sense, Eller is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't, and it's starting to appear like Eller knows this given his comments about his PP use.
Hell, look in the POs, Eller was the best point getter and couldn't get more offensive opportunities.
As for moving him, we'd just need to replace him with someone else, who will probably also put up around 30 points in that role, and then we will all be disappointed at that player for not having a greater impact, at which point we'll say, I don't mind moving him for a better piece.
The way I see it, Eller is filling his role as 3rd line C more than adequately. There are other top 6 players that aren't. I don't see the need to move the player that is filling his role, while keeping those that aren't.
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A trade won't necessarily happen. Not just because it would be selling Eller low, but because Bergevin values size and Eller is definitely an asset in that sense. He might not be a top 6 player but he can be valuable, whereas Desharnais cannot effectively play a 3C or 4C role.
But let's stop always making it a debate between one and the other. After all, Desharnais has shown capable as a winger and Plekanec and Galchenyuk are also parts of this equation.
The thing with Eller, and it's an ongoing theme, is that there remains a gap between the player the team wants him to be and the player he wants to be. I'm not sure at all that the team plans another role for him than the one he's playing right now. All they're asking is for him to get the best out of himself. And there all a lot more ways to judge that than to look at goals and assists.
Lars, on the other hand, wants to be the go-to guy even if, at 25 yo he doesn't have the track record. The challenge here: accept and fulfill the player you are instead of dwelling on the player you wish you were. Until that happens, he'll have a hard time putting together all his great tools and will be vulnerable to inconsistency and confidence issues.
But let's stop always making it a debate between one and the other. After all, Desharnais has shown capable as a winger and Plekanec and Galchenyuk are also parts of this equation.
The thing with Eller, and it's an ongoing theme, is that there remains a gap between the player the team wants him to be and the player he wants to be. I'm not sure at all that the team plans another role for him than the one he's playing right now. All they're asking is for him to get the best out of himself. And there all a lot more ways to judge that than to look at goals and assists.
Lars, on the other hand, wants to be the go-to guy even if, at 25 yo he doesn't have the track record. The challenge here: accept and fulfill the player you are instead of dwelling on the player you wish you were. Until that happens, he'll have a hard time putting together all his great tools and will be vulnerable to inconsistency and confidence issues.
Eller has 14 ES points
DD has 17 ES points
Considering one has a defensive role and the other has a strictly offensive role, with better wingers, Eller is not the one that has a bad season.
Last 12 games, DD has 4 ES points, Eller has 4 ES points. THE HORROR!!
DD has 17 ES points
Considering one has a defensive role and the other has a strictly offensive role, with better wingers, Eller is not the one that has a bad season.
Last 12 games, DD has 4 ES points, Eller has 4 ES points. THE HORROR!!
Exactly. Also, didn't DD go on a 2 point in 10 game stretch a couple of days ago? Not only did the coach not say a peep about, but DD got promoted back to centre with Gallagher and Galchenyuk as his wingers.
It's ****ing absurd.
Bourque was also pretty good in last year's playoffs and look where he is now...
Paying Eller over 4 million for his current play seems steep.
Paying Eller over 4 million for his current play seems steep.
You're right MAG, he doesn't have the track record, but the thing is everytime Eller has shown that maybe he does deserve an opportunity or two to show that he can be that guy, he doesn't get it. He didn't get it in 2012-2013, he didn't get it in the POs, and he didn't get a sniff of better opportunities when he went on a nice scoring streak when Bourque was removed from him.
While it's true that Lars has to show the coaching staff that he deserves those opportunities, it's also true that the staff has to give them to him when he shows it. The simple truth is that they haven't.
I think it's more of a case of the coaching staff having their minds made up of what kind of player Eller is and nothing is going to change that short of an injury to DD, Plekanec and Galchenyuk all at once.
pepperMonkey
Registered User
Um...can someone translate? (even though I'm sure I would be annoyed at what MT said/did).
