Proposal: Kuemper to Avs

[Avalanche2133]

He turned 30 this year but is one of the elite goalies of the league the past 2 seasons. Francouz it turns out is not that good after showing some flash during the season. Grubauer only has 1 year left. Francouz has 2 I believe.

Friedman pushing the story all last week and this weekend that the Coyotes want to sell the vets for picks and prospects.

So what would a deal look like?

As a Colorado fan and with what Friedman is saying Arizona wants, I would offer our 1st straight up as well as their choice of Francouz or Grubauer. Kuemper has 2 years left on his deal.

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[Djp]

Raanta traded before Keumper is

 

[Cousin Eddie]

- Taylor Hall extended by AZ for 8 years (drops the AAV since Colorado can’t offer an 8th)
- Kuemper

for

- Grubauer
- Colorado’s 1st
- Compher/Donskoi

 

[Dr Quincy]

He turned 30 this year but is one of the elite goalies of the league the past 2 seasons. Francouz it turns out is not that good after showing some flash during the season. Grubauer only has 1 year left. Francouz has 2 I believe.

Friedman pushing the story all last week and this weekend that the Coyotes want to sell the vets for picks and prospects.

So what would a deal look like?

As a Colorado fan and with what Friedman is saying Arizona wants, I would offer our 1st straight up as well as their choice of Francouz or Grubauer. Kuemper has 2 years left on his deal.

I'd do that if I was ARI and pick Grubauer.

 

[Dr Quincy]

- Taylor Hall extended by AZ for 8 years (drops the AAV since Colorado can’t offer an 8th)
- Kuemper

for

- Grubauer
- Colorado’s 1st
- Compher/Donskoi

Please tell me that you are aware this is a ridiculously bad offer and that it was sarcastic or something.

 

[Muffin]

Please tell me that you are aware this is a ridiculously bad offer and that it was sarcastic or something.

I mean the Hall bit makes no difference for Arizona, he's not staying either way.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Please tell me that you are aware this is a ridiculously bad offer and that it was sarcastic or something.

Really? A 1st, Grubauer and JTC/Donskoi is a pretty good return for AZ. Especially when you look at their pick situation.

 

[Dr Quincy]

nevermind

 

[GermanSpitfire]

- Taylor Hall extended by AZ for 8 years (drops the AAV since Colorado can’t offer an 8th)
- Kuemper

for

- Grubauer
- Colorado’s 1st
- Compher/Donskoi

I heard Arizona was heading into a rebuild and will look to shed salary

 

[Cousin Eddie]

nevermind

I don’t understand. A few picks up you said you’d accept Grubauer + 1st for Kuemper if you’re AZ. Yet with Donskoi/Compher also being added it becomes “putrid”?

Im lost.

 

[Meeqs]

- Taylor Hall extended by AZ for 8 years (drops the AAV since Colorado can’t offer an 8th)
- Kuemper

for

- Grubauer
- Colorado’s 1st
- Compher/Donskoi

Why would the Avs even want to be adding on an extra year to Hall? Paying a premium for a 35-36 year sounds like a downside.

The Avs would probably prefer to sign Hall for as few years as possible with their current contract structure.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Why would the Avs even want to be adding on an extra year to Hall? Paying a premium for a 35-36 year sounds like a downside.

The Avs would probably prefer to sign Hall for as few years as possible with their current contract structure.

To lower AAV, just as I said in the post you quoted.

 

[Meeqs]

To lower AAV, just as I said in the post you quoted.

AAV is far less relevant to Col than term. No amount of realistic reduction would make the extra years worth it imo. Especially with how contracts are structured now aday's I'm not sure the extra year would change anything.

Also while I think there would be value in swapping Franc for Darcy, I think people overestimate how much of a gap there actually is between top goaltenders. Whatever the price would cost most likely wouldn't be worth it to swap Gru and Kuemper.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

AAV is far less relevant to Col than term. No amount of realistic reduction would make the extra years worth it imo.

Also while I think there would be value in swapping Franc for Darcy, I think people overestimate how much of a gap there actually is between top goaltenders. Whatever the price would cost most likely wouldn't be worth it to swap Gru and Kuemper.

I completely disagree. Colorado’s best window to win is these next 3 years (Mackinnon’s contract). I think their goal should be to build the best possible team for that window.

