Lack of Structure in Blashill's System?

[Yzerman1919*]

I personally think we would do better with a new coach, vs. blaming the roster. I am NOT saying this is a good roster, because it isn't. That being said, we have young players like Larkin, Mantha, AA, Sproul I can add at this point, and maybe Mrazek. They are our future (unless we get a high draft pick). Surrounding guys like DDK, Green, Tatar, Nyquist, Abby, is NOT the worst supporting cast.

Here is my take:

Jeff Blashill has been successful at lower levels, where playing more "run and gun," or "Helter Skelter" hockey could be successful. At the NHL level, this has led to complete lack of structure, discipline, organized breakouts, and an organized forecheck.

I view Blashill's system as being a #1 priority is speed up the wing. Having guys like Nyquist, AA, Helm, Larkin, speed game isn't a bad idea. That speed isn't followed by pressure though. We get a lot of one and done shots, and back the other way. Blashill also believes in "activating defenseman" but without sustained pressure or one shot on net, it goes back the other way in odd man rushes.

The other thing I have noticed as his #1b priority is just to "get the puck out of the zone." I don't think I have ever seen a team flip the puck out more than we do at the NHL level. It is a combination of safe play, and hopes that our speedy winger can get to it to head up the ice. The issue here is that more often than not, it hands it back to the other teams d-men. They fire it right back in, and the vicious cycle begins. Combined with having a bottom 5-8 defense corps, you're going to have a bad time.

Blashill also seems to play his forecheck safe. Because he relies on speed up the wing we don't get a chance to forecheck as often. There is no organized break into the zone. IF, and I mean IF, we ever decide to dump it and forecheck, theres always one guy on the puck. He seems to want one guy in, one guy in front, and one in the middle. When you have wingers with the size and forechecking ability of Nyquist and Tatar, what are you actually getting? The answer is nothing. Knowing you have undersized high agility wingers, why not send more pressure in? Again, it goes back to playing safe.

I believe Babcock had us in the playoffs because he had structure to his game. We carried the puck out significantly more. We did not flip the puck. We had a better forecheck. Less speed? Yeah for sure. And I wanted Babcock to walk without a doubt. But he gave this team organization. He could take flaws and turn it into something positive.

A top 5-10 pick would do this team wonders. It's been WAY too long. The roster is mediocre at best, KH has failed to accumulate draft picks, he skips over NHL ready players for "projects" due to "upside," and he has not made an impact trade in almost a decade. He completely overpays in length and money for "home grown guys." Hockey is a business, and the goal is to win. He does not believe in this anymore. But, I truly believe we aren't a bad enough team to be performing how we are. "We did a lot of good things" isn't a good excuse anymore. This team needs a high draft pick, they need a good defenseman. But I personally think most of all we need some structure to this game. Blashill is ruining the DRW.

Thoughts? Should we fire Blash? Do you agree with my assessment on the system and safe play?

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[RedWingsfan55]

Nah it's Holland not blashill.

10 teams in the East got better, we got worse. That's not a recipe to making the playoffs when you're the 8th seed.

 

[Claypool]

It's unfair to compare a second-year coach to a coach with over a decade of NHL experience and had the luxury of coaching hall of fame players. Babcock also lost way more important games than he won. Anyway, If you fire Blashhill, who do you get? When things predictably go wrong next season, do you fire the new coach then? Do you just keep firing the coach every season after 20 games if things aren't going well?

I'd argue this team doesn't have the talent to play Blashill's system (which is probably the case for a lot of coaches). The fact that the defense can't make a simple outlet pass on a consistent basis means speed through the neutral zone isn't taken advantage of. They are constantly slow entering the offensive zone and have to dump and chase, go off sides, or turn the puck over.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Babcock's structure consisted of a younger and healthier Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Zetterberg.

 

[Reddwit]

I don't think its any coincidence that the worse Kronwall and Zetterberg get (and Datsyuk leaving), the worse the team gets. Its not like those goes were our star wingers or power forwards - they were our franchise centers, elite defensive centers, and our #1D.

I also don't think anyone thinks Blashill is knocking it out of the park, but I think he's done as well as can be expected from a coach.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Nah it's Holland not blashill.

10 teams in the East got better, we got worse. That's not a recipe to making the playoffs when you're the 8th seed.

Yep, pretty much. Holland will hopefully retire after next season so there's really no reason to fire this coach, hire a new one, and then stick the next GM with that coach. If you fire two coaches in a span of 2-3 years it makes the organization look completely unstable.

Let Blashill and Holland play out the string. Hopefully after next season you get a new GM and let him hire the next coach.

