Keep Calm and Cleary On... I can't believe this thread is still needed.

[ArGarBarGar]

Well, you don't have to be Nostradamus to figure this one out. Kronwall-Smith-DD-Ericsson are the core of our defence for the next 5 years. That leaves only 2 spots, assuming no trades or FA signings.

It also assumes that all 4 will be good enough to be bona fide NHL defencemen (and since Wings fans minimum standard for "NHL defencemen" prime Lidstrom, good luck with that).

It's why I'm all for packaging one or more of them for some top talent if and when it becomes available - they can't, and won't, all play.

I wouldn't necessarily put Smith in there. The guy hasn't really been treated like he is a part of the core, so I could see him being moved if Babcock continues to keep him off the powerplay.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

I have to believe Smith is gonna get PP time this season. He has shown that he is very capable of generating scoring opportunities or throwing the opposing defenses off their toes.

I always assumed Babcock wanted Smith to understand that being useful on the PP doesn't make up for poor ES play. It's gonna be a big season for Smith's development. I still think he can meet the expectations laid out by management before he was brought up.

 

[Bench]

I should have known when the Cleary thread was getting bumped constantly it was actually about Franzen.

 

[Vladdy84]

I should have known when the Cleary thread was getting bumped constantly it was actually about Franzen.

Pretty much most the threads we have going have the same three or four themes throughout.

 

[YostisHome]

Still this overreacting is so hilarious.

A) Cleary has not signed yet
B) Holland is MAYBE offering 2-way deal for him, that will force him to AHL
C) IF the offer will come, it will be a long way to accept that.
D) IF he will accept that, he would not neccessarily still see a single game in NHL.

Why is it even an issue? The guy is a complete liability and no longer can play. Let it go already....the fact that his name is even suggested as returning in any form or fashion is a true indictment of Kenneth Holland.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Why is it even an issue? The guy is a complete liability and no longer can play. Let it go already....the fact that his name is even suggested as returning in any form or fashion is a true indictment of Kenneth Holland.

Assuming Ken Holland is considering him in a Wings uniform, sure.

 

[AD1066]

Why is it even an issue? The guy is a complete liability and no longer can play. Let it go already....the fact that his name is even suggested as returning in any form or fashion is a true indictment of Kenneth Holland.

If he ends up mentoring some of the young guys in the AHL, it's not problem at all.

Without anything concrete at this point, there's nothing that would serve as an indictment of Holland.

(And I say that as someone who is not happy with Holland's performance these past few years)

 

[Henkka]

Why is it even an issue? The guy is a complete liability and no longer can play. Let it go already....the fact that his name is even suggested as returning in any form or fashion is a true indictment of Kenneth Holland.

What makes a difference between Cleary and some other AHL veteran they are gonna sign to mentor those kids at Griffins?

That ultimate hate makes people crazy and blind for realism in here.

 

[Frk It]

What makes a difference between Cleary and some other AHL veteran they are gonna sign to mentor those kids at Griffins?

That ultimate hate makes people crazy and blind for realism in here.

Babcock does not have a personal relationship with anyone else that is going to be in the AHL mentoring Griffins. So no one else has the looming possibility of getting called up while down there.

Huge difference. Unless there's not a bigger fan of Triston Grant and Jeff Hoggan than Babcock too

 

[aar000n]

Assuming Ken Holland is considering him in a Wings uniform, sure.

cleary has no place sporting a Toledo Walleye jersey.

 

[cjm502]

I just dont want Cleary going to the Griffs and all the kids thinking "all it takes to be an NHL player is to be a little better than this guy because he has been a career NHL player"

 

[YostisHome]

What makes a difference between Cleary and some other AHL veteran they are gonna sign to mentor those kids at Griffins?

That ultimate hate makes people crazy and blind for realism in here.

....and when he strings together a few decent games in GR coupled with the Big Club not being "heavy" for a night or two the plague will return.

 

[Outl4w]

I really hope they do not bring Dan Cleary anywhere near the NHL. If he wants to be an AHLER and help prepare kids for the pros that would be great, but he is no longer an NHLER PERIOD.

 

[Bench]

I just dont want Cleary going to the Griffs and all the kids thinking "all it takes to be an NHL player is to be a little better than this guy because he has been a career NHL player"

Cleary has 385 career points and 52 playoff points.

I know it's en vogue to slash Cleary's tires, but most of those kids are going to be lucky to sniff anywhere near that.

 

[Crymson]

What makes a difference between Cleary and some other AHL veteran they are gonna sign to mentor those kids at Griffins?

That ultimate hate makes people crazy and blind for realism in here.

I want him gone. Gone, gone, gone. He doesn't deserve to be hitting the ice for this organization, PERIOD. Even before his knee went south, he was terrible at everything that goes into playing hockey. He can't skate, can't shoot, can't pass, can't receive passes, can't keep his balance, and so on. His body is broken and he needs to accept that; more importantly, Ken Holland needs to accept that.

 

[AD1066]

I want him gone. Gone, gone, gone. He doesn't deserve to be hitting the ice for this organization, PERIOD. Even before his knee went south, he was terrible at everything that goes into playing hockey. He can't skate, can't shoot, can't pass, can't receive passes, can't keep his balance, and so on. His body is broken and he needs to accept that; more importantly, Ken Holland needs to accept that.

Yeah, like you said it's Holland that's primarily responsible for whatever happens going forward.