 

[John Johnson]

- Taylor Hall extended by AZ for 8 years (drops the AAV since Colorado can’t offer an 8th)
- Kuemper

for

- Grubauer
- Colorado’s 1st
- Compher/Donskoi

This would make more sense if it was UFA rights Taylor Hall and not signed to 8 year contract Taylor Hall.

 

[Meeqs]

I completely disagree. Colorado’s best window to win is these next 3 years (Mackinnon’s contract). I think their goal should be to build the best possible team for that window.

I would agree that the Avs have a significant advantage over the next 3 years, but their total window is much much longer than that, so while I understand different philosophies on this matter, considering years 3-X irrelevant is not a good thought process. Teams with a core as good as the Avs all go through many stylistic changes over the course of their championship window and I expect that to hold true with this Col team.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

This would make more sense if it was UFA rights Taylor Hall and not signed to 8 year contract Taylor Hall.

Why is that? The only Advantage to trading for Hall as opposed to just signing him as a UFA is the 8th year. Unless AZ is willing to sign and retain which they aren’t.

 

[rt]

I would trade Kuemper and Hall’s rights for Grubauer and Colorado’s 2020 1st rounder.

Kuemper is an absolutely elite goaltender. And he’s in his goalie prime years. He’s wasted in Arizona. The Coyotes need to rebuild quick, and get some picks.

Kuemper could be a huge part of getting Colorado their next Cup.

Grubauer is solid enough to help the Coyotes keep games close as the work to integrate young talent into the lineup.

The Avs are a team that would benefit more from elite goaltending than the Coyotes. Meanwhile, the Coyotes are a team that would benefit more from a late 1st round pick than the Avs.

This makes sense for both sides, I think.

 

[rt]

Why is that? The only Advantage to trading for Hall as opposed to just signing him as a UFA is the 8th year. Unless AZ is willing to sign and retain which they aren’t.

Sign and trades just don’t happen in the NHL. I’m not sure why they don’t happen but the just don’t. There’s no precedent for it, so I don’t view the concept as realistic.

 

[Ararana]

I think a basis of Grubauer + a 2020 1st should get the negotiations started. Arizona gets back into the first round and while it is a downgrade in net Grubauer isn't exactly a bad goaltender.

If Arizona wants to throw in Hall's negotiation rights, I wouldn't argue.

The Avs had two first rounders last year and will probably recoup some 2nd or 3rds when they trade Zadorov and Jost.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Sign and trades just don’t happen in the NHL. I’m not sure why they don’t happen but the just don’t. There’s no precedent for it, so I don’t view the concept as realistic.

Yeah I agree that it’s unlikely. Just think it’s a clever idea. It’s no harm for Arizona. They can simply pick up and extra asset or two by just handling the paperwork side of the Hall extension.

 

[John Johnson]

Why is that? The only Advantage to trading for Hall as opposed to just signing him as a UFA is the 8th year. Unless AZ is willing to sign and retain which they aren’t.

He's worth a lot more signed Imo. As a UFA he can still have his rights owned but still sign with any team he wants. Hall and Kuemper are basically AZs two best and highest value players right now besides maybe OEL.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

He's worth a lot more signed Imo. As a UFA he can still have his rights owned but still sign with any team he wants. Hall and Kuemper are basically AZs two best and highest value players right now besides maybe OEL.

Hall isn’t AZ’s most valuable asset lol. Any team’s given permission to talk to him now would be the same teams pursuing him when he actually becomes a free agent. What’s the most we’ve ever seen for players rights? A 5th? Hall probably doesn’t even net that since everyone knows he’s hitting the open market.

 

[John Johnson]

Hall isn’t AZ’s most valuable asset lol. Any team’s given permission to talk to him now would be the same teams pursuing him when he actually becomes a free agent. What’s the most we’ve ever seen for players rights? A 5th? Hall probably doesn’t even net that since everyone knows he’s hitting the open market.

Thats why Im saying a signed Hall is worth a lot more, and I dont think the original proposal is quite enough to land one of the best goalies and wingers in the league.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Thats why Im saying a signed Hall is worth a lot more, and I dont think the original proposal is quite enough to land one of the best goalies and wingers in the league.

I don’t think you understand. It’s not Arizona signing Hall long term and shopping him. It’s the acquiring team working out the contract details and agreement and AZ simply processes the paperwork. Even if it’s just for a 5th round pick that’s a no brainer for AZ since the alternative is getting absolutely nothing.