 

[Yzerman1919*]

It's unfair to compare a second-year coach to a coach with over a decade of NHL experience and had the luxury of coaching hall of fame players. Babcock also lost way more important games than he won. Anyway, If you fire Blashhill, who do you get? When things predictably go wrong next season, do you fire the new coach then? Do you just keep firing the coach every season after 20 games if things aren't going well?

I'd argue this team doesn't have the talent to play Blashill's system (which is probably the case for a lot of coaches). The fact that the defense can't make a simple outlet pass on a consistent basis means speed through the neutral zone isn't taken advantage of. They are constantly slow entering the offensive zone and have to dump and chase, go off sides, or turn the puck over.

I'm not "comparing" them or the roster they were dealt. I am comparing the thought process behind the system Blashill is using.

This post was not supposed to turn into a "Fire Kenny he sucks" thread, nor a Babcock thread.

I simply wanted to know if you guys felt the same way as me that Blashill's system is too minor league for the NHL and I think it is hurting us more than some seem to think, and thus creating a bad goal differential and the bad record

 

[chances14]

it's tough to say if it's blashill's system or if it's just how bad the roster has gotten

but didn't the wings end up top 10 in possession last season?

 

[jolly roger]

Yep, pretty much. Holland will hopefully retire after next season so there's really no reason to fire this coach, hire a new one, and then stick the next GM with that coach. If you fire two coaches in a span of 2-3 years it makes the organization look completely unstable.

Let Blashill and Holland play out the string. Hopefully after next season you get a new GM and let him hire the next coach.

Do it like the Penguins did.

Fire a lousy GM first, THEN the coach.

 

[odin1981]

Babcock's structure consisted of a younger and healthier Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Zetterberg.

Yeah too true. We have no one absolutely no one that have the skills they had at entering the zone. That is the main reason we cannot sustain any offense. Z is far too immobile now to break into the zone any longer.

The closest person we have to them is maybe Nyquist but that is like saying the star wars prequels are equal to the original trilogy : .

 

[obey86]

Yeah too true. We have no one absolutely no one that have the skills they had at entering the zone. That is the main reason we cannot sustain any offense. Z is far too immobile now to break into the zone any longer.

The closest person we have to them is maybe Nyquist but that is like saying the star wars prequels are equal to the original trilogy : .

Larkin, AA, Nyquist, Tatar, Green, and Smith are all very good at entering the zone.

 

[Wood Stick]

Blashill is a garbage coach, but the roster, specifically that D is terrible. We also have mostly second line forwards, some third. I'm not sure if we have a first liner on this team, well a great one at that.

Since Lidstrom retired, Kronwall has been our defense. He peaked as a top ten D shortly after, but has broken down the past few seasons.

Mike Green is playing great hockey. DeKeyser is worrisome right now as he's greatly struggling. Kronwall has been really bad. E and Marchy have been kind of stable, mostly E.

 

[odin1981]

Smith? Gtfo with that BS. Smith shouldn't even be in the ****ing nhl. Larkin has promise but is a boy playing against grown men and doesn't have the strength. Also unless he is with AA no one with skill can keep up with his pace. AA is more like Tatar in that he is a shooter he has at best average passing and vision for dishing it around.

Tatar is too narrow visioned to be a good breakout man and while he has a nice shot lacks the passing chops to dish it around once he enters. Green is never gonna get the green light to puck move it in given are sad state of defense plus he is like the only defender with a body healthy enough to "pass" to our "offense" to get the transition going.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

Like. We don't have a first line player and we don't have a top pairing defenseman. Why the surprise?

THIS BAD HOCKEY TEAM IS PLAYING BAD! HOW IS THIS HAPPENING!?

 

[Puddles]

Babcock's structure consisted of a younger and healthier Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Zetterberg.

Players make plays, not coaches

 

[obey86]

Smith? Gtfo with that BS. Smith shouldn't even be in the ****ing nhl. Larkin has promise but is a boy playing against grown men and doesn't have the strength. Also unless he is with AA no one with skill can keep up with his pace. AA is more like Tatar in that he is a shooter he has at best average passing and vision for dishing it around.

Tatar is too narrow visioned to be a good breakout man and while he has a nice shot lacks the passing chops to dish it around once he enters. Green is never gonna get the green light to puck move it in given are sad state of defense plus he is like the only defender with a body healthy enough to "pass" to our "offense" to get the transition going.

what are you talking about? we're talking about zone entries, not passing.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

The other thing I have noticed as his #1b priority is just to "get the puck out of the zone." I don't think I have ever seen a team flip the puck out more than we do at the NHL level. It is a combination of safe play, and hopes that our speedy winger can get to it to head up the ice. The issue here is that more often than not, it hands it back to the other teams d-men. They fire it right back in, and the vicious cycle begins. Combined with having a bottom 5-8 defense corps, you're going to have a bad time.

