Line Combos: Kessel/Bozak/JVR approaching positive plus/minus status.

[dougieg93]

The last game, Montreal played their best defensive players against the Kadri line, is Phil's recent hot streak attributed to Phil playing against less quality defensive opposition?

 

[PuckMagi]

this line has been looking great recently!

 

[TheProspector]

The last game, Montreal played their best defensive players against the Kadri line, is Phil's recent hot streak attributed to Phil playing against less quality defensive opposition?

Having high end forward depth sure is useful, isn't it?

 

[ToneBone03]

It's great to finally see this line firing on all cylinders.

Also of note, Dion Phaneuf has also ascended the +/- ladder, from as low as -8 (I think?) up to a cool -1 as of now. Our best players are playing like it and it feels good, man!

 

[SpeakerForTheDead]

The last game, Montreal played their best defensive players against the Kadri line, is Phil's recent hot streak attributed to Phil playing against less quality defensive opposition?

The Plekanec line and Subban pairing play against the opposition's best line most nights and they were on against Kessel most of the night. The Markov and Desharnais lines were playing against Kadri.

 

[leafspring*]

The last game, Montreal played their best defensive players against the Kadri line, is Phil's recent hot streak attributed to Phil playing against less quality defensive opposition?

Yeah,but how much difference it will make when Lupul gets back should make for some nice line matching by Carlyle.He can dictate the game in so many different ways when the top 2 lines are available that it should cause opponents some serious headaches.

 

[thewave]

Yeah,but how much difference it will make when Lupul gets back should make for some nice line matching by Carlyle.He can dictate the game in so many different ways when the top 2 lines are available that it should cause opponents some serious headaches.

The Leafs could dictate with 3 lines if he wanted.

JVR Bozak Kessel
Mac Kadri Frat
Lupul Grab Kule

Or some variation and splitting ice time more evenly. 3 PPG guys on 3 different lines all of which are capable of making plays happen. If it doesn't work during a game load a line. This is a great team, it's why I was hoping for maybe a D upgrade and elite tender for a real push.

I am one of the only people who is saying that with the emergence of Kadri being so good we have a contender. Just hope Reimer stands tall and we could see conference finals.

 

[7even]

The last game, Montreal played their best defensive players against the Kadri line, is Phil's recent hot streak attributed to Phil playing against less quality defensive opposition?

Were they matching up their best defenders against Kadri last year, too?

 

[ErnieLeafs]

The idea that Kessel makes his decision based on Bozak being here is laughable. It's his career, and he's a big boy.

 

[The Blue Devil]

The idea that Kessel makes his decision based on Bozak being here is laughable. It's his career, and he's a big boy.

Are you sure? Could've sworn that I've seen a report on here that they even hold hands when crossing the street...

 

[AvroArrow]

He's heating up and scoring more, that helps his plus minus. But lately he's a lot better in his own zone. He actually back checks and plays defense, i like it. Good work by RC to get him playing D.

 

[The Apologist]

To your last point, sign someone like Staal and a cup will follow. They can run Bozak but he is pretty much welded to Kessel. He isn't a 5m asset though no matter what, it's like saying Kunitz is, although different position same sort of elevation by way of Kessel and JVR. 3.75m is Kunitz money and the most I would offer Bozak.

I agree, I wouldn't sign Bizak at 5, or Kessel at 10. Luckily, neither is getting that money.

 

[LadyLeaf]

It's really nice to see Kessel and the rest of the line step their entire game up. I'm excited to see what else they can do.

 

[notdoneyet]

I think plus/minus is the worse stat in the league.
An example from mtl game. Gunnarsson lost his man in the corner and mtl scored and the whole 5 guys are -1. Was it dions fault- no he has his man covered in front of the net, but he still gets the -1.
When the golaie(Price) lets in 3 soft ones everyone on the ice is minus on that shift.

Thats why I never have and never will like that stat.

Mark fraser(I love this guy) is plus 14 but he plays most of the time against the
third line of the opposing team. Most teams third liners are at most 10-15 goal scorers.

 

[Joey Hoser]

I think he's a really bad match for Kessel, actually.

Considering his limitations and how miscast he is on the top line, I think he's does an admirable job of making Kessel's line work in the absence of the #1 we should have. Kessel will score 30 goals and 70 points playing with a fire hydrant, but if Bozak wasn't winning faceoffs like he does, or helping dig the puck out of his own end so JVR/Lupul/Kessel can score off the rush, that line would be a big fat minus and we might not be a playoff team.

Yes, we need to replace him with a real #1 center, but I don't understand why this guy gets so much flak. He's a smart player who can help a team win.

 

[The Apologist]

Considering his limitations and how miscast he is on the top line, I think he's does an admirable job of making Kessel's line work in the absence of the #1 we should have. Kessel will score 30 goals and 70 points playing with a fire hydrant, but if Bozak wasn't winning faceoffs like he does, or helping dig the puck out of his own end so JVR/Lupul/Kessel can score off the rush, that line would be a big fat minus and we might not be a playoff team.

Yes, we need to replace him with a real #1 center, but I don't understand why this guy gets so much flak. He's a smart player who can help a team win.

We have a 1c, he plays on line 1b for us. Bozak is fine where he is.

