Proposal: Karlsson+ for picks (lots of ‘em)

[Martinez]

I’m reading these responses and gathering that I obviously thought Karlsson would have more perceived value here. Fair enough, I know, admittedly jack shit about the current outlook for the Wings (along with probably just being way over zealous on all the seconds)

However, I would bet (you can call me crazy), that if Karlsson at $8.5M gets some GM make a move, it’ll end up being something to the equivalent of two 1sts++. Again, who am I and exactly how much my opinion should count for is entirely in your hands to judge



Nah, it’s time for the Sharks to rebuild. They’ve been kicking the can down the road for far too long already and should have started this process a couple of years ago. Personally, I’m good with the Meier trade. I think there’s more than a betting man’s chance the Sharks can move Karlsson with retention for positive assets. But if they can’t I’m good with him sticking around - he really is a joy to watch and if we gotta be bad I’d at least like to be entertained.

I also think Couture and Hertl are around for the rebuild because I don’t think they have positive value with their contracts (maybe… maybe Hertl in a few years if he continues to play well, the cap goes up, and it isn’t such a commitment for the receiving team… maybe)

Vlasic will be a Shark until the end of that monstrosity of a contract

EK65 does have value but he simply doesn’t fit our timeline. Other teams, probably playoff teams would be the ones you should look to offer.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I’m reading these responses and gathering that I obviously thought Karlsson would have more perceived value here. Fair enough, I know, admittedly jack shit about the current outlook for the Wings (along with probably just being way over zealous on all the seconds)

However, I would bet (you can call me crazy), that if Karlsson at $8.5M gets some GM make a move, it’ll end up being something to the equivalent of two 1sts++. Again, who am I and exactly how much my opinion should count for is entirely in your hands to judge



Nah, it’s time for the Sharks to rebuild. They’ve been kicking the can down the road for far too long already and should have started this process a couple of years ago. Personally, I’m good with the Meier trade. I think there’s more than a betting man’s chance the Sharks can move Karlsson with retention for positive assets. But if they can’t I’m good with him sticking around - he really is a joy to watch and if we gotta be bad I’d at least like to be entertained.

I also think Couture and Hertl are around for the rebuild because I don’t think they have positive value with their contracts (maybe… maybe Hertl in a few years if he continues to play well, the cap goes up, and it isn’t such a commitment for the receiving team… maybe)

Vlasic will be a Shark until the end of that monstrosity of a contract

That’s the problem. You can’t offer your player, no matter how good, without understanding what the other team needs and expect a good response.

And if Karlsson wasn’t in the back half of his career with the multiple years where he showed how badly an injury will neuter him, maybe you’re right. But frankly, the book is out on Erik Karlsson at this point

 

[Fil Larkmanthanasiou]

First of all, Sharks fan here, visiting in peace. I think it’s pretty clear the Sharks are looking to rebuild (finally), would be more than open to finding a trading partner for Karlsson.

It also seems to me that the Wings might be on the cusp of competing, have some great young players, some prospects on the way, and also have accumulated some draft assets to use towards adding talent to their NHL roster.

Okay, preamble completed, here’s the proposal:


+ Erik Karlsson @8.5M x 4 ($3M retained)
+ choice of Barabanov/Kunin @2.5M x 1


+ 2023 1st (Detroit’s choice of the two)
+ 2024 1st (Sharks’ choice of the two)
+ 2x 2023 2nd (Detroit’s choices)
+ 2024 2nd

My thinking here is (and feel free to flame away):

Karlsson: adds a premiere RD to the Wings for the next 4 years. He’s good for 60-70pts as a baseline, elite PPQB, potential PPG+ seasons. It’s Karlsson you know the deal. The retention turns a painful contract into fair market value if not a little budget friendly if he’s really producing, like this year.

Barabanov/Kunin: Wings can choose between a smallish offensive oriented, puck possession, complimentary top 9 winger or a north/south gritty middle six winger, who plays a heavy game and is a good net front presence. If it was me, I’d go with Barabanov because I think he’s super-versatile in a top 9 offensive role, fits on the PP, and produces a lot of offense for his cap hit. But I’m not super familiar with the Wings’ needs in the middle of their forward group.

All in all, I’m sure it’d be painful to loose that many picks at the top of the draft, but Wings would still keep some of their high picks, keep all their prospects, and have plenty of cap space to add some free agent pickups (maybe adding Karlsson makes Detroit a more attractive destination for UFAs?)

The Wings just extended their tanking with the deals they made today. They should have tanked hard this year if that's what they ended up doing because the talent at the top this year's draft is much better than most. The Sharks will probably land a really good player in the draft. Because of age and cap hit, I wouldn't even trade Hronek straight for Karlsson. Karlsson achieves some of his production by cheating on D

 

[jMoneyBrah]

That’s the problem. You can’t offer your player, no matter how good, without understanding what the other team needs and expect a good response.

And if Karlsson wasn’t in the back half of his career with the multiple years where he showed how badly an injury will neuter him, maybe you’re right. But frankly, the book is out on Erik Karlsson at this point

Yeah totally. My, admitted incredibly uninformed, understanding was that the Wings were on the cusp of coming out of their rebuild and ready to start competing. But I’m gathering I had it wrong.

 

[kliq]

If he was 26, sure. At 32, no thank you. Id only take him if we were giving up practically nothing which wont happen.

 

[redwings8831]

No lol

 

[14ari13]

I doubt your GM would want to move him. He is one of the most entertaining players to watch in the whole league, in my opinion the most entertaining player. So while the team struggles the fans can at least enjoy watching the great EK.
I strongly doubt Yzerman thinks EK fits his plans. I also don't know where we can play him. The coach already struggles to find a partner for Chiarot.
I would definitely want Karlsson. He has been my favourite for 10+ years. I would definitely love and welcome the deal for Karlsson. Though I doubt you will get as much as you suggested in your post.
It depends also what Yzerman thinks of other teams in our conference, in which way we can beat them.
I definitely think we were and are a playoffs team. We were unlucky that we played either red hot or desperate teams and this put us back 3 to 8 points.

When I think maybe Washington would be the best partner for the trade. They have Ovechkin and adding Karlsson would be the biggest show value in the NHL. I would most certainly try to watch their games.

 

[MBH]

I’m reading these responses and gathering that I obviously thought Karlsson would have more perceived value here. Fair enough, I know, admittedly jack shit about the current outlook for the Wings (along with probably just being way over zealous on all the seconds)

However, I would bet (you can call me crazy), that if Karlsson at $8.5M gets some GM make a move, it’ll end up being something to the equivalent of two 1sts++. Again, who am I and exactly how much my opinion should count for is entirely in your hands to judge



Nah, it’s time for the Sharks to rebuild. They’ve been kicking the can down the road for far too long already and should have started this process a couple of years ago. Personally, I’m good with the Meier trade. I think there’s more than a betting man’s chance the Sharks can move Karlsson with retention for positive assets. But if they can’t I’m good with him sticking around - he really is a joy to watch and if we gotta be bad I’d at least like to be entertained.

I also think Couture and Hertl are around for the rebuild because I don’t think they have positive value with their contracts (maybe… maybe Hertl in a few years if he continues to play well, the cap goes up, and it isn’t such a commitment for the receiving team… maybe)

Vlasic will be a Shark until the end of that monstrosity of a contract

Think about it like this.
You had Meier, Hertl, Couture and Karlsson and sucked.
What the f*** are we supposed to do with Karlsson?

If the Sharks were really gonna eat $3M on that deal, they should find someone to take them. Just someone closer to contending.

 

[ThankGord]

Two firsts and three seconds is what Chychrun and Hronek got combined....

yer out to lunch bud

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Think about it like this.
You had Meier, Hertl, Couture and Karlsson and sucked.
What the f*** are we supposed to do with Karlsson?

If the Sharks were really gonna eat $3M on that deal, they should find someone to take them. Just someone closer to contending.

It's kind of amazing when you put it that way. Not just sucked, but they sucked on a historic level for that franchise. They're on pace for 23 wins which would be their third worst ever finish in a full season (their 93 season is pretty impossible to beat).

And they did it in spite of having Meier, Hertl, Couture, and the guy who will likely win the Norris this season.

 

[RedWingzz]

2 firsts and 3 seconds...?

uh..no thanks...?

 

[name]

I just wanted to say that OP has handled the feedback to this proposal really well.

If Ek was gonna go it would have been to a contender with salary retained. Detroit taking on EK would have been like Van taking on Hronik cubed; a serious WTF?!?

 

[SirloinUB]

First of all, Sharks fan here, visiting in peace. I think it’s pretty clear the Sharks are looking to rebuild (finally), would be more than open to finding a trading partner for Karlsson.

It also seems to me that the Wings might be on the cusp of competing, have some great young players, some prospects on the way, and also have accumulated some draft assets to use towards adding talent to their NHL roster.

Okay, preamble completed, here’s the proposal:


+ Erik Karlsson @8.5M x 4 ($3M retained)
+ choice of Barabanov/Kunin @2.5M x 1


+ 2023 1st (Detroit’s choice of the two)
+ 2024 1st (Sharks’ choice of the two)
+ 2x 2023 2nd (Detroit’s choices)
+ 2024 2nd

My thinking here is (and feel free to flame away):

Karlsson: adds a premiere RD to the Wings for the next 4 years. He’s good for 60-70pts as a baseline, elite PPQB, potential PPG+ seasons. It’s Karlsson you know the deal. The retention turns a painful contract into fair market value if not a little budget friendly if he’s really producing, like this year.

Barabanov/Kunin: Wings can choose between a smallish offensive oriented, puck possession, complimentary top 9 winger or a north/south gritty middle six winger, who plays a heavy game and is a good net front presence. If it was me, I’d go with Barabanov because I think he’s super-versatile in a top 9 offensive role, fits on the PP, and produces a lot of offense for his cap hit. But I’m not super familiar with the Wings’ needs in the middle of their forward group.

All in all, I’m sure it’d be painful to loose that many picks at the top of the draft, but Wings would still keep some of their high picks, keep all their prospects, and have plenty of cap space to add some free agent pickups (maybe adding Karlsson makes Detroit a more attractive destination for UFAs?)

I was pounding the drum to add Karlsson before the losses to Ottawa and actually think he fits better with the trajectory of the team than most wings fans. I truly want to add him and understand he is playing at an elite level.

That said, Yzerman selling off pieces, especially bertuzzi complicates things. There is just less upside on the roster at this point.

Ultimately This valuation kills my interest. I’m not paying a premium for Karlsson’s career year while he is turning 33 carrying an 11.5 million cap hit. I’m still interested but it appears we’re a long way apart on value.

 

[jMoneyBrah]

I just wanted to say that OP has handled the feedback to this proposal really well.

If Ek was gonna go it would have been to a contender with salary retained. Detroit taking on EK would have been like Van taking on Hronik cubed; a serious WTF?!?

Hey thanks for that. In retrospect I was WAY over the mark in judging his value (and more so in bringing it here, I think) I’ve enjoyed the creative ways y’all have shared your abject horror. Never change

 

[Gniwder]

When I think maybe Washington would be the best partner for the trade. They have Ovechkin and adding Karlsson would be the biggest show value in the NHL. I would most certainly try to watch their games.

They were sellers too at the deadline. They are not going to trade picks away. The only way I see a deal happening is if Mantha is part of the trade as a cap dump.

 

[lilidk]

SJ trade for EK to tank? But they did and no Red Wings turn, I don't think so

 

[StargateSG1]

He was probably trying to type "Draisatl", but Karlsson came out?

 

[Shaman464]

How about:

Zadina+ STL 7th

for

EK65 (50% retained) and SJ unprotected 2023 first.

 

[norrisnick]

How about:

Zadina+ STL 7th

for

EK65 (50% retained) and SJ unprotected 2023 first.

I wanna keep Zadina because he pisses a bunch of people off.

 

[Shaman464]

I wanna keep Zadina because he pisses a bunch of people off.

Okay then the Sharks retain 49%

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Yeah, no thanks.

 

[RabidBadger]

Yeah, for that package of assets I'm thinking a legit mid-20s center. Like Draisaitl or Matthews if the Oil/Leafs playoff runs turn sideways. Pettersson if Vancouver decides to rebuild. Etc...

Petterson might be the best bet if Vancouver comes to terms with the error of their ways. "Uh, you know that 1st we traded you? We have something to offer to get it back".

 

[14ari13]

I was pounding the drum to add Karlsson before the losses to Ottawa and actually think he fits better with the trajectory of the team than most wings fans. I truly want to add him and understand he is playing at an elite level.

That said, Yzerman selling off pieces, especially bertuzzi complicates things. There is just less upside on the roster at this point.

Ultimately This valuation kills my interest. I’m not paying a premium for Karlsson’s career year while he is turning 33 carrying an 11.5 million cap hit. I’m still interested but it appears we’re a long way apart on value.

So I am not the only one who would take Karlsson. Interesting stats about him, he is a minus player in regular season games with -84, but a plus player in the playoffs games.
I doubt Yzerman can fit him in even if the sharks give him for free.

They were sellers too at the deadline. They are not going to trade picks away. The only way I see a deal happening is if Mantha is part of the trade as a cap dump.

They can forget playoffs and the rebuild has to be put on hold for awhile. The great Alexander Ovechkin has scored 815, so the season 24/25 is huge in history of NHL. The whole hockey world will follow his games. At some point he should break Gretzky's record.
I don't know if any team can add Karlsson. Some posters mentioned that Karlsson has to go a contender or a playoffs team. But how does that team add 11,5 M to their salary cap?


Disclaimer.
I didn't check the cap structure of the Washington capitals or any other team. I didn't do so as I don't see any purpose as it is more or less impossible to move Karlsson.

Maybe Chiarot and our 1st ( NYI's) for Karlsson.