Sorry, but this has been a problem going back at least 5 years. Its a fundamental lack of talent on the blue line, and Babcock had them doing the exact same thing.

Add a prime Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall, Zetterberg and Datsyuk to this roster, and I bet you'd see similar results to what we got in their prime years. This current roster makes for a great supporting cast - its just lacking 5 elite players for them to support.

 

[odin1981]

what are you talking about? we're talking about zone entries, not passing.

It means nothing to break in if you can't do **** with it after or turn it over cause its a 1v2 or 1v3. That is why Z and D where so awesome with it. They had the vision and passing chops to do something with the puck after they got a entry. They also knew how to vary there entries with there speed to match up with there linemates so it was more of even #'s or a 3v2 or 4v3 situation on there entries.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Sorry, but this has been a problem going back at least 5 years. Its a fundamental lack of talent on the blue line, and Babcock had them doing the exact same thing.

Add a prime Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall, Zetterberg and Datsyuk to this roster, and I bet you'd see similar results to what we got in their prime years. This current roster makes for a great supporting cast - its just lacking 5 elite players for them to support.

Or elite coaching. A bad coach can make a Stanley Cup caliber roster look like trash. What do you think a bad coach does to a mediocre roster?

 

[aar000n]

It means nothing to break in if you can't do **** with it after or turn it over cause its a 1v2 or 1v3. That is why Z and D where so awesome with it. They had the vision and passing chops to do something with the puck after they got a entry. They also knew how to vary there entries with there speed to match up with there linemates so it was more of even #'s or a 3v2 or 4v3 situation on there entries.

Every player has regressed in blashill system. EVERY player. if it was one or two people but everyone. So many times the game just looks completely unorganized. The power play looks completely lost. The only question now is who do we replace him with.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Every player has regressed in blashill system. EVERY player. if it was one or two people but everyone. So many times the game just looks completely unorganized. The power play looks completely lost. The only question now is who do we replace him with.

Blashill isn't near the top of the list of problems for Detroit, but he's certainly not helping. Though that ultimately may be a good thing.

I think Babcock along with guys like Datsyuk and Zetterberg were able to partially disguise how bad the blueline is through team defense. Though I don't know that things would be better had Babcock stayed. I'm sure his message was getting old as he tried to get water from a stone for yet another season.

I was hoping Blashill would open up the offense again but it seems more like we got Babcock-lite. The silver lining may be that now it's painfully apparent that this team is a collection of mediocre talent at best.

 

[aar000n]

More Glendeing on the power play more top 6 min. lets put helm on the power play as well. Why not put miller in was well. We can go helm miller glendening. Hey lets put two right handed defenceman in so we cant pass for one timers from the point.

 

[Yzerman1919*]

Every player has regressed in blashill system. EVERY player. if it was one or two people but everyone. So many times the game just looks completely unorganized. The power play looks completely lost. The only question now is who do we replace him with.

This is exactly why I made this post. EVERY single player has regressed. We really aren't that far away talent wise than last year or the year before, considering Datsyuk's hobbled state. It's more than the roster, and I think it's an unorganized mess. Unorganized due from lack of skill sure. But unorganized because of the coach more so.

It's called adaptation.

 

[odin1981]

Every player has regressed in blashill system. EVERY player. if it was one or two people but everyone. So many times the game just looks completely unorganized. The power play looks completely lost. The only question now is who do we replace him with.

Who are the elite players that can put on the jacket so the complimentary players can grab unto there coat tails and live off of? Answer would be no one. Which is why everyone is looking worse.

We have no more elite talent any longer. The 1/2 that where are robbed by father time and the maybe 2-3 younger guys don't have the reps or completeness of being finished physical products to force there way into plays or scoring chances.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Who are the elite players that can put on the jacket so the complimentary players can grab unto there coat tails and live off of? Answer would be no one. Which is why everyone is looking worse.

We have no more elite talent any longer. The 1/2 that where are robbed by father time and the maybe 2-3 younger guys don't have the reps or completeness of being finished physical products to force there way into plays or scoring chances.

Look around the league at what kind of players that the elite guys carry. Patrick Eaves, Panik, etc. Garbage. This is not the type of players we are icing for the most part.

Guys like Tatar, Nyquist, Larkin even Abby, Helm etc are players that shouldn't be garbage just because they're not playing with an elite player. Sheahan shouldn't be scoring 0 goals because we lack elite guys, he should be doing better in a bottom 6 role against bottom 6 matchups. Our D will always struggle against top matchups but should do decent in terms of depth matchups.

The roster looks a whole lot worse than it actually is because the coach is unable to bring out the best in them. Just look at how much better Nielsen/Tatar/Nyquist/etc look when they play on the national team/team Europe. They're not awful players, they're good players in a terrible system that makes every shift a struggle.