 

[Rielly4]

Their problem lies with puck possession and play along the boards.

JVR needs to be better along the boards to make up for Kessel's deficiencies in that area, Bozak needs to be... somebody else. A centre that can control the play.

They're terrific off the rush though.

wrong... I dont know if you have been watching the games but they have been throwing the puck around the boards and up to the d men so well lately, that has been the key to there success besides there immense amount of 2 on 1s generated... They arent really holding it downlow too long because they cant but they are throwing it around the boards and up to the d men really well.

 

[Disgruntled Observer*]

As I've often stated, +/- is a very useful stat when used to compare players of the same team (because they have the same goaltending behind them, coach system, etc).

Kessel and Bozak are always near the bottom of the team.
They are close to being in the positive this year because the team is actually in the positive.
Nevertheless, Bozak and Kessel are sitting around 0, while other players on the team are as high as +13.

 

[Garbs]

wrong... I dont know if you have been watching the games but they have been throwing the puck around the boards and up to the d men so well lately, that has been the key to there success besides there immense amount of 2 on 1s generated... They arent really holding it downlow too long because they cant but they are throwing it around the boards and up to the d men really well.

........um

 

[Disgruntled Observer*]

I think plus/minus is the worse stat in the league.
An example from mtl game. Gunnarsson lost his man in the corner and mtl scored and the whole 5 guys are -1. Was it dions fault- no he has his man covered in front of the net, but he still gets the -1.
When the golaie(Price) lets in 3 soft ones everyone on the ice is minus on that shift.

Thats why I never have and never will like that stat.

Mark fraser(I love this guy) is plus 14 but he plays most of the time against the
third line of the opposing team. Most teams third liners are at most 10-15 goal scorers.

+/- only works on a long time line.

Sure, on one specific play/shift/game there can be fluke goals that aren't a players fault.
But over an entire season, if goals are going in your net WAY more often when you are on the ice than most other players on team... you can't really fall back on lame excuses.

As to your other example, 3rd pairing defensemen are supposed to matched up to 3rd line players.
1st pairing defensemen are supposed to be matched up to 1st line players.
So you can't make such excuses.

Fraser has been an excellent 3rd pairing defensemen as proven by the fact that he's played great against 3rd/4th line players.
Similarly, if a 1st pairing defensemen was terrible against 1st line players, than he would be a terrible 1st pairing defenseman.

 

[Leafidelity]

As I've often stated, +/- is a very useful stat when used to compare players of the same team (because they have the same goaltending behind them, coach system, etc).

Kessel and Bozak are always near the bottom of the team.
They are close to being in the positive this year because the team is actually in the positive.
Nevertheless, Bozak and Kessel are sitting around 0, while other players on the team are as high as +13.

You keep moving the goalposts. Kessel and Bozak aren't at the bottom of the team, they're in the middle of the group. You complained that they were out for more goals against than for, and suddenly that isn't good enough?

Wouldn't they previously be in the negatives because the team was in the negatives? You did say that's why they're now positive players right?

 

[Disgruntled Observer*]

You keep moving the goalposts. Kessel and Bozak aren't at the bottom of the team, they're in the middle of the group. You complained that they were out for more goals against than for, and suddenly that isn't good enough?

On a team that scores substantially more goals than they allow, the bare minimum of competence would be sitting at around 0. That's the bare minimum of competence.
Aren't we talking about a guy that's supposed to be our best player?
We're calling "the bare minimum of competence" successful now?

I've been 100% consistent in this argument.

+/- is useful to compare players to their team mates.
You're calling kessel "in the middle" a success... that's how low your expectations are.
Yet if his +/- drops even 1 point, he drops to being tied for 20th worse on the team. Our alleged best player. One goal against away from being 20th on the team.
Calling that a "success".
Unacceptably low expetcations.

 

[Hockeylaw]

It's great to finally see this line firing on all cylinders.

Also of note, Dion Phaneuf has also ascended the +/- ladder, from as low as -8 (I think?) up to a cool -1 as of now. Our best players are playing like it and it feels good, man!

Yeah, also worth nothing.

Phaneuf had a slow start to the season, perhaps because Carlyle forced him to log heavy minutes on a nightly basis for the first 11 games. But in his last 30, Phaneuf has 24 points and is +6 overall.

 

[BigWilly]

Kessel is an unreal talent!

The American Teemu!!!

If Boston offered us Seguin + Hamilton for Kessel i would tell them to F off!!!

Really? I'd take that in a heartbeat.

 

[Leafidelity]

On a team that scores substantially more goals than they allow, the bare minimum of competence would be sitting at around 0. That's the bare minimum of competence.
Aren't we talking about a guy that's supposed to be our best player?
We're calling "the bare minimum of competence" successful now?

I've been 100% consistent in this argument.

+/- is useful to compare players to their team mates.
You're calling kessel "in the middle" a success... that's how low your expectations are.
Yet if his +/- drops even 1 point, he drops to being tied for 20th worse on the team. Our alleged best player. One goal against away from being 20th on the team.
Calling that a "success".
Unacceptably low expetcations.

5th place team
Over PPG, leading all players on the Leafs, 12th NHL wide.

You are a caricature of your username.