I can only imagine being in Cleary's shoes, how difficult it must be to walk away from a life's worth of work and an organization and city that you love, because your body gave out before your heart did.

It's frustrating to watch as a fan, and even cost us points in the standings last season, but I do feel for him in a way. I know he's a millionaire and all, but if he's not living under a rock, it's probably painful seeing many of your own fans turn against you.

That's why I hope he can end up in the AHL or front office if that's what he chooses to do. I think we owe him that much for the effort he's given us. And it certainly can't hurt our organizational reputation to make room for him in either capacity.

 

[Henkka]

I want him gone. Gone, gone, gone. He doesn't deserve to be hitting the ice for this organization, PERIOD. Even before his knee went south, he was terrible at everything that goes into playing hockey. He can't skate, can't shoot, can't pass, can't receive passes, can't keep his balance, and so on. His body is broken and he needs to accept that; more importantly, Ken Holland needs to accept that.

Naah, if you would have seen Jeff Hoggan in NHL for last three years, you would think the same about him.

Just get real, watch some AHL, and understand the difference between these two leagues.

If there's nothing wrong in Jeff Hoggan mentoring our kids, why would Cleary be a problem?

Our organization has praised this guy about his leadership abilities, and I think they know Cleary million times better as a person than anyone in here.

 

[Frk It]

Naah, if you would have seen Jeff Hoggan in NHL for last three years, you would think the same about him.

Just get real, watch some AHL, and understand the difference between these two leagues.

If there's nothing wrong in Jeff Hoggan mentoring our kids, why would Cleary be a problem?

Our organization has praised this guy about his leadership abilities, and I think they know Cleary million times better as a person than anyone in here.

You quoted the wrong person.

 

[Vladdy84]

"It's an opportunity to see what's out there. It's an opportunity to sell your program." -- Ken Holland

Holland said he'll resume talks with Cleary after July 1, after exploring the market and trade possibilities. The Red Wings are likely to fulfill the promise they made Cleary in September by signing him to an extension.

Doomed. Like someone jokingly said a couple days ago. Now that they re-signed Monster. Just gotta sign Cleary (And Quincey) and we're good to go!

 

[SoupNazi]

Time to move on, Holland.

Time to go, Cleary.

 

[Crymson]

It's unfathomable to me why Holland would make such an unprecedented agreement with a player who was not AT ALL vital to his team and was very obviously in decline. He effectively promised to sign Cleary to an extension regardless of how well he played. That was mind-bogglingly idiotic, almost unforgivably so.

If Holland intends to keep that promise, then he needs to do so in a way that accommodates what's best for the team. That means a two-way contract, it means requiring the guy to earn a roster spot without any bias, it means dumping him in the AHL from the start if he doesn't, and it means lining him up for an NHL call-up based purely on his merit in the AHL or lack thereof---not based on seniority. This is literally the only way in which re-signing this plainly undeserving individual will not have a deleterious impact upon the organization.

But goodness, gracious... why on Earth did he make such an patently stupid promise to a player? And why to Dan Cleary, of all people?

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Doomed. Like someone jokingly said a couple days ago. Now that they re-signed Monster. Just gotta sign Cleary (And Quincey) and we're good to go!

Link?

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Time to move on, Holland.

Time to go, Cleary.

Both Babs and Holland just need to let go of Cleary.

 

[Frk It]

It's unfathomable to me why Holland would make such an unprecedented agreement with a player who was not AT ALL vital to his team and was very obviously in decline. He effectively promised to sign Cleary to an extension regardless of how well he played. That was mind-bogglingly idiotic, almost unforgivably so.

If Holland intends to keep that promise, then he needs to do so in a way that accommodates what's best for the team. That means a two-way contract, it means requiring the guy to earn a roster spot without any bias, it means dumping him in the AHL from the start if he doesn't, and it means lining him up for an NHL call-up based purely on his merit in the AHL or lack thereof---not based on seniority. This is literally the only way in which re-signing this plainly undeserving individual will not have a deleterious impact upon the organization.

But goodness, gracious... why on Earth did he make such an patently stupid promise to a player? And why to Dan Cleary, of all people?

This organization can't do anything "without bias" when it comes to Dan Cleary. Literally nothing.

 

[detredWINgs]

It's unfathomable to me why Holland would make such an unprecedented agreement with a player who was not AT ALL vital to his team and was very obviously in decline. He effectively promised to sign Cleary to an extension regardless of how well he played. That was mind-bogglingly idiotic, almost unforgivably so.

If Holland intends to keep that promise, then he needs to do so in a way that accommodates what's best for the team. That means a two-way contract, it means requiring the guy to earn a roster spot without any bias, it means dumping him in the AHL from the start if he doesn't, and it means lining him up for an NHL call-up based purely on his merit in the AHL or lack thereof---not based on seniority. This is literally the only way in which re-signing this plainly undeserving individual will not have a deleterious impact upon the organization.

But goodness, gracious... why on Earth did he make such an patently stupid promise to a player? And why to Dan Cleary, of all people?

Let's back up a bit: Why does Holland even need to make this kind of promise in the first place? Is this greater evidence of how Holland negotiates generally with veterans? Was he so flustered by the fact that Cleary had a tryout offer from one other NHL team, he needed to add a pinky swear promise about re-upping Cleary in order to secure his return to the team?

I'm not really worried about what happens with Cleary next year, as I think the worst-case scenario is that he gets Maltby'd, but I am worried about how hard it is for Ken Holland to break ties with long-time players.