Eller cap hit is 3.5M$ not 4.
Look at what DD did last playoffs, look at what DD is doing this season. 3.5M$ for that guy is a bit steep.
While not playing on the PK and having minimal defensive responsibilities. Sign me up!
Not saying there isn't a little tension there and I'm sure Eller is hinting at wanting PP time, but I like how we all conveniently ignore that Eller himself is expecting more, not just the coach.
From Eller "I know I can be a very good, efficient player, but right now I'm just ok. I need to elevate my compete level and not be so passive. Being ok is not good enough, it won't satisfy me".
From Eller "I know I can be a very good, efficient player, but right now I'm just ok. I need to elevate my compete level and not be so passive. Being ok is not good enough, it won't satisfy me".
MXD
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- Oct 27, 2005
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First of all : Eller is sometimes grossly overrated here.
Second : This team could use some improvement in some spots. Namely, a stable Top-3 D playing right D, so Gonchar could slot on the 3rd pair, thus great improving two pairs. A top6 RW could be very handy as well. Improving the 3rd C has to be about the fourth-last priority for Bergevin. After upgrading Price, Subban and Pacioretty. Because, while there are definitely players who could be better than Eller in his spot (and role), its definitely not a must-upgrade situation.
But there is always this problem of the gap between the player Eller is (a middle-6 center), the player Eller thinks he is (a top-6 center) and the management/coaching perception of Eller (a 3rd liner). Granted, players should be playing in the lowest appropriate spot : playing guys as high as possible suggests lacks of depth. Hence, Eller is, IMO, perfectly fine on the 3rd line.
Now, expectations (talking strictly about output) has to be in line with spot/role. And Eller's output is perfectly fine in that regards.
And I suspect, if we don't add a veteran (read, non-homegrown), Eller will have another "hurdle" (or competitor) for a top-6 spot next season (taking for granted that Plekanec and DD/Galchenyuk are still here next season).
Second : This team could use some improvement in some spots. Namely, a stable Top-3 D playing right D, so Gonchar could slot on the 3rd pair, thus great improving two pairs. A top6 RW could be very handy as well. Improving the 3rd C has to be about the fourth-last priority for Bergevin. After upgrading Price, Subban and Pacioretty. Because, while there are definitely players who could be better than Eller in his spot (and role), its definitely not a must-upgrade situation.
But there is always this problem of the gap between the player Eller is (a middle-6 center), the player Eller thinks he is (a top-6 center) and the management/coaching perception of Eller (a 3rd liner). Granted, players should be playing in the lowest appropriate spot : playing guys as high as possible suggests lacks of depth. Hence, Eller is, IMO, perfectly fine on the 3rd line.
Now, expectations (talking strictly about output) has to be in line with spot/role. And Eller's output is perfectly fine in that regards.
And I suspect, if we don't add a veteran (read, non-homegrown), Eller will have another "hurdle" (or competitor) for a top-6 spot next season (taking for granted that Plekanec and DD/Galchenyuk are still here next season).
le_sean
Registered User
- Oct 21, 2006
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I think what we see is what we get with Eller. There's clearly a lack of hockey sense (at least consistently). He has the tools, but he just leaves you wanting more. He probably knows that JDLR is nipping at his heels in the AHL, with Gregoire not far behind in the Q.
I would not be opposed to upgrading another position with Eller as trade bait.
I would not be opposed to upgrading another position with Eller as trade bait.
I have no problem with Eller being where he is now but I would definitely have given him more of a shot on the power play. We can speculate all we want about him and the coach not seeing eye to eye, and I wouldn't blame Lars for thinking he hasn't gotten a proper chance. But as others pointed out, it's a two-way street. One has to give the opportunity, the other has to seize it.
As for the article, and all the garbage about the "French media" being this and that, I just want to point out that it's in no way a criticism of Eller's play. It only exists because Lars made a strong critique of his own play. Guys don't do that very often.
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