This should clearly be Toews
Eric Staal has a 6th and 7th point finish. With no top 10 selke finishes, and a 4th place hart finish. Where he received no first or second place votes.
Selke: 16, 31, 39, 40, 43, 54, 66
Hart: 17, 23
In comparison,
Toews
Selke: 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 4, 5, 6, 16, 17
Hart: 4, 4, 6, 9, 10.
Eric Staal has nothing over him besides perhaps aging better, and in the same age was producing in the 58-68 point range without the elite defense, so even that's arguable.
There's nothing similar about their offensive production. Staal has as many 100 point seasons as Toews has 70 point seasons. Staal also has more 40 goal seasons as Toews has 30 goal seasons. If you're actually judging individual performance, they're not even close.Similar offensive production through out their careers, but toews has been better defensively.
Staal has played with worse teammates though and he is older. Making his offence quite a bit better than Toews'
Expecting the not so big gap in scoring right now to become wider as toews gets older and Staal looks reborn after joining the wild.
There's nothing similar about their offensive production. Staal has as many 100 point seasons as Toews has 70 point seasons. Staal also has more 40 goal seasons as Toews has 30 goal seasons. If you're actually judging individual performance, they're not even close.
This should clearly be Toews
Eric Staal has a 6th and 7th point finish. With no top 10 selke finishes, and a 4th place hart finish. Where he received no first or second place votes.
Selke: 16, 31, 39, 40, 43, 54, 66
Hart: 17, 23
In comparison,
Toews
Selke: 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 4, 5, 6, 16, 17
Hart: 4, 4, 6, 9, 10.
Eric Staal has nothing over him besides perhaps aging better, and in the same age was producing in the 58-68 point range without the elite defense, so even that's arguable.
Staal has also played 300 more games than Toews. You think Toews still has those numbers 300 games from now?. Eric Staal | Jonathan Toews
G/Game 0.36 0.37
A/Game 0.48 0.48
P/Game 0.84 0.85
Sure, Staal's peak was higher offensively, but he then fell of the face of the earth and now has climbed back with the wild.
Meanwhile Toews' production has stayed around 60 points for a long time.
Career wise their production has been the same.
Staal has also played 300 more games than Toews. You think Toews still has those numbers 300 games from now?
You're right. I got caught up in all the other posts that were talking up Toews. I should've paid closer attention.No **** read my first comment again
Toews finished 4th in the Hart race once and his one Selke, Bergeron had more first place votes. And the years he finished 9th and 10th in the Hart race, he didn’t have any first place votes and only 3 second place between the two. If your going to criticize, do it for both players equally.This should clearly be Toews
Eric Staal has a 6th and 7th point finish. With no top 10 selke finishes, and a 4th place hart finish. Where he received no first or second place votes.
Selke: 16, 31, 39, 40, 43, 54, 66
Hart: 17, 23
In comparison,
Toews
Selke: 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 4, 5, 6, 16, 17
Hart: 4, 4, 6, 9, 10.
Eric Staal has nothing over him besides perhaps aging better, and in the same age was producing in the 58-68 point range without the elite defense, so even that's arguable.
Totally wrong. Eric Staal is a better offensive player during their prime. He has the numbers to prove it.
Toews finished 4th in the Hart race once and his one Selke, Bergeron had more first place votes. And the years he finished 9th and 10th in the Hart race, he didn’t have any first place votes and only 3 second place between the two. If your going to criticize, do it for both players equally.
Also your logic makes no sense. Your agenda is clearly saying that Toews Selke voting is more prestigious than Staals offense. That’s an opinion, not fact.
It is interesting considering that Staals drop in production was so severe. Sure Toews has dropped, but not as significant. But I feel in their primes, And before 2014, Staal was better offensively. But Toews was able to maintain some consistency for sure. But this past year should be taken into account. I mean we can’t ignore 42 goals and 76 points, I mean he matched Toews career totals while being a significantly better goal scorer, I think the bigger question is, will he maintain this level of play or something close to it.Yeah, somehow I forgot to include the fact that Eric Staal is clearly better offensively.
Atm Toews has a higher PPG, but Staal has played 300 more games. So here are how their stats compare at the same age Toews is now. By doing this we remove Eric Staal's comeback seasons this year and last year, but I think it's compensated by the exclusion of his worst offensive season in 2015-16 where he had 36 points in 82 games, as well as playing in a higher scoring era in the mid 2000s.
Staal
769 games played, 289 goals, 399 assists and 688 points. An average of 73 points, 31 goals in 82 games
Jonathan Toews
791 games played, 292 goals, 382 assists and 674 points. An average of 69 points in 82 games.
I don't think the offensive gap outweighs the defensive gap. Staal has outscored Toews in most seasons, usually by a 5-10 point lead, but the only occasions in which he did so by more than 15 points were last year and Toews rookie season.
It is interesting considering that Staals drop in production was so severe. Sure Toews has dropped, but not as significant. But I feel in their primes, And before 2014, Staal was better offensively. But Toews was able to maintain some consistency for sure. But this past year should be taken into account. I mean we can’t ignore 42 goals and 76 points, I mean he matched Toews career totals while being a significantly better goal scorer, I think the bigger question is, will he maintain this level of play or something close to it.
This all comes down to offense vs defense in general. Toews has clearly had the better career, but player to player, all depends on your preference. Is there production close in a general aspect? Yes, but before 2014, at any given year...you could count of Staal to be at, at least 70 points and close to a PPG.
This one ends up being super close. But based on Staal's comeback and Toews not showing signs of comingback to being a high 60s selke contender I give it to Staal.
im not saying he cant, just that I take staal until he doesWait so you’re not willing to give Toews a chance to comeback even though he played at a 66-point pace just the season before last (which is 3 points off his career average btw), even though Staal just proved that you can bounce back from some down seasons after having his 3rd-highest scoring season in the league ever? Nobody expected Staal to do what he just did, so why can’